Sunday , November 18 2018
Home / Perspective / Hope From Pretoria

Hope From Pretoria

In a culture that is not strong on expressing gratitude the word “yeqenyeley” has evolved to mean, “Thank you,” but its initial use seems to be more selfish and self-serving. It is simply used to express a wish of re-using an item again and again. The more accurate, refined and noble word “temesgen” is used almost exclusively for expressing gratitude to God. Interestingly the word “temesgen” lacks personal intimacy indicating the God of the Tewahdos, “Our Father who art in heaven…” is indeed not that personal. But who wants to go theological today; I just want to say “yeqenyeley” to my friends in Pretoria, South Africa who afforded us a great opportunity to focus on what is important. The workshop was, for sure, a feast of intellect; a bonfire of ideas that sparked a renewed zeal for a broad-based solidarity movement that is hoped to catapult the-movement-for-democratic-change to victory. Don’t get carried away; it is just a workshop, but not just any workshop, there was something special about it. Perhaps it had to do with the spirit of Mandela; the spirit of Truth and Reconciliation. I guess it is one of those where one has to be there to know it; but one cannot help but hope that those who have been baptized will go on mobilizing the Eritrean people to stand up for justice and democracy.

But more on the workshop and my trip to Pretoria later; let me start with a story that was told by one of our gracious hosts, Asmerom Tewelde, who in our last day drove Semere Kesete, Abdurahman Seyed and me to the majestic Voortrekker Monument that celebrates the pioneer history of the Afrikaner. From the top floor of this great landmark, we were able to get a panoramic view of the scenic Pretoria; and if you are a history buff like me there is plenty of stuff to gobble.

Brother Asmerom is of medium height, of lighter complexion with a linguistic prowess aptly beautified with a sense of humor. Occasionally I pride myself with an encyclopedic knowledge of Tigrinya proverbs, but in a few short minutes, he succeeded in proving me wrong. I am not that great to be humbled, but it was the right pinch that awakened my thirst for Tigrinya wisdom. Listening to him is exactly what I did; concerned I might fit the description in his proverb, “wedi sebeyti’s zereba ykhtr imber aykhteln.” (Try translating that into English!) When I learned he will be studying law, I told him that he should be doing comedy or acting, and as a matter of fact he had a small role in the movie Beyond Borders that starred Angelina Jolie and Clive Own. He was, for the most part, the Tigrinya coach for the Namibian actors. Check him out, he is the one sitting on top of the truck and spoke in unmistakably Eritrean accent. The movie is available on Netflix.

Inda inqrbit Temen (House of scorpion and snakes)

The earthly possession of a couple included a cow, a sheep and a chicken. After some time of married life, the woman fell out of love and was scheming to get rid of her husband so she can have it all. She would put poison in the places she knew her husband will not miss; but the house-mouse will get there in time and remove it. This went on for some time and finally out of desperation, she asked her husband to buy her a mouse-trap. The mouse heard the conversation. She approached the cow, sheep and chicken and asked for their help; and all of them told her to get lost.

The unsuspecting husband bought the mouse-trap on his way from work and as they settled for the night, the wife put the trap in one of the places where she previously had the poison. Shortly after, she heard the click sound of the mouse trap and eagerly went to savor her victory. She was so confident of her prize that she didn’t bother to verify if she had the right victim. She stretched her arm to pick up the mouse-trap and was bitten by a snake which was struggling to get out. She ran away screaming and fell on the ground, quickly losing consciousness and the husband rushed her to the hospital. She received the necessary medical treatments and was asked to stay overnight for further monitoring. The next day the doctor recommended that she gets lots of chicken soup to regain her health and strength. The husband had to slaughter his only chicken and when that did not make her get better, he had to do the same with the sheep. Unfortunately, all the chicken and sheep soup did not help her to recoup her health, and finally she succumbed fighting her last breath. The husband slaughtered his only remaining possession, the cow, for her tezkar, 40 days memorial; and was left flat broke.

The husband was left alone in the house without his prized possessions. He could not stand his loneliness, deprivation and sorrow and had to move out. There was no one to care for the house that it became a haven for scorpions and snakes –inda inqrbit temen.
It is in recognition of the fact that Eritrea has become inda inqrbit temen that Eritreans from different parts of Africa, Australia, Europe and North America, as individuals and representatives of civil organizations, met on May 9-11, 2014, in Pretoria, South Africa, to discuss issues of national importance at a workshop organized by EMDHR under the theme: “Strategic Thinking on Political and Socioeconomic Crises in Eritrea: Implications, Scenarios and Responses.” The workshop was divided into four thematic categories: The Rule of Law and Constitutionalism, Socio-economic and Humanitarian Crisis, The Road to Democracy, and Transitional Justice and Peace Building. I presented a paper on the Road to Democracy and since EMDHR have not stated what they intend to do with participants’ papers; I will not be able to share it with you, at least for now.

But in the beginning was the long trip to Pretoria; an almost 16 hour non-stop flight from Atlanta. The flight from Dallas to Atlanta was short and engrossed that I was with the companion I was reading, I was surprised to notice the plane slowing down on the tarmac. This is the only time I agreed with Delta’s slogan, “You’ll love the way we fly.” Next-time, I take long trips, it better be first class; otherwise staying home or driving is the only option for me. In the last few months I put more than 6000 miles driving to East and West coasts, and experiencing Woody Guthrie’s folk song, “This land is your land, this land is my land, from California to New York Island, from the Redwood Forest to the Gulf Stream waters, and this land was made for you and me.” I found it to be a total bliss. After more than 24 years of studying, living, working and visiting in about 40 states, I’m still spellbound by the beauty of America and its endless possibilities. The beauty of its landscape, topography and vastness is only matched by the beauty of its ideas, and most of all by the crown-jewel of ideas: freedom. Having experienced it first hand, it is only natural that I wish it to the land of my ancestors and to the people I share a natural bond with. This idea is that inspires my political thinking and that animates my activism.

A prior arrangement was made where Dr. Bereket and I will meet in Atlanta. Having arrived about 40 minutes earlier I had the opportunity to charge my cellphone and continue conversing with my companion about the importance of literature and why we should care. Time quickly lapsed and as I hurried towards the escalade I saw the 80 plus year young Dr. Bereket swaggering past me. I said, “Hi, ami adictur” and he glanced towards me and responded, “selamat ya ibni,” and we exchanged hugs. We had a couple of hours to spare and as soon as we reached our terminal, we found a nice place where the good doctor had a glass of wine and the wimpish me a cappuccino. Any time with ami aldictur is time well spent. Most people know Dr. Bereket for his impressive resume, but I know him as a caring friend, mentor, and advisor, confidante who has grown to fill the roles of an uncle and father altogether for me. During our long flight, Dr. Bereket sat in the seat behind me, and at least once, he came to advise me to get up off my seat every two hours and move around. After finishing talking with my companion, I watched the movie Lone Survivor.

When our plane landed in Pretoria and were passing through customs, we saw Fozzia Hassan who hurriedly came to greet us. I’ve neither spoken nor seen her for the last few years since I resigned from my EGS chairmanship; she was a member of the board. She is a single-mom raising two kids and I could easily appreciate her commitment to the cause of freedom. This was a workshop where everyone had to cover his/her own travel expenses. During the course of our stay in Pretoria, I was struck by how much she has matured and by her grasp of issues. Her colleague from London, Biniam Debessay, was an equal delight to see him talk; his passion for defending the liberation struggle is only matched by his intense desire to see a democratic Eritrea that he bravely fought for as a member of the EPLF mechanized unit. He is pursuing a degree in Political Science and his thesis is on Soft Power. (Way to go bud; can’t wait to see more and bigger things from you and thanks for teaching me a new Tigrinya word!)

The tall, handsome, Hollywood like persona, Henok Haile was the one who drove us to our hotel from the airport in his 7 seat passenger SUV. I learned a lot about the generals and other military personnel, and how the system has emasculated them, life in military service, and the warsay-ykealo project from him. But most of all, I appreciated his insights about EMDHR and the opposition. He has an uncanny ability to simplify issues.

We had to wait for a few more minutes for Solomon Assefaw, from California, who had arrived a bit earlier, and took a taxi instead. Solomon and I have spoken over the phone once or twice in the past, and based on what I have read online and the many rumors I heard, I didn’t expect a jolly-good-fellow who I would instantly like and celebrate. If you like the Asmarino lingo and humor, he is the man. He strikes me as someone who is more comfortable with action than with words and his no-none-sense approach is quite refreshing. Solo is very caring and generous with a personality that is hard not to like. Put some red costume and a white beard on him, he would make a great Santa.

After showering up, we went next-door to a restaurant (actually few blocks away) where our hosts and other quests were waiting for us. We met with the indefatigable Human Rights advocate, Elsa Cherum, the talented and affable Abdurahman Seyed whom I had met in the Netherlands about 12 years ago, the tough and strong-willed Semere Kessete, Binian Debessay I had mentioned earlier, and the extraordinary AAW—Ambassador Andebehan Woldegirogish or simply Andy, a term that reminded him of his old school days. We also learned that Dr. Assefaw Tekeste was not able to join us for the conference. It is also here that we met most of the leadership of EMDHR: Kuluberhan, the chairman, Dr. Adane, the Treasurer Abdelwas’I, Tesfalem and others their names escapes me. It was a group of people that I immediately felt at home with.

It was after breakfast the next morning that I met Abdurazaq Kerar from Australia. I had met him before in Geneva, alongside Yassin, Elsa Cherum and Amaha Domenico, during the UPR sessions where all of us, except Elsa, came representing the Awate Foundation. Abdurazaq had translated two documents into Arabic at my request before and it was basically a reunion of old friends. It is here that I met the many people that make EMDHR. I’m not going to list their names for fear of leaving out some. But, it is really nice to meet with people of different background like the botanist Dr. Michael Bairu or the civil engineering Ph.D. candidate whose name escapes me, who seem, due to their scientific training, look at things logically and more clearly. I particularly enjoyed Meron’s Elite Theory presentation.

The opening remarks were given by the leaders of EMDHR: Kulubrehan, Dr. Adane and Tesfalem. Dr. Adane is an expert in peace building with an extensive experience in the region which proved to be an important asset in our deliberations. It looks like Adane’s and my path have crossed when we were kids in Mendefera. I’m sure the temperament and equanimity of Kulubrehan had a lot to do with the success of the organization that was led since its establishment by my friend, Samuel Bizen. I’ve always equated EMDHR with Samuel for he is the one who introduced me to it. Listening to his speech on the last day proved me that I was right. After so many emails, chats and phone-calls, it was really a treat to meet Samuel and I hope to see him soon, hopefully in Asmera.

A former minister who is a member of ANC leadership was invited to share his experience in the long struggle against apartheid as well as in the democratically elected government. I was struck by two things he said: the propensity of small countries to hatch endless number of organizations and how difficult it is to try reconciling organizations that don’t have ideological differences. The ANC was able to overcome the challenges because it was the by far the strongest and most influential organization that wisely and in a spirit of magnanimity reached out to the smaller ones and included them in the process. He exhorted that we should never enter into negotiations if we are not ready to make compromises.

The candidness with which the deliberations were conducted was a milestone. The spirit of camaraderie and solidarity was evident in the way people eagerly embraced each other. But most of all, there was an enthusiasm to be part of the solution; and expedite the end of tyranny. It looks the muddy waters are finally settling down where people can see the urgent and the important, the important but not the so urgent, the manageable and the unavoidable, and the avoidable and the unmanageable.

weriz@yahoo.com

About Semere T Habtemariam

Check Also

Review: Herui Tedla Bairu’s Book

Title: Eritrea and Ethiopia: A front row look at issues of conflict and the potential …

  • T. Kifle

    Dear Saleh Y.

    1. I am at a loss that the stature of Saleh Y.would miss about what the “Tigrrean perspective” of the late PM’s explanation to PH or anybody else for that matter was meant to be. TPLF is unmistakably a national party that fights for the interest of Tigray. Does the interest of Tigray in any way contradict with the interest of Ethiopia? What is that Tigray wants or needs that Ethiopia is not willing to accept or offer? In a democratic Ethiopia the answer is this: No inherent contradiction exists between the two. Tigary demands self rule. Tigray wants to be equitably represented at the center. Tigray wants to contribute in national building process which is inclusive to all kinds of diversities (langue, culture, religion, gender etc). When the demands are genuine and constitutionally established and proper mechanisms are in place to address these demands, there is no way Tigray and Ethiopia could contradict each other. Granted, Ethiopia is not a sum total of the individual federal states. It’s more than that because over the years a stratified supra identity of Ethiopianism has been built no matter its intensity (as to me it’s as intense as it can get) which Tigray has contributed a lot for its creation. What would be an omen of disaster is if Tigray pushes to benefit itself at the cost of the remaining federal states. Ethiopia’s fiscal allocation is one pristine and transparent. It gives no room for manipulation and maneuver. It should be understood that there is a Tigrean perspective of Ethiopia. Working for the interest of Tigray also means working for Ethiopia from the Tigrean perspective which is more or less in par with the current political order in the country.

    2. Border. You made it a Tigray-Eritrea issue. You are right but that’s not the only explanation. To start with there is
    nothing wrong if the constituency influences the decision making of a government. Governments should weigh the
    pros and cons of the mood on the ground and this particular issue is not an exception. But the issue of Badme is more than that. It has wider implications where Bade symbolizes a victim-hood of unjust war which claimed prohibitive
    human and material costs. It symbolizes the blunder of the Eritrean tyrant stabbing a country that helped him in many ways (against the mood of many Ethiopia nationalists) in the back. This is the main impediment to its implementation than the anger that might come from the ground.

    3. The Eritrean mindset: This without doubt must change if any meaningful relationship is to be made though not in the way you tried to make it appear. Eritrean nationalism should be inward looking. Ethiopia had paid a price for building its nationalism from an external perspective. It used to export its myriad problems to various conspiracy theories and powers with regional interests. External variables are always there. It’s good to be vigilant over the move of all these powers 24/7. But what determines the fate of a nation is its inherent strength and cohesion. PFDJ framed its policies by fundamentally factoring in Ethiopia, a variable they cannot control but they thought they would. When they felt that it was about to go out of their control they declared war to bring it back to their fold. That was not a sudden cook that comes to their mind. That cannot be explained by anything else except by the long held strand of entitlement of Eritrean over Ethiopia. Use Ethiopia; hate Ethiopia. That’s why Eritrean is still insatiable when they write and write about backward Ethiopia. The other claims you made (the recourses and all) are wrong. EPRDF sees Eritrea endowed with all kind of
    resources like any next guy. In fact the ports would have been enough to propel Eritrea to unprecedented heights given there is a responsible government in place.

    4. Eritrean opposition parties. You may be right on this issue or it could be a perception. EPRDF doesn’t believe in one-fits-all theory. If the weakness of the position working from Addis is attributed to the heavy-handedness e of the Ethiopian government why not the others who are opposed to that move get strengthened? I think you are conveniently
    externalizing the problems prevailing among the Eritrean opposition. The problem I guess is connected partly to (3) above. Eritreans are not reached a concession on what is needed to be done to bring their nation from where it is today. YG has an explanation for that, I guess. What was that he said about this? Something to this effect: “If Eritreans where divided then (before launching the armed struggle), they are even more divided now”. Yes, trying to find the faultiness of your opposition in the Federal system of Ethiopia is like fishing in trouble waters. Eritrean problems are older than our Federalism.

    Wedehanka

    TK

    • Saleh Johar

      T. Kifle, the last time you left in the middle of a session me and you started. This time I will try to comment on your #4. Blaming the Ethiopian treatment is not an excuse for our own weaknesses. Not at all. But some Ethiopian officials taking advantage of our weakness to impose their policies on the Eritrean opposition is not something I expect from leaders who went through difficult time like what we are going through now.

      I recognize that Ethiopia doesn’t owe the Eritrean opposition anything. But geography and history has influences our attitudes, both of us will always depend on each other–peace or war.

      I don’t know about others, but my beef with Ethiopian leaders is not the type that you make it appear.

      For someone struggling to end a tyranny in his home, it is painful when any entity, that is supposed to be an ally, tries to take advantage of his weakness. Eritreans reject the PFDJ because it wants to boss us around, unelected; we shouldn’t be expected to be bossed around, made to feel humiliated and helpless, because we are not helpless. This is just a hiccup, a major hiccup that we will overcome. If we are concerned about the future, then we need to check our attitudes and mutual relations and handle them with respect.

      • T. Kifle

        Dear Saleh G,

        I agree with almost all you said.I also personally don’t believe in influencing the means of the struggle. It should be by Eritreans and for Eritreans. What Ethiopia should demand in return from Eritrea, I think, is good neighbourliness: Harmless Eritrea that wouldn’t be a launching pad for regional conspiracies. How would the opposition convince and guarantee Ethiopians that Eritrea remain good for their country? I know that wouldn’t be easy. Is Ethiopia demanding them to apply federalism as Sal has insinuated? Why is that many of your opposition still show anti-Ethiopia posturing accuse and vilify those in Ethiopia as agents(I know you don’t buy that) almost in the same manner PFDJ is known to? The problem, as I see it, things boil down to the other fundamental problem where Sal(the mighty) and me (the ሬጣጥ) are locking horns for some time now. So discuss it in appropriate platforms. make clear your intentions and try to influence both sides in more organized way without let up. I don’t think there is any other way than discussion, discussion and discussion.

  • SM

    KAB behaliu’s degami’u.
    U R deliberately twisting things here.Your comment should be forwarded to your T Kifle.
    Mahmould Saleh is only clarifying and responding.to your “Tsemam Hade derfu” brother T Kifle.
    Read Mahmoud Salih carefully all along.
    After all,why are your T Kifle et al here?Can U guys go to your Tigray online and leave us alone.?
    We are here to debate about our solutions to our problems and if possiblr,to debate about peaceful co’existence. But T Kifle et al seem to be here to create confusion and chaos. ..

  • Nitricc

    Say what now?
    SAAY short of evidence?
    I better behave before I get in to hot waters. Although for the life of me, I can’t figure it out
    What is it between the Tigryan elites and deceit?

  • Saba

    Dear Rahwa T,
    This is not hide and seek game, it is about people’s life that i know.
    Every day Saay gives a lot of reference books that i never heard of, and sometimes even he mentions rap bands from the 80’s:). I hope he archives the most important posts to be used in case he decides to write a book. How much evidence do you want from Saay? I am not even close to be his disciple but i would be honored to be his student, every one deserves to be a student right?
    To be honest the reply i am looking for is the one from T.Kifle because i believe he has more knowledge than you about these events. Thanks
    Saba

    • Rahwa T

      Dear Saba,

      I agree with you regarding T. Kifle’s knowledge and experience. In fact he always surprise me by his historical and political analysis. My surprise is partly because I don’t expect someone with academic background of the hard sciences (I think he is an electrical engineer – giega da’a yikHla’aley ember) would have interest and devotion for politics. From what I followed, I am sure T. Kifle would not hesitate to forward his view and opinion on the question you are asking him. But for no clear reason, you don’t seem to write further and detail information on the various abuses done by the Ethiopian Army.

      selam,

      Rahwa

  • Mahmud Saleh

    Dear T.Kifle and Rahwa
    The bombing of the school is indefensible, and I believe Eritrea apologized for it. It went all the way to international court and your government failed to convince the court it was intentional. I have no doubt it was unintentional; war is bad; even Americans with their smart bombs were killing civilians at a horrible rate, let a lone a training jet. You may say the pilot was experience, but I had seen ” experienced dergue pilot missing their targets more than 90% and hitting an intended targets; we are talking about obsolete technology. The burden was on the Ethiopian government to prove it was deliberate; it did not; there are many intentional atrocities committed by successive Ethiopian regimes which are proven to be intentional by their records and their own admittance verbally or written; do I have to regurgitate it or move forward? I could say many about the last war, too. But is it helpful at this stage when you have a chance to build confidence and avoid another catastrophic war? I explained to T.Kifle my take about this subject in the previous article; my point was “quslna aynhkeKh” I’am afraid you (T.Kifle) are beating around this incident to cover up atrocities committed by Ethiopian governments on innocent Eritrean civilians. I hate to see people using peoples’ agonies for their personal political agenda.

    • Amanuel Hidrat

      Haw Mahmud,

      Unless we protect war from happening, ones it happened, call it collateral or intentional, it bears all kind of destruction and consequences. Crying after it happened doesn’t bear any fruits. War devour humanity and civilization. Even if it is raised as bitterness and grievances nothing could be done about it. We just learn form it . Myself and you as a product of the war at different time and space, we don’t need to argue tit for tat on the result of wars with others. We must try to divert them from arguing on the evilness of war and its consequences, and anything that bring bitterness. We have to help them how to bring a closure on it rather than to galvanize the bitterness of both sides. Let us try to avoid it from happening again.

      Senay Mishet.

      Hawka Amanuel

    • Nitricc

      Hey Mahmud.

      I don’t even know how someone can think that Eritreans are
      capable of committing such a crime. A School at that, children’s school? I mean
      who can think that was done on purpose ?
      then it came to me, what the TPLF criminals did in Hawzen. They let the
      Derg wipe out the entire population on market day. TPLF knew the Derg Mig’s
      were coming. How do we know TPLF knew but let it happen anyways, well, they
      have it from the beginning of the bombing to the end of the carnage? They just
      use it as marketing to mobilize the people of Tigray to fight against Derg. So,
      I am not surprised when the few elites claiming that the Eritrean government
      would do that.

      So, they are speaking from experience. If not how do you record
      the entire bombing from the start to the end? Why not alert the innocent
      people? Because they needed the incident for their political purpose! I am not
      surprised when the few elites and seasoned cadres’ claim what they are
      claiming.

      So, when you can do that to your own people, it is easy and
      it comes naturally to think that way for an action of inexperience pilot.

    • SA

      Dear Mahmud:

      They say that a job well begun is half done. Your starting clause “The bombing of the school is indefensible….” is a powerful statement, and the rest of your paragraph is also amazing. You were able to communicate powerfully in just one paragraph about the bombing what our best writers on both sides of the issue were not able to do in probably about 150 paragraphs. Your approach was reconciliatory and balanced. Now if T. Kifle is as wise as he is smart, I hope he will follow your lead and focus on reconciliation instead of revisiting old wounds. After all, if he wants to go down that road, Eritreans have a lot of grievances against Ethiopia, starting with their illegal occupation of our land that then led to our armed struggle. Does he really want us to talk about the atrocities committed by his country against our people for decades? But what good can come out of arguing about past atrocities and trying to score points? So I appreciate your reconciliatory approach and I hope both T. Kifle and SAAY will learn one or two things from you about striking a reconciliatory tone in their brilliant writings.

      SA

    • Abrham

      Aya Mahmud,
      I think the case is settled no need to retrigger it. Yes you could say more but we could say more too. You try to discover much of our history going back with offensive words by violating your own “look forward” motto. I can do the same. Then who will gain from presenting it again? Please refrain from going back and forth if you are a man of reconciliation? When Aboy Sibhat asked what he fills about the latest war መፃኢ ወለዶ ክወቅሰና እዩ እዞም ሰብ ከብቲ ድዩም ነይሮም ክብሉና እዩም was his answer. This is what I wan to hear from a man. Check who was in Gerhu Sernay and Tserona fronts leading two of the battalions, two brother from the same womb fight each other for nothing. The one is dead and the other is handicapped. we should not let this happen in the future and I beg the likes of mahmud, Aman and others do their homework.

      Yekenyeley.

    • T. Kifle

      Dear Mahmud,

      1. Eritrea didn’t apologize for it. What we know is rather the infamous retort of IA’s ኵናት ሕጊ የብሉን(by the way this phrase was coined in a response of that tragic atrocity)

      2. As far as the legal aspect of it, please refer to Semere Andom’s explanation entry somewhere under this thread
      3. That you “don’t have doubt it was unintentional” is your judgement as I hold that being intentional given all the circumstances the operation had been executed and the unmistakable location of the school. .
      4. Why do you talk of “successive Ethiopian governments”? Can you bring more atrocities that the the Hauzen and Mersa abominations that left more than 3000 dead in a single day? Yes, there were intentional attrocities by the Ethiopian governments indiscriminately and that’s why we fought and defeated them. Bringing that here is disingenuous and makes it redundant.
      5. Confidence cannot be build on air. It takes admission of mistakes in both sides. The Ethiopian government have evaluated the way the past war was conducted(which is classified). What I can tell you on here is it admitted the fact that many mistakes were committed in direct response of the Eritrean government(excluding the air strike because Ethiopia didn’t target civilians. Moreover, had IA had the capacity he would have destroyed even cities) as the sense of betrayal been extremely high. We should have our own measured response instead of going tit-for-tat as that ends us up in animosity with the Eritrean people. It did the same on method of deportation. It apologized through its spokesperson for unintended civilian causalities as they happen(Read:Shambuko).
      6. The problem is we happened to had bad enemy. People felt angered when Aider kids were massacred and some demanded the government retaliate in kind. IA bulldozed Zalambesa into rubble and some people wanted similar reaction from their government etc etc.
      7. I am yet to hear a word from your government, that you are confident of respecting rules of engagement, for the plights of tens of thousands of my fellow Ethiopians deported from Eritrea both in 1991 and 1998. But every Eritrean is vocal about their deportees(which is correct) but keep mums when it comes to the victimized Ethiopians. So where is your magnanimity Mr. Mahmud?

      • SM

        And your point is?
        The case is closed…no appeal..U R trying to make another 5-point -plan about this incident,I guess,and good luck to you.

      • Mahmud Saleh

        Haw,T.Kifle;

        As you know, today is the eve of our independence, yours is also coming (the day when the people of Tigray got a sigh of relief- demise of Mengstu), so happy end of terror era and wish you all the best. I am out, and do not have the time to really give you adequate response, but I think it is appropriate to give you a concise one and you may get the idea. We both of us have debated this issue in the past, I hope I have made myself clear. Everything I say is my personal view. To come to your points:

        1. As far as I know it appologized; but I need to get the source when I am in a place to do so.

        2. I am not going to go to its legal aspect; it was dealt with in court. Regardless of its legalitites, kids where killed and no one with normal sense is going to condone it; I said that in the past too.

        3. If you say ” it was intentional” and a whole might of the Ethiopian government can not prove it, then why does it become farfetched when I say ” I am sure it was unintentional?” I am not condoning the bombing of the kids at all; I am a parent and want to see my kids back from school. But all the circumstancial evidences that I have point to an operation gone wrong. I was not in the operations room, but I was so enraged by the footages of the kids that I had to ask friends who worked there. so, let me say it clearly; I hate war; because I know it; women and kids pay the price; poor young people die in it disproportionately.

        4. I know the massacres of Hazienand Mersa and we mourned them with the people of Tigray right then. It is one of the horrific footages of war still live in my memory, it was circulated by our information department at that time (radio, video and press).

        5. I have the same view, let’s work towards that. I take your word regarding your government steps to review and rectify what went wrong; we are struggling to establish a government that is accountable; the current government has yet to admit what it has caused to its citizens. I don’t know if my government reviewed it, how it reviewed it…etc.This is the general takeaway of it. When I say “successive governments” I am not blaming the people of Ethiopia (not even mahal agher let alone Tigray people who are aware of our suffering and who were in the thick and thin with Eritreans).

        6. Probably you did not see what happened to our heroes cemetry, Teseney, Barentu, Sanafe, Hirgigo power plant. That’s why I would love to pursue “Quslna AynehkeKh” policy and move forward. It was in that spirit that I did not reply to Abraham, since you are challenging me, though, I have to bring to your attention how a moderate Eritrean who want to work for the good of both people might see things.

        7. The bulk of this part should be directed to the Ambassador where you live, or an official person. All I can tell you is we get nothing from hatred and war; I hate it happened, I was not in a position in which I could have influenced the eventualities, but both people suffered and lost their young sons and daughters. I hope this answer will help you not to lose hope on my mananimity, honestly. Brother T.Kifle, I don’t know where you got this “magnanimity” stuff. Loosen it up, man.

        8. Here is my killing punch now: “Would you make it clear which “civilian atrocity” you are referring to?” are you kidding me? Is this from you T.Kifle? From a harbegna wayanay? I don’t expect this. Atrocities that happened through the 30 years are decumented. The people of Tigray are not foreign or ignorant to them.

    • SM

      Shukren ghezillion ya Habibi again
      The analogy you made about the American guided missiles/drones with the most sophisticated High Tec…are not only missing their targets but killing thousands of innocent people…
      I think.the moderator has to block this nonsensical and obsolete issue in this debate ..as it is outside the scope of this topic and era.
      The T Kifle et al are here only to create confusion and chaos….and by design..In fact…
      The best solution is to avoid him and his obsolete topic.
      Read his article on Tigray online ,which our own Tes exposed here and you will have an idea about his motivation and mission

  • haileTG

    Ha Rahwa…you leave me no choice but come and defend saay 🙂 Saay is a school of thought in himself, we gree and disagree with him but his ideas are often strongly argued from point of view of supporting evidence, historical precedents and above all imaginative take on issue. The icing on the cake is his lighthearted and entertaining way of presenting his cases. Virtually every single comment inked under the pen name Saba is to belittle justce seekers take on the suffering Eritreans go through. I will not have our very own saay insulted like that. He produced debaters like haile in the past 🙂 It would be lowering the prestige of his University to claim Saba to be his student. I looked up a PFDJ baby naming book for saba: ክትራ ብቐትሪ፡ ሽፍትነት ጎዶቦ፡ ተሓዚላ እትሓጽር፡ ድንኪ is the closest 🙂 🙂

    • Saba

      I will be honored to be a student of Saay.
      But i do not understand
      your constant denial of TPLF victims. If you consider Eritreans only
      those who live in a certain part of the country then that will be
      another topic that i am not interested to.

    • Rahwa T

      Dear Haile TG,

      I agree with that. A lot has been said by many about Sal’s intellectual integrity and that he could be a school of thought in
      himself (I am not sure if he has reached at that level). So not only you, but I myself would stand by and defend him if it is specifically on his unique quality of analyzing issues. Then who am I, after all, to evaluate him on this issue? The trouble is he sometimes tries to misuse these qualities in his in his debate while they are easy to see by any ordinary person such as me.
      That was what I was referring in my comment to Saba’s repeated post.

      Hope I have cleared myself.

      Rahwa

    • SM

      Dear Haile the g,
      Even though u r entitled to your opinion.,you do NOT have a single right to cross the line and belittle people like this and that.
      If u really respect Saau,then you have to respect his respected students,Saba included.Sa a clearly stated her stand on PFDJ but since she has not followed you the way you want her to do,you are crossing the line.
      She is entitled to her opinion as much as you are/do..,which you have abused the forum.to the extent of usin g offensive and disrespectful languages and comments,which Saba never has done as of yet…

  • Saba

    Dear T. Kifle,
    I know specific cases of intentional and unintentional TPLF victims per account of my family members who were living in the border between Eritrea and Tigray during TPLF invasion. If you want first hand account, you will find it from those people who live at the border in places that were invaded by TPLF.
    So how can you erase this from my memory? By denying it?
    Saba

    • Rahwa T

      Dear Saba,

      Is that all you have, sis? You have proved to us that you able to express yourself perfectly. However, you still couldn’t present a persuasive evidence to answer the question asked by T. Kifle. I think it is shortage of evidence. Is it Sal’s Style? I can see that you can make true disciple of Sal Yenous.

      Happy Independence to you and all at the Awate Forum.

      Rahwa

  • observer

    TPLF’s association with Ethiopia is as long as it servers their purpose. That is as long as they dominate Ethiopia. They are part of Ethiopia on their own terms. If for example another ethnic group runs Ethiopia in exact replica of their system but this time with the other ethnic group playing the same role TPLF plays, they will be the first ones to seek seccesion. The so called EPRDF is a joke. As every school child in Ethiopia knows the rest of so called organizations within EPRDF are creations of TPLF. Non of these organization existed before 1991 save EPDM which was assigned to represent Amharas – mind you it was a multi-ethnic organization before. The rest were hurriedly created by TPLF when they captured Addis Abeba. These organizations do not exist without TPLF. I am surprised by the self deception of TPLF elites who seemingly believe that they have brought equality and justice to the people of Ethiopia. No one in Ethiopia with the exception of TPLF and leaders of these phony organizations they created believe in this. It is obvious to anybody that what we have in Ethiopia is the domination of a minority ethnic group. TPLF is in a hurry to make sure the entire elite in Ethiopia is from their ethnic group. The best opportunity for education, business, culture goes to one ethnic group the rest are given the left over.
    When one observes the recent uprising of Oromo youth you know that the Oromo train have left the station and it is a matter of time before an independent Oromia state is a realty. I was in the university in Ethiopia some years ago. The entire student body is segregated by ethnic group and few cross ethnic lines to make friends.
    TPLF elites talk about the utopia they have created in Ethiopia. May be it is good for them. It ain’t so for the majority of Ethiopians. Only TPLF elites and their associates buy this.

  • Hope

    Bingo!A well documented factual history,that Weyanay T Kifle cannot hide or deny.

  • T. Kifle

    Dear Moderator,

    Tes has misquoted me by misconstruing someone’s comment under my article published elsewhere as my comment to make his point here at awate. I requested him to remove the misquote but didn’t do it so far for reasons I am not aware of. I kindly request you do the needful to redress the problem that , I think, violates the posting guidelines of Awate.com

    with regards

    • tes

      Dear T. Kifle,

      I am sorry if I misquoted you. But let me post the source and if it is wrong, I will delete it.

      Check please. It is not from your article that I quoted, but from your response. If there is any other name called Teweldebrhan Kifle, then I am mistaken by the name not by intention. There is spelling difference, but it could be same name but different person. If so, i will delete it. Just check.

      http://www.tigraionline.com/articles/abay-tigray-tplf-eritrean.html

      hawka
      tes

      • T. Kifle

        Dear tes,
        OK!! If it is unintentional, let me tell you this. The commenter was addressing his message to me. His name is a nameless “Curious Guest”. Please see it again and do the needful. How do you expect me I say something in my article and just diametrically opposite thing under it?

        • tes

          Ok, now I agree.

          Thank you!

          • T. Kifle

            Thank you

      • Nitricc

        The dishonesty Of TK is classical.
        One of the major disagreement between EPLF and TPLF was that EPLF wanted Tplf to fight for the whole Ethiopia.
        Even the name is TPLF
        Tigray liberation
        One is for sure though TK hates Eritreans. Inferior complexity at work. Don’t take it from me. Read his article in Tigray on line.
        Thanks Tes for bring it up.

        • Abrham

          Hi Nitricc the notorious

          “One of the major disagreement between EPLF and TPLF was that EPLF wanted Tplf to fight for the whole Ethiopia”. Who gave the right EPLF to dictate TPLF for whom to fight. In Zerihun Teshomes book this is called የሳሕል ልክፍት. Get rid of it then you will be famous.

          • Nitricc

            lol you got that right. i don’t know why EPLF will go through that shiiit but you got a point. i always wondered why bother. then i see it from principal point, one united and strong Ethiopia is to the benefit of Eritrea. so, from that point, I see why and the reason EPLF bothering TPLF.

            anyway, የሳሕል ልክፍት is a blessing. with it Sahil, there will be no Eritrea. so, it is here to stay.

          • Abrham

            What a principle! The Hanish archipelagos, the ras dumeras, the sudans, the badmes conflict are the product of the principle you are trying to preach.

          • Nitricc

            Principals like you fight for what you think yours and the court steps in and says its verdict then you accept and move on…..like hanish archipelagos
            You know those kind of principals and civility your government has no clue about.
            You agreed on Badime case and you sign to final and binding look what you have done. My point is you people know neither honor nor principal. When I say you people I am not talking about the hard working and proud people of Tigray, I am talking about the elites who brought shame and disgrace to the proud people of Tigray.
            Do you want more Abraham?
            Incredible. You don’t know jack about principal if principal hit you in your forehead.

          • Abrham

            Dear Nitricc

            God bless you, your manner is a little bit on progress. Principle1.you are praising the mass but have not you heard about the five peace plan? Principle 2. stubborn like isu will not accept but choose perish the young that is also a principle.

            Wedehanka hawey

          • ALI-S

            Hello,

            Excuse my intrusion:

            Abraham your question “who gave EPLF the right to dictate TPLF” shows you are young. I also know you are reading a book. I think the book is upside down. Thank you. Now read and you will know that just like today’s Eritrean opposition, yesterday’s TPLF was kissing people’s feet for direction and dictation. You see I knew I could help.

            Nitricc excuse but where do you get the idea that a “united Ethiopia is good for Eritrea? The only Ethiopia that is good for Eritrea is the one broken to pieces. At least we could have our cousins back.

            I think the question should be whether we have the right to break it down and whether we can do it without risking breaking our own in the process. Thanks!

          • abinet

            You wish ethiopia to be broken into pieces?you are not only arrogant you are also desperately ignorant. It is people like you conceived in hate , grew up in hate , eat and breathe hate , and die in hate make me say that we dont need any kind of relationship with you.
            Your country is in the verge of collapse and instead of finding a solution you wish us to be like you?
            let me tell you one thing. You will never make your stupid u-turn and come back to my country . If you must come you should be in the refugee camps if there is any room available.
            Ethiopia, my beautiful country is shining in the world stage. I know it is killing you. Too bad . Better get used to it. Your cousins , the “agames”as you proudly call them, have always been Ethiopians and remain proud Ethiopians even if you come back and kiss their feet. They are smarter than you would like to believe. Jealousy is eating you inside out.
            Long live Ethiopia!!!!
            death for whoever wish her ill.

          • dine

            selamat ALI-S
            it looks like you working to break ERITREAN people in to pieces, as we all know you and your likes have tried to break ethiopia for so many years and it did not workout as consequence eritrea is in near somalization. please stop spreading the hate furthermore for the sake of eritrea.

          • Kim Hanna

            MR. Ali,
            I have nothing but contempt for you. Long live Ethiopia and Eritrea.
            K.H

          • Dear Kim Hanna,

            Do not waste your contempt on him. I doubt if he deserves it. When a person is defeated, he/she loses rationality and self-respect. One should not expect much from people who live by making continuous U-turns, chasing their tail. Such people have no principle, and they happily blow with the wind, as long as it takes them where their personal interest lies.

            Look how he used to bash Tigrayans at every chance he could find, and now, being a natural U-turner, he is longing for union with those whom he now calls cousins. Tigrayans are not blind to this kind of
            opportunism and treachery in the making.

          • Fanti Ghana

            ALI-S,
            yeh, T. Kifle yewrdelKha!

          • haileTG

            Ali- S

            “The only Ethiopia that is good for Eritrea is the one broken to pieces.”? What a horrible thing to say brother! Ageb! Ageb! A million Ageb! There are people (over 90 million) who call themselves Ethiopians, died and bled for it, their birthplace and their sacred land for eternity. NO right minded Eritrean would go to such extent as uttering such cruel words. Many Ethiopians came here to wish you happy independence day, our Ethiopian brother/sister Fanti G surprised us today by their heartfelt generosity and solidarity with our suffering people. Eritreans are honorable and God fearing person, they don’t need a but naked insane man as a spokes person. Please, go back to your corner.

          • abinet

            Haile
            he is a national disgrace.

          • T. Kifle

            Thank you haile. we are,unfortunately, surrounded by educated fools.

          • Semere Andom

            Hi Haile TG; Good on you!
            If you had an inkling that the U-Turn was not mandated by the one who holds the Police Chief in Eritrea besides other titles then you got it now. Who predicted for the last 23 years that Ethiopia will be broken?
            The PFDJite are betting their future that Ethiopia will be broken and only then they survival can be assured,that is their ingenuinity of the devote disciple of PFDJ And if history is any guide the Woyane will play them again. Ali means broken Ethiopia is good for PFD

          • ALI-S

            Haile & All,

            By the way I was not making a wish. I was making a simple statement of fact. As far as Eritrea is concerned, Ethiopia is a monster that will never be tamed whatever we offer. Its politics is a factory of greed, hate and arrogance. We will never sleep in peace as long as every hateful politician from Tigray or Amhara has at his disposal an endless pool of conscripts relative to what we can raise in the event of emergencies. These are naked facts and please get used to them.

            The only limitations are two: (1) is the moral question of as you said whether it is just to pursue breaking others as policy. (2) whether is it feasible to break others without breaking yourself in the process.

            In both cases my answer is No. We should not follow that as policy. But the truth is that, because what I mentioned are bare facts, every government in both sides will keep testing both questions of morality (and check if people would approve) and that of feasibility (to see if another round will work better). A perpetual arms race will always be a fact of life in our region.

            Instead of going emotional and all the Tigrean friends here shedding their crocodile tears, let us see if there are ways where by we would minimize the need for trial and error on destruction by our governments.

          • Jo

            Selamat haileTG,

            Do I sound that bad??? ooopppss!!! I didn’t mean to get worked up like that, really. My bad:)

            Ciao!!!

            PS, I was trying to respond to you, and something happened whatever you wrote to me disappeared. I guess you deleted it for whatever reason, huh?

          • haileTG

            Not from my side, may be disqus playing up again, chill out buddy 🙂

          • Jo

            No problem, all is good!!

    • tes

      Dear Kifle,

      I have corrected the error I did.

      I will not go further with this issue, but if you wrote an article about this issue and you brought the rumors that goes for decades in order to nullify it, then there must be some secret thing to the public. In fact, the main argument between EPLF and TPLF that lead sometime a broke-up with was about “Tigray future.” Anyway, it is very good that Ethiopia remained as ONE country and I am happy with the outcome. In the future, let you be abide by the RULE OF LAW, your constitution. I respect that.

      hawka
      Tess

  • T. Kifle

    Dear Asmerom,

    Not much you could call it a U-turn. It’s a little twist.

  • saay7

    Selamat Eritrean Nationalist:

    No, sir. There were two incidents (that I know of; there are probably many more because Meles liked to dazzle his audience):

    1. Meles told Paul Henze in 1990 that he HOPES Eritreans will choose to remain part of Federated Ethiopia.

    2. Meles told Lencho in 1992 that he EXPECTS that Eritreans will “imminently rejoin Ethiopia.” One is hope, the other is expectation.

    saay

  • Eyob Medhane

    Sal,

    You said.. “……As for TPLF “allowing” referendum in 1993, there were two reasons: (a) it wasn’t in a position to do anything about it then, busy as it was just stabilizing Ethiopia and (b) it believed (at least Meles believed) that the Eritreans can have their little fling but they will come back to Emama Ethiopia, a belief indulged by Isaias Afwerki who, on the eve of Eritrea’s referendum, was telling a reporter that he doesn’t rule out co-federation with Ethiopia…..”

    Oh…That’s so cute. 🙂 I don’t know what you based your assessment on ‘Meles believed that Eritreans will come back to Ethiopia’. Unless, you were in his head, he never EVER expressed that in any way shape or form. In fact, the major reason that he risked a huge political capital, was his perceived bias towards Eritrea. His insistence that Eritrea must be and will be an independent country at all cost gave packs of ammunition to his political enemies. His unwavering stance on Eritrea’s independence almost cost him his job (probably his life) in 2001. No. He never entertained that. I however assume that he knew Isayas is a screw up. He knew Isayas would suffocate his own people. He knew that Eritrea’s legs are very thin to stand on by itself without Ethiopia as its market place and economic base. E.g “they can make Assab a camel watering hole”) Therefore, he may have believed that Eritreans would get rid of Isayas and EPLF in no time to assert their right and have a closely tied relationship with Ethiopia, which makes their independence is just a matter of political independence, as Djibouti pretty much is now. I believe that was his thinking. He was wrong. Isayas seems to get the better of Eritrean people and devour them at will, and they just take it with only minimal complaint. It is now a whole 23 years….

    • saay7

      Selamat Eyobai:

      I say something; you categorically deny it….you know what is going to happen next… it is so predictable:) Awatistas who agree with me are saying “drop da bomb y’all!” Those who agree with you are saying, “Oh, God, here it comes! Eyob, why did you have to do that?”

      So, to calm the situation, let me re-introduce you to our culture, we all do it, in the Big H and small h abesha: we never drop the bomb before some niceties:

      ከመይ ቀኒኻ? ደሓንዶ ትቕኒ? ስድራ ኸመይ ኣለዉ? ዝዓበዩ ዝናኣሱ? ተጣፊእና’ ምበር….ም ረኤካ ሚ ሰማዕካ ኣጀኒት ከፎ ህለው ታዲያስ… then da bomb:

      “My own discussions with Prime Minister Meles in 1992 lead me to partly concur with Alemseged Tesfai’s assertion that Ethiopian ruler’s preference was ‘to see, not an independent Eritrea, but one linked to Ethiopia in a federal arrangement.’ THE ETHIOPIAN PRIME MINISTER OFFHANDEDLY INFORMED ME OF HIS EXPECTATION THAT ERITREA WILL IMMINENTLY REJOIN ETHIOPIA, ALTHOUGH THE FORM OF SUCH A LINK WAS NOT PUT AS EXPLICITLY.”

      (Emphasis mine to keep your eyes focused on what Meles told the Ferenj author so you don’t go all Eyob on me and rail on Alemseged Tesfai who is merely a secondary source; the primary source being the PM himself.)

      [If this was a movie, I would have the camera zoom on Eyob’s face now, as he sweats to get himself out of the trap he built for himself…and I would have no audio except maybe a grandfather clock going tic toc tic toc tic toc…:)]

      Ah, the source. It is available for free, on Google. Ordinarily, I would give you the page number. But I think you, Rahwa, Amde, T. Kifle, Fanti Ghana, Dine (not to mention all the I Heart TPLF Eritreans) could definitely benefit from reading the entire piece because it touches on everything we had been discussing, so I won’t. Instead, I will force you to read the entire 19-page document.

      I very much look forward to you now wiggling out of your categorical denial that Meles “never EVER expressed that in any way shape or form.” I will be heart-broken if you don’t: we have a tradition to keep here at awate and you have to do your part:)

      Source:

      Lata, Leenco. Review of African Political Economy (ROAPE). No 97: 369-388.

      saay

      • Eyob Medhane

        Sal,

        First of all, since when Lencho Leta became “a ferenj” author? As far as he himself and the whole world is concerned. He was Oromo, then with age he matured and decided to become Ethiopian. If you don’t know, who Lench Leta is, he was one of the founder of OLF and, in 1991 one of the those, who was the part of the transitional government of Ethiopia representing OLF. He left the transitional government, went to Asmara, became a political enemy of Meles. Hence, any thing he writes is a suspect, biased and skewed. Therefore, I do not accept that as a legitimate source. I have respect to Obo Leenco Lata, though. He is charasmatic and nice to listen to, and highly educated. His late decision to move back to Ethiopia and be an elder statesman also should earn him respect. That does not mean that I swallow everything he says…

        • Guest

          Sal,

          One more thing. In case you wanna know what he looks like, here it is…

          • Eyob Medhane

            Sorry Sal,

            Diques is acting really weird…It posted the pic of Obo Lench twice and posted it as a guest to me?….Weird?! I humbly request you fix it, sir…. 🙂

        • Guest

          Sal,

          Here is his picture, in case you wanna see what he looks like..

        • Jo

          Selamat Eyob,

          “….since when Lencho Leta became “a ferenj” author?” where did you read Saleh mentioning the authors race? Or did you assume that he must be “ferenji” since his work was cited as an academic paper? Would it have made a difference to you if he was “ferenji’ instead?

          • Eyob Medhane

            Jo,

            Read, read read, ma man….”…Emphasis mine to keep your eyes focused on what Meles told the ferenj…” Sal edited it later…

      • T. Kifle

        Dear Sal

        Why are you surprised by the quote you have brought about on here? Our preference has always been to have a unified Ethiopia, Eritrea included, of course with full consent of Eritreans. Self-determination inherently is a pre-emptive measure to encourage parties to opt for the bigger union with a guaranteed divorce in constitutional and peaceful manner when they feel like things don’t go in theirr favour. Eritrean independence couldn’t be the last thing we desire but a necessary measure that should be dealt with bold and square. Respecting the choice of Eritreans doesn’t negate in any way with our desire to have them in union as far as it’s done in amicable manner. And when Eritreans had their say, their choice had to be respected still working with long term closer relationship in mind. This I think is a general truth and doesn’t need any theory for its support or otherwise
        TK

        • tes

          Dear t. Kifle,

          You said it now loudly and clearly. Do not try then to bury your head in a sand. Let me ask you though. Are you working for this re-unification? Look for the European Union (EU), see the dream EuroAsia, the US, the Arab, the AU, etc, all are meant to bring people together. Not to unite them by force, but to unite them when they want and when they wanted so. There is a bigger dream of African Union. Ethioipia, Eritrea and the rest 53 or 52 countries have equal share for this UNITY. We will never, never entertain the idea of unified Ertro-Ethiopia. It will not, but, we can work together for a united African states. To see a united African countries and to have a unified Ethiopia are two extreme things.

          Lets deal with united countries of the big Africa and be responsible within that context for our own homework.

          hawka
          tes

          • T. Kifle

            Dear Tes,

            your assertion “We will never, never entertain the idea of unified Ertro-Ethiopia” is a contradiction. There is no way you can work for unifying Africa while you detest unified Ethiop-Eritrea. please note:: don’t categorically reject general truths which can be brought to life in few years ahead. We never know what the future holds. And I am in any no eager than any average Eritrean should feel about this union.

          • tes

            Dear T. Kifle,

            Mind me, when I say Eritro-Ethiopia, what I mean is to be one country with Ethiopia. here is what you wrote, “Our preference has always been to have a unified Ethiopia, Eritrea included, of course with full consent of Eritreans.” And, I say, ” Our choice [not preference] was, is and will be an independent sovereign country.” Unity under the African union is different. You better know that. This is what I am talking about.

            hawka
            tes

          • abinet

            Dear tes
            dont you worry about unification. We are going in exactly different directions.we dont need the unity as much as you dont need it. Relax my friend and enjoy the indepence day.
            HAPPY INDEPENDENCE DAY FOR BOTH COUNTRIES!!!!
            Tes, let’s work with each other to keep them independent forever!
            PEACE.

        • saay7

          Selamat T.Kifle:

          And who said I am surprised? I said that TPLF officials and specifically Meles Zenawi had expectations (not preference, but expectations) that Eritreans would ask to re-join Ethiopia; Eyob, as is his tendency, categorically denied this, and I presented evidence that he did.

          As for preference, Meles Zenawi had already expressed that to Eritrea-hater Paul Henze in 1990 that “we really hope that Eritrea can remain part of a federated Ethiopia. I agree with what you have written about the advantages for the Eritreans themselves.” So we were not discussing TPLF’s preference, but its prediction.

          saay

          PS: Jo, don’t pick on Eyob. In past debates, anytime he has categorically denied something, I had given him sources, which he immediately dismissed as written by Ferenj. In this particular case, I was trying to say “and the author is not Ferenj” but I ended up writing “Ferenj author”, which for the sake of clarity I have indicated that I edited and which has now become Eyob’s obsession to prove that he is not Ferenj, disregarding his complete and categorical denial that Meles ever, never, ever, never said that:)

          • T. Kifle

            Dear Sal,

            we are in the same page then

          • Jo

            Saleh & Eyob,

            No problem!! point well taken and I stand corrected.

          • Rodab

            Haderka Jo,
            You stand corrected on what? Don’t tell me you are using duplicate names:-)

            Haderka Sal,
            I expect Eyoba to come back with ‘entareq’ you tube link:-)
            I like Eyoba. He is both – cool and misguided.

          • Jo

            Selamat Rodab,

            If you read bellow, I was questioning Eyob about misquoting Sal, then both explained it to me: it was a typo that was corrected before I read the posting and asked Eyob.

            Ciao!

          • Hope

            Anta Sal,
            Akmicha filet bello.Please translate to him in Amharic.

          • Hope

            One more question to you Sal:
            Why are we wasting our time about the past and keep shinkolloling—Can we go back to our solution oriented debate?

      • Eritrean Nationalist

        Dear Saay,
        You are correct on this one. However, I believe Meles uttered the quote not to Lencho but to Paul Henze. Paul Henze is the one that tattled on Meles.
        1. That is why Weyane hated the fact that Eritrea declared its own currency, which it had the right to do as a sovereign nation. Once Eritrea declared its own currency, it made the independence final.
        2. While the naïve and good-natured Eritrean leaders and EPLF were planning on closer ties, the treacherous and duplicitous Tigrayans and Weyane were scheming on reversing Eritrea’s independence. Once war broke out and the people Weyane was arming inside Eritrea were caught, arrested and confessed about what Weyane put them up to (their plan was to cause chaos inside Eritrea and then assassinate Eritrean leaders) the EPLF saw how wrong it was about Weyane and wanted nothing to do with it. Weyane’s evil intentions against Eritrea were further corroborated by the POWs of the border war who confessed that their instructions were to go all the way to Asmara and change the government.
        3. That is why this was more than a border war from Weyane’s perspective all along. If it was a simple border war, it would have been solved by now once the Hague ruling came down. But Weyane Tigray’s intentions all along were to reverse Eritrean independence. That is why the level of disappointment, distrust and anger from the Eritrean side is deep and that is why it is unlikely to be resolved for another generation or two in my view. Or at least, until there is a non-Weyane government in Ethiopia.

      • Amanuel Hidrat

        Hey Saay,

        To desire for something or anything is natural. To fight to attain your desire even at the cost of lives and infringement the rights of Eritreans is another thing. Meles didn’t chose the later. Foe sure Meles would be happy if the desire of Eritreans is to join with Ethiopia. Who doesn’t wish from the Ethiopian side to see Eritrea joined with Ethiopia? But Meles is smart he wasn’t dictated by his desire and he doesn’t attempt what other Ethioipian leaders have done for thirty years. He let the Eritrean issue to be determined by the Eritreans. Saay you know what he respond to angry Amharan when he asked him why he let Eritrea to secede. Give the man where the credit is due. The problem of our debate is becoming to win a debate not to find the truth. It is all for scoring point.

        Senay MeAlti,
        Amanuel Hidrat

        • Asmerom

          Dear Amanuel
          Saay is the DJ of Eritrean politics he is here not to build peaceful bridges between the two people he is here to discredit anything and everything what Meles did in particular and anything to do with Ethiopia in general

        • Semere Andom

          Emma:T”he problem of our debate is becoming to win a debate not to find the truth. It is all for scoring point:
          Yes, To parapharase Issac Newton “for every quote there is an equally potent and opposite quote”.

        • haileTG

          Selamat Aman and saay

          Aman, I don’t know about “Meles is smart and genius” part, because the natural question to follow would be: smart and genius towards what objective? And at whose expense?

          Saay, I hold that 100%+ of the current tragedies hapening in Eritrea is fairly and squarely the direct result of the current entity holding state power in Eritrea (be it IA, regime, PFDJ…). Meles may have wanted or not, as you make it appear to be, to see Eritrea rejoin Ethiopia. But the entity in power that is ruling Eritrea made that a very real possibility single handedly.

          1 – No war no peace was declared by the Eritrean regime having expelled peace keepers.

          2 – The Youth were placed into a life long humiliation, servitude and isolation by the design of the regime for alterior motives without a single threat or provocation by the Ethiopian side (they both said they need to see regime change of the other but as you yourself admit the Ethiopian side didn’t go as far as helping such practically. In fact it is accused for the opposite by some in the opposition).

          3 – Over half a million Eritreans are on the move, to get the heck out of the PFDJ regime ruled Eritrea and if any thing, however little or insignificant one would like to make it, the Ethiopians or TPLF were not seen to take adverse actions to take advantage of the situation. In fact they are restrained and insisting that let the Eritreans deal with it.

          4 – Nobody can make a confident and self respecting person “malleable” or “humble”. That only betray the level of self esteem one is working at. But, please illustrate and actual policy instrument that is currently persued by the TPLF/EPRDF or Ethiopia to make those “Naive Eritreans who should have known better” into a “melleable and humble” beings. And, what would the final goal be by doing so and transforming the Tigrinya, Tigre, Saho, Bilen, Rashaida, Kunama, Nara, Afar, Hidareb peoples of Eritrea that hail from predominantly christian highland and moslem lowland.

          5 – Finally, unless IAs predictions of the iminent collapse and demise of TPLF/EPRDF in two hours from now is to be believed, how do you envision our role to be in promoting cooperation and understanding between our two peoples? That is, if it is dealing with TPLF is as bleak as it is made out to be, then what should be our approach to improve it?

          6 – Considering that Ethiopia wields significant economic, military and diplomatic clout than our beligured, isolated and bankrapted HGDEF led pariah Eritrea, do you think the reasons for our sense of powerlesness is nostalgia of an era that has long gone and we need to operate within our current limits?

          Cheers

          PS: I finally feel better about, an otherwise depressing times, after Dejen told us that Bitweded Abraha and Papayo are still alive (all be it in a dark cell of HGDEF dangeons) in his latest interview. Merhaba Merhaba Abshir Dejen 🙂

          • Nitricc

            Wow Haile talk about doom and gloom. Don’t get dipressed man. Take it easy.

          • haileTG

            haha Nitricc, trust me it isn’t the usual things that I am complaining about. Yesterday two things happened that hit close to home to me.

            1 – A person (close relative) who was the only one left to his aging mother fighting debilitating health conditions has called me from the Sudan, having left the country. Last time I spoke to him before he left, he seemed he was going to stay put, even said something to the effect “all those who couldn’t handle it here have left, those of us who haven’t are here because we’ll stay no matter what”. But that wasn’t to be! He said that life had just been impossible for him.

            2 – Another bad news was about a young wife (with a 5 year old son) of a young sibling of my friend made her way to Ethiopia recently. Her husband has just been brought to the west after 5 years in the Sudan and she needed to go the Sudan from Ethiopia to start the process to join him. Apparently, the husband’s families sent about $3000 to help her to transfer to the Sudan, but the Eritrean guy who was supposed to deliver the money to her took off with it and was seen in the Sudan himself! Imagine, leaving a young mother with her little child (5 year old) in such dreadful situation by an Eritrean man who was supposed to protect her and be the support she needs.

            This is trying times ኤርትራዊ ሰብኣይ፡ ስረ ዝፈትሓሉ እዋን if this isn’t depressing then what?

          • Fanti Ghana

            Hello HaileTG,
            How recent is #2, and is she still in Ethiopia?
            If still necessary, can 5,6 awatistas share her expense?
            I know there are so many needs allover the our region, but I can pitch in $500.00 today.

          • haileTG

            Hello Dear Fanti Ghana,

            It actually happened few months back (but I heard only yesterday after meeting the husband in person). She somehow made it to the Sudan by land transport and thank God for that. Your natural humane bond to this issue is inspiring to us all that when all is said and done there are greater powers that pull us towards the good of each other. Thank you for that Fanti Ghana. I hope this also inspires my fellow compatriots to recognize that the canvas of human relationships are painted by the greatest painter/ artist that can ever be, God himself. Thx

          • Fanti Ghana

            Hope is very powerful,
            As you well know there are over 90,000 Eritrean refugees in
            Ethiopia alone, most of them with lots of needs, but when a story gets focused
            on specific individual like this it pierces your heart. I, semi-joking, had
            posted something recently about forming an organization lead by a few awatistas,
            and this was the kind of purpose I had in mind. Where we can contribute a
            little here a little there and use it for these and for the “Erirean refugee in
            Yemen” kind of news the other day. Just imagine if we could have bought some
            blankets and send it to them as soon as we heard that news.

            Saleh, Moderators,

            I think you should think about this seriously. It doesn’t
            need to be something heavy or political, but a humanitarian type organization where
            people can voluntarily and discreetly contribute online to give hope to others.
            Thanks.

          • tes

            Dear Fanti Ghana,

            What a good heart you have. I am proud of such generous people to be around. I wish I could help, but being a student is not possible.

            Dear Haile TG,

            I feel sorry but it keeps me strong to fight again and again fiercely against the regime who is the main cause for this miser. All we hear everyday is worse and worse. Let’s weed-out the cause of all these evils to our people.

            Hawkum
            tes

          • Nitricc

            Fanti
            what a person and i just wanted to say thank you for your refreshing gesture. you are one cool person. keep that heart.

          • Nitricc

            Haile sorry to hear that. it is sad events, however, try to be strong and don’t let it get to you to that level. reading you, i felt the sadness and depression in you. that why i reach out and halla at you. be strong bro! we will get through it. we always have.

          • Amanuel Hidrat

            Hailat,

            The accolade “smart and genius” is within the context we are debating. The contexts are “the PMM’s view on the self-determination of of Eritrean people and his decision on the border war.” I don’t want to be redundant by repeating my answers, but you could check my answers that are given to son Nitricc.

            Hawka,

            Amanuel; Hidrat

          • saay7

            Selamat Haile TG:

            Thanks for giving me this opportunity to say my last piece on this issue, which is exhausting the patience of our readers. It is going to be long and probably disjointed so apologies in advance:

            1. When I mention an article, an analysis from a time long gone, people may have a perception that I am stuck in history, living in the past. My reasons for doing that is so that we can have a basis for a dialogue and to see if we can detect a common thread, a set of beliefs that are subject to change based on persuasion or are, like faith, fairly fixed an immovable.

            2. When I say Harbeyna Weyanai, it is with admiration for their ability to transform a society (Tigrayan) from one which had been subjugated, humiliated, marginalized for 100 years (beginning with Sihul’s regicide) to one that will never again allow itself to be in that position. I watch a lot of Tigrayan videos (comedy, documentary, comedies) and I am very proud of them of how they have transformed the state: I find it inspiring: and I think if they can do it, we can too! (ዘይ ቀንእ ኣይወለድ) But the formula for this was ethnic federation. The late Prime Minister always made it clear that his organization saw things first from a Tigrayan perspective, then from an Ethiopian. (Sigh: Eyob, please refer to his interview with Paul Henze in 1990.)

            3. There are many people (Ethiopians and Eritreans) who have found ethnic federation a horrific way to govern. Ethnic federation essentially rewards homogenous Kilils and the loudest protest to it came from the Amhara ethnic group who are/were relatively spread out in Ethiopia. (They were dismissed as “chauvinist” and “Neftegna” and they are still nursing their wound.) Eritreans, whose society and history is different, have always envisioned that their multi-ethnic society would be represented by multi-ethnic organizations. As Omar Jaber told Bereket Simon in a Paltalk session: from 1961-1999, Eritrea never had ethnic-based organizations; but since 1999, they have been mushrooming with encouragement and facilitation from you. I am convinced that this is bad for Eritrea (it creates ethnic authoritarians forming a coalition to govern the country indefinitely); I am also convinced that the EPRDF genuinely believes that this is the only way for Eritrea to be at peace with itself.

            4. I am also convinced that the Eritrea-Ethiopia border issue should more accurately be described as the Eritrea-Tigray border issue. As recently as a year ago, the current Ethiopian Prime Minister told an Eritrean opposition leader that he has no flexibility (and can’t lead) on the border issue because (he was addressing an EPLF veteran) this is really an EPLF-TPLF issue and has nothing to do with us. We were willing to give up the entire province of Ethiopia; what is Badme compared to that? (Sorry, Eyob, no link for that: some things are just based on unpublished personal interviews.)

            5. I am also convinced that the core of EPRDF, TPLF, believes that it has done absolutely nothing wrong (ever) and that the EPLF/PFDJ has done many, many things wrong and that the issue is not Isaias Afwerki, or even the leadership of EPLF/PFDJ, but the entire Eritrean mindset (what T.Kifle calls the “mainstream”) and that this attitude of superiority must, like a wild horse, be broken. So the TPLF formula for lasting peace is for Eritreans to change, to be humbled, to recognize that they are just residents of a small country in Africa which has barely any resource and whose strategic value to the world is overstated.

            Why does any of the above matter at all? Well, we were discussing solutions for Eritrea. There are many (more than you and I like to admit) who believe that no change can come in Eritrea without the direct intervention of Ethiopia. In the last 13 years, I have seen Eritrean political organizations who go to Addis Abeba all excited…and I see their enthusiasm wane, over time, as they realize that the formula they are offering (multi-ethnic national organization) has absolutely no appeal to the Ethiopian government.

            On the change we forecast, whether we have a PFDJ-DIA, or an EDF-PFDJ, or an Junior Officer-EDF/PFDJ mekon’nat, or any configuration thereof, the Ethiopian government is going to want to have a say on the post-change Eri government. Depending on the change, it will either have little say or a lot of say. And given that what it says is “the solution is ethnic federation” I would like the kind of change that gives them as little say as possible.

            saay

        • Nitricc

          Aman
          Did you say the truth?
          Okay you said PMMZ let Eritrea to be independent.
          Does he had a choice at that time and moment?
          And when PMMZ and TPLF become stronger
          They ignited the war to teach Etitreans a lesson will not forget and to break eritrean spinal cord.
          I know you like the dead dictator but please don’t tell as the truth or fact.
          They let Eritrea because they were week and they attack to reverse it when they got strong. That is the truth.

          • Amanuel Hidrat

            Nitricc ( can I call you son Nitricc),

            Learn history please. TPLF support the self-determination of Eritrean people from its inception to its independence. Period. Second the Prime minister had registered his vote against the war (border war) but he has to abide by their constitution to follow the decision of the parliament. unlike ours (DIA) he follow the rule of law of that country and went for war that was declared by the parliament. Third even if you assume they hadn’t comparable power to that of EPLF at that time (during independence), and if he had the mindset of the former Ethiopian rulers (to retain Eritrea), he would have continued the old path (to fight and maintain Eritrea to be part of Ethiopia) right after he stabilized Ethiopia. During the border war was the right time to do it. Thanks for his rational decision he didn’t pursue to reverse our independence and he didn’t run the tanks to Asmara. In fact the hardliners fought against him and wanted him to continue the war beyond the border. And everybody knows how the TPLF was in a political crises on having opposite views within the leadership and within the rank/files on whether to continue or not. He won against the hardliners. There are so many credits to this man. This is what I can tell the view of the good man and his fight against all odds in his government and the Ethiopian people at large.

            I believe you are from the young generation and please don’t go by the propaganda out there. Allow a space for your thought process to think independently. There are many things you need to dig, to read, to learn, and nurture your maturing age that could help you to make a sound judgement.

            Senay MeAlti,

            Amanuel Hidrat

          • tes

            Dear Ayay Emma,

            You know why I always call you Amanuel/Emma, I never felt your age. You all have is fresh energy, with full of wisdom. I appreciate that telling the truth is a noble thing and what you do is bravity. Thank you for such quality.

            Keep teaching us at the same time WISDOM, the way we can say what we know.

            Hawka
            tes

          • Amanuel Hidrat

            Merhaba TES,

            I have been in politics for so long. What has left with my age is to tell the truth and help our young generation to bring a peaceful and judicious Eritrea for its sons and daughters. Eritrea has to come at peace with itself and its neighbors. My generation hurt our young by our mistakes. I will continue to fight to rectify our wrongs in the present, to build a viable Eritrea and a good future for them.

            Thank you for your nice words and we are together in the fight.

            Hawka,

            Amanuel Hidrat

          • Kokhob Selam

            yes, the man is very much experienced additional to his knowledge. in this earth school the young should not experience what we have gone through. Amuni has a lot to teach the young generation at his middle edge. wishing him long life,

          • Nitricc

            Aman call me what ever you want i have no problem. the problem i have is you are totally unfair and it is a slop in the face for the brave Eritreans who crushed the TPLF gang till their chief of staff cry to his balls out.
            okay, i have read what you have said i will bring you my evidence that will disarm you from your erroneous believe.
            be back with this and thanks for your advice, appreciate it.

          • Amanuel Hidrat

            Son Nitricc,

            What you have to to do is to disprove what I have said one by one. You don’t need to bring other reasons. I stated the position of the man on “self-determination of Eritrean independence and his position and his vote on the border war”. If there is something wrong on those two positions bring them on. Don’t try to bring other proofs that might be pertinent to other issues. Just let us go step by step without mixing. I want you to learn not to mix issues as it has been the case so often in our forums here. Have that grip son.

            Senay Mishet,

            Amanuel Hidrat

          • Nitricc

            Aman

            read what you have said and i will take you up on this one and this my beef.

            “During the border war was the right time to do it. Thanks for his rational decision he didn’t pursue to reverse our independence and he didn’t run the tanks to Asmara. In fact the hardliners fought against him and wanted him to continue the war beyond the border. And everybody knows how the TPLF was in a political crises on having opposite views within the leadership and within the rank/files on whether to continue or not. He won against the hardliners. There are so many credits to this man. This is what I can tell the view of the good man and his fight against all odds in his government and the Ethiopian people at large.”

            Major beef. read it, please. then i will bring it up.

          • Amanuel Hidrat

            Yes Son Nitricc,

            Leave aside what happened within the war (all the push and pull) we don’t need a detail account of it. That is not the issue. I don’t want to go to “gual neger”. Let us clear his belief at that time and we will proceed from that. If you agree on those two issues I will continue further. But that doesn’t help to solve the current issue of our nation. In wars there are always push and pull and for sure we do not eject them from badume and other places. And thanks we didn’t try again to pay the unnecessary precious lives of our young, for it is solvable by political diplomacy.

            The above statement doesn’t by any stretch of imagination infer or undermine EDF. It just reflect the rule of war, you push when the momentum is on your side, and you withdraw when the momentum is not in favor to you. Still you have to learn the nature of wars. It is not the war of pens.

            senay Mishet,

            Amanuel Hidrat

          • Nitricc

            Aman
            My point is I have studied the entire war in and out.and it kills me people have this wrong understanding. My reaction was triggered when you said Melles called of the war because he did favored Eritrea. That is absolutely wrong.
            If you don’t want what about to unleash ( detailed) events then I don’t have to and you are saving me great deal amount of time. But please note that Melles and his gangs did everything they could do to break Shaebia and completely overthrow the government of Eritrea. Their plan was simply to enter Asmara. But thanks to Adi-begio and the demise of the elite Tigryan only force; Melles had no choice but to go to Algiers. His forces were decimated beyond their expectation. So, please give the credit the EDF deserves.
            There are things I can not deny about Melles too
            Was he against the war? Yes
            Was he forced by the hard liners? Yes
            Was he pro Eritrea and pro independence? Yes
            Just the truth.

          • Saba

            Dear Nitricc,
            I do not agree with your support of the regime but i agree with everything you said in the above. TPLF did everything they can in Adi-begio and Assab front. Later i saw Adi-begio and i can say that if Adi-begio falls Asmara falls. At that time TPLF brought with them some Eritrean “opposition” with them to replace the regime in Asmara. These Eritreans told to the local people: “deki kum ina, we come to liberate you” The response from the local people was that “deqina are fighting to defend their country Eritrea, we do not recognize you” . Some elders lost their lives for their confrontation with TPLF. PMMZ was forced to break his alliance with IA. I do not understand why people forget everything just to appease TPLF.
            Saba

          • Amanuel Hidrat

            So Son Nitricc,

            You have said:
            Was he against the war? YesWas he forced by the hard liners? Yes
            Was he pro Eritrea and pro independence? Yes

            That is the man I am talking about.
            What a nice day it is! So the man is rational and he was good to Eritrea because he stood with the aspiration of Eritreans. He doesn’t believe on war either. He believe on peace and development.

            Two corrections: (a) He wasn’t forced by the hardliners to go to war. It was declared by the parliament (so rather forced by the parliament is right). But then, legally he was not forced either. He was following the law and that is “the parliament declare the war and the executive implements it”. Doesn’t it sound rule of law. Off course. What you, in fact are right is the hardliners were pushing him to break shabebia and go up to Asmara. However they do not prevail. He resisted (try to verify yourself because I did it) them. And in fact it leads to the crises of the party and finally some of the hardliners were purged and sent to prison. He consolidated his power.

            (b) second Correction: Meles didn’t sent a letter to the security council to accept the Algeria agreement. Rather the Issayas government did sent a letter signaling the accept of the algeris agreement, and that is after the final push (3rd worar). It was SOS for the security council to have a session in the mid night. Just go and refer the UN document. So far we are in good progress. Once we agree on the basic elements of the conflict the rest will not be that much difficult

            Senay Mishet,

            Aamanuel Hidrat.

          • Saba

            Dear Amanuel Hidrat,
            Sorry my intrusion but what difference that it make for eritreans whether MZ was authorized by his parliament or not? If he was a man of honor either he should have opposed it or resign. Instead he tried 3 times and he failed 3 times, even in the 3rd worar. Both IA and MZ accepted the agreement because it was a win-win situation even though later the verdict was not a win for TPLF. If you are working for a stronger opposition i think this “bleaching” of the TPLF mistakes will not help. I wish you work for “eritrean solutions for eritrean problems”
            Saba

        • Jo

          Selamat Amanuel,

          Are you serious? I don’t know what your infatuation with Melles is, but going to the extent of saying that “He let the Eritrean issue to be determined by the Eritreans.” is disingenuous to say the least. The Eritrean people determined our own future, Meles didn’t let us. To hate the EG is one thing, to bend back wards to appease Meles and the Ethiopian government and to credit them for the determination of our future is another. On the response to the Amhara question: What else could he have said? If you have asked that same question to anyone at that particular moment, no body would have answered any different given the situation then. Talk about giving credit, yeah! you can credit him alright!! for, declaring war, deporting E ppl, bombarding and pillaging of villages, for sanctions, and the lives of 19000 soldiers and thousands that are wounded.

          As an Eritrean you have the right to demand any thing of the Eritrean government, including their resignation and/or removal by force, that right is granted to all of us by those who sacrificed dearly for the nation not by those who try to subdue us either by force or charm. If you are going to give credit, give it to those who fought and paid dearly against subjugation and enabled us to determine our own future not on the whims of others but ours.

          Luwam zelewo meAlti!!

          • Amanuel Hidrat

            Oh man!! Jo,

            It is not a matter of infatuation brother. I just stated his belief and his position. And I didn’t say because he believe on that, we get the right to determine our future. Absolutely not. In fact I do believe the Eritrean independence came by the blood of our heroes not by voting (the so called referendum) for self-determination. So don’t be bitter about it. I just stated his belief . And anything from what I have stated, if you find something wrong, come on and disprove it. We didn’t get our independence on a silver plate. Just be fair and don’t twist the argument brother. The argument was on his position towards Eritrean issue, and it is squarely like what I put it.

            Senay Mishet.

            Hawka Amanuel

          • Jo

            Selamat Amanuel,

            Exactly!! that is what I am talking about, actually, his position is that of subjugating Eritrea by all means possible. One moment he was telling us not to scratch our wounds ( he gave us comfort of sorts by those words), and the next he was spraying Eritrea with missiles. He was trying to appear as if he supports Eritrean independence, when, actually, he had a theory that Eritrea eventually would want to join Ethiopia, and he did everything in his power and with every breath he could master to put things in the frame of his mind set. What he couldn’t achieve militarily, he was trying to do it with sweet talk, what he couldn’t achieve by employing both, he was trying to do it by isolating Eritrea diplomatically and with sanctions. I don’t know how you failed to see that, unless ofcourse you want to ignore it. If it is about what he achieved to his nation and people, then, Ethiopians should say so. When Ethiopians say he was a great leader I will take their word, and I will say kudos for him. If Ethiopia is progressing in a way that satisfies Ethiopians and he is to be credited for it then I will join Ethiopians in lauding him, otherwise when it comes to Eritrea, I am sorry to say, he is another Ethiopian ruler.

            Luwam zelewo leiti!!

          • haileTG

            Hey Jo, is this independence euphoria or what? Quick question, you paint us, Eritreans, has pretty hapless, easy and anything can be done to them and gotten away with. That sound some sorry a55 scenario to me. BTW is that only towards TPLF or you think we are like that to any body who want to practice their kick boxing for a past tome 🙂

          • Amanuel Hidrat

            Haw Jo,

            You always Surprise me (vacillating to the right and to the left).

            You sound at one time magnanimous and at another time rejectionist (to peace) entangled with bitterness. I understand your bitterness. I don’t know what stand you had during the war; whether you were from those who were drum beaters or from those who fought to prevent the war by voicing against it. Unlike you who is bitter on the result of the war, I am bitter ( that I couldn’t prevent it from happening, because I understood the carnage of wars. If the two society live on bitterness, you shouldn’t rule out the possibilities of war again. So I want to tell you that bitterness is always the precursor of wars. To avoid it we have to soften our bitterness.

            Second, I don’t know whether it is a lesson to the world or to me only. You infer from your bitterness that individuals with “accolade of greatness” can be pronounced by his/her inhabitants only. I took a note on you and the subject. With that I will leave it for awatistas to see the validity of your message.

            Senay MeAlti,

            Amanuel Hidrat

          • Jo

            Selamat Amanuel,

            I was and am always against war. I am not bitter, I am far from it. The notion of magnanimity is not to deny or ignore the facts, but to acknowledge it accept it and try to reconcile with it. To compromise the integrity of truth for the sake of magnanimity is counter productive and it may get us mired in another mess. I am all for magnanimity, as long as one is comfortable enough to accept the truth and take responsibility for his/her actions.

            Yeah! I believe one has to be merited by his compatriots. I don’t know how anyone could justify any leader against his compatriots, who is, in this case, allegedly “democratically” elected. Personally, I believe, he (Melles) should be held responsible, for all that happened, in east africa at large, like the rest of the leaders there.

            I have no bitterness or hard feelings towards any one, I am just stating the facts. How anyone could be an advocate of human rights here and get a blind eye there is beyond me, as I believe human rights is universal and the measuring stick is straight (…should be straight). 🙂

            Luwam zeleow meAlti!!

    • Kokhob Selam

      You Ethiopians and Eritreans, what is wrong even if Meles use to believe that Eritrean will rejoin Ethiopia? there is nothing wrong if you put yourself in his place. absolutely nothing. a politician like that great man can think and work for it and still be respected as far as he don’t hurt others and give freedom to others to think and work the way the believe is right. The man officially declared Eritreans should get their freedom and he work with his country men against all odds. within his journey, he can dream to See Ertireans convinced to rejoin and make one nation. I don’t see anything wrong on this. what is needed is to be matured and work for good of people. He use to admire how great fighters we are and how much we have fought for our freedom. he didn’t say the struggle for our nation was useless and wrong.

      what good is to have a leader like DIA ? even if he stay thousand years he will never think like Meles the man who dead under 60 years. in fact the entire PFDJ leadership with it’s all mechanism will not start to think the way Meles thought of the future. so leave alone this man in peace.

      our struggle to separate Eritrea from Ethiopia was to have our democratic administration, not to take Eritrea to Mars. what is then to have a nation that suffers more than Hailesalse’s or Mengstu Era. nothing at all. if National freedom was a transit to build a democratic nation then let’s go from this current nonsense situation by removing PFDJ. if not we are failed state like our Libyan and Somalian bothers who were under Italy although we are suppose to be better.

      now we Eritreans are in tough time, staying under PFDJ for this much years, reinforces the idea of the world that says we can’t manage a nation. PFDJ don’t have problem even don’t care. the hopeless bloody group is saying “teqodo qodo entezeyqo hintato”. we need to save the nation that was found by our hard struggle. we don’t have to blame others.

      • Yodita

        Dear Kokhob Selam,

        In this website, you are perhaps the most reconciliatory, the most honest and even the most earnest (not to mention the most artistict in view of your gifted poetry). I have come to read you and respect you so much that you are home and the dignity that we are trying to hang on to. You are the unsung hero, the humble and the generous. Thank you Kokhob and may God bless you infinitely!!

        • Hayat Adem

          Truly truly so. KS, you may know it and probably you may not care knowing it but you are warm loveable.

      • Ermias

        KS, well said. I have given an analogy here before stating that whatever Melles did ended up being good for Ethiopia and whatever IA did and is doing has been detrimental to Eritrea so much so that it’s continuity as a nation is under serious doubt. Melles is described by many ill-informed Eritreans as a beggar, a tool in the toolbox of the West, you name it. IA is described as this steel and iron man who stood up to the US, to weyane, espousing self-reliance as the guiding principle, you name it. Okay, compare and contrast Ethio v Eri.

        KS, you have now effectively dethroned me from my shrine as Yodita and Hayat Adem are jumping all over the place like little girls for you. I just hope my ‘shkor’ mekabateri remains. Lol (I hate using this, reminds me of Nitricc but I had to in this case to indicate that I am joking).

      • Kokhob Selam

        thank you Yodita,Hayta and Ermias. I have got from you a lot of lessons. it is a blessing to get such appreciation from you all.
        Hayata You may have missed my massages back but I have said the same to you (search and you will find it). I was worried when you were ill and even I have a poem on those days that shows the strength of will. will you like to read it again it is in jebana on the same days you inform us you are sick. thank you all.

        • Kokhob Selam

          this was the poem Hayata

          ዕትብቲ ኮኾብ ሰላም • 7 months ago

          …..ኣውንታውነቱን መኽሰባቱን………

          ሰብ እንተሓሚሙ ኣይተሕምመኒ ዶ ብል ኮይኑ:-
          እዚ ‘ውን መኽሰብ ኣለዎ ፈጣሪ እንተኣመስጊኑ:-
          ጥዕና ክልምኖ ሓይሊ ኣምላኽ ኣሚኑ:-
          ድሕሪ እዩ ሕክምናን ንያትን ኣፍረይቲ ዝኾኑ::

          እቲ ኣምላኽና ክፈጥረና እንከሎ: –
          ይህበና እዩ ድረዐ ኣብ ውሽጥና ይተኽሎ:-
          ንኹሉ ተጻእቦታት ገጢሙ ክከላኸሎ:
          ከም ሰራዊት ተዋጋ ኣይ ዓጢቑ ኣድብዮ ኣሎ::

          እቲ ዝደለ ኣውንታዊ ትምኒት ተስፋ ኣብ ኣእምሮ:-
          ኣእምሮ ብግደኡ ናብ ኣካል የሰጋግሮ:-
          “ግጠም “ ይብሎ ይእዝዞ ይሕብሮ:-
          በዚ ኢና ደቂ- ሰባት ንሕማም ንሰግሮ::

          እቲ ምንታይ ‘ሲ

          ካብ ዋህዮ – ነብሰ ኣምበት ጀሚሩ:-
          ነቲ ዝደኸመ ተካኢ ፈጢሩ:-
          ጽክታት ክሳድ ጸዓዱ ዋህዮታት ኣበራቢሩ:-
          ብተግባር ኢኻ ትሪኦ ከሕዊየና ሰሚሩ::

          ስለ’ዚ ‘ ኳ እዮም ዓበይቲ ምሁራት :-
          ኣብ ንጥረ- ነገር ይኹን ሰነ- ህይወት ምኩራት:-
          ዝመኽሩና ኩሉ ግዜ ንኣውንታውነት:-
          ኣእምሮ መእንቲ ከመንጩ ተጻዋርነት::

          ማተሪያሊስት ይኹን ኣይዲያሊስት እምንቶ:-
          ማለት ቁስ -ኣካላዊ ይኹን ሓስባዊ ርኢቶ:-
          ምርምር እንተጀሚሩ ስነ ፍልጠት ክኸፍቶ:-
          ግደ ኣውንታውነት ኣይስሕቶን እዩ ከቶ::

          ርኣዩ:-

          ዝኾነ ሕማም ዝበርተዐ እንተበርተዐ:-
          ፈጣሪ ሂቡና እዩ ተዋጋ ኣይ ድርዐ:-
          ምስ ኩሉ ኣካላትና ተጸግዐ;-
          ምንባርና ክንቅጽል ተጻብኦ እንዳመንዐ::

          ድሕሪ ኡ ድማ ኣብ ‘ታ ክሽነና :-
          ኣብ ‘ታ ገዛና – ኣብ’ታ ውሻጠና:-
          ኣይንረስዕ ኣፋውስ ከም ዘለና:-
          ኩሎም ጠቀምቲ እዮም እንተኣስተብሂልና::

          ማይ እንተበልካ ሓቦ ሶዳ – መዓር:-
          እንተኸፊታ መጻሕፍቲ ምርምር:-
          ኣየናይ ዓይነት ነየናይ ሕማም ይሰብር:-
          ብ ኡነት ሓቂ እዩ ንፈትኖ ንጽዓር:-

          ዶብ ኣልቦ ሓይልን ክአለት ዘለካ ኦ ፈጣሪ :- ንዝኾነ መሰናኽል ህይወት ክንገጥም ሓይሊ ሃበና::

          ኣሜን፡

          ዕትብቲ ኮኾብ ሰላም

          ዕትብቲ ኮኾብ ሰላም ዕትብቲ ኮኾብ ሰላም • 7 months ago

          ዋህዮ – ነብሰ ኣምበት means cell ( ዋህዮ as word was used by EPLF during first aid courses while ነብሰ ኣምበ was used by ELF during first aid courses.)

          please use the word ኣውንታ as positive. this poem is about positive thinking.

          • Hayat Adem

            I even missed this poem from KS to me?! Shame on me!! I love it. Thanks.

  • Semere Andom

    The hope from Pretoria lurched the forum to a heated debate.

    Two winners in this debate, our host Saleh Gadi and Emma, the first for pleading the Eritrean version of the “fifth”: “weriduni gual qeshi”. For those who are not familiar with “gual qeshi”, it is the nick-name for the first amendment in the Eritrean constitution of 1997, so SGJ conjured his constitutionally treasured right and he is the winner. Emma is also a winner for his prognosis was right on, the futility of scratching old wounds. The rest of us are losers but the biggest loser (it is a compliment to lose in this particular debate) was Sal and after consulting with Dr. Saba, I am here by diagnosing him with the “comparing akat and gaba syndrome” for this statement: “Your argument that if he treats his citizens one way he must treat foreigners the same way doesn’t stand up to scrutiny: what did he do with the Brits who, he claims, were on assassination mission? Weren’t they “pardoned”? I am also prescribing him this: http://www.torontowaterfrontmarathon.com/en/details.htm to be administered in October of this year

    But I am still covering the revocation of Haile’s tile, but the recent debate distracted it and the sessions have been cancelled in preparation for the debate that is brewing between Hayat Adem and Sal. Sal is surrounded by three laptops, one on his right one in his left and one directly facing him. His right hand has unbelievably long finger nails, so I asked why? He replied that this hand is for typing replies to Hayat, the left one with normal finger nails is for commenting and replying to the rest of awatistas, his long legs on his desk are pointing to the third laptop and he tells me he types with his legs when dealing with ghedli de-romantics, who he genially calls “ghedli-skeptics”. I use “akudir” with the ghedli-skeptics he added:-)

    I learned from the renowned private Eye instigator Ermias that Hayat lives close to the AT headquarters and so I drove to her location, where I found her with three laptops, her right hand had very long finger nails as well and she told me that this is dedicated when debating with Sal and the left to the rest. Her hair was braided and the braids were firmly erect like horns and she said that she types using her braids when Sal is debating with the tongue firmly in cheek:-)

    End of baldonga

    Sem

    • Kim Hanna

      Dear Semere Andom,
      I think you are a little diplomatic in your reporting. You are partially correct. You have to call it the way it unfolded. The correct reporting follows:
      The debate was like no other. It was the heavyweight championship. Yes, you are right that SAAY lost this fight. He was knocked out. The new heavyweight champion of Awate.com is now T.K, that is short for T. Kifle.
      T.K applied a lot of left jabs to the dancing opponent and finally the right upper cut that put the old undisputed champ on the canvas. The old champ got up but in a daze. They asked him what year it was .. he was still thinking.
      T.K beat SAAY by a knock out, that is the headline.
      K.H