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Eritrean Resistance Forces Need An Effective Umbrella

After almost a year-long polarization, the National Council (NC) of the Eritrean National Council for Democratic Change (ENCDC) will convene an emergency meeting in Ethiopia from December 15 to 19, 2014.

The NC is composed of 127 members, 19 of whom are not available: some have resigned, some have died and some are unreachable.

On December 1, 2014, The EC issued its final call for all NC members to attend. As of last week, 91 NC members have confirmed that they will attend the emergency meeting.

Background

In 2012, the Executive Committee (EC) of the ENCDC formed five subcommittees to represent it in their respective zones in the Diaspora. Some of the leaders of the zones began to act independently from EC by creating autonomous power bases. Consequently, a conflict was ignited between the EC and the subcommittees resulting in polarization between the leadership of the National Assembly and the Executive Committee.

The ENCDC, which was instituted in November 2011 and has a two-year mandate, has been completely paralyzed for over two years.

In the summer of this year, a preparatory committee (PC) was formed to schedule the second congress of ENCDC.  Again, due to differences over technical issues within the ENCDC, it was unable to perform its mandate.

Some argue that the lack of progress is understandable because the ENCDC, a large resistance umbrella movement containing diverse Eritrean political and social groups, is the first of its kind.  This comes even from those who rate its performance as appalling. 

Since its formation, the NA has been ravaged by rivalry. Still, many of its members have shown extraordinary commitment in protecting it, seeing it as a unique achievement and a significant milestone in the long struggle for the democratization of Eritrea.

Vocal critics have dismissed the ENCDC.

Regardless of the reasons, it is clear that the ENCDC has failed in providing the leadership expected from it and inadvertently created a vacuum within the Eritrean resistance camp. This, in turn, encouraged the formation of tens of ineffective, but otherwise well-meaning Diaspora based entities.

Obstacles

One of the reasons for ENCDC ineffectiveness is that, immediately after its formation in Hawassa, another group was launched in Debrezeit. The youth who were supposed to be the torch bearers of ENCDC now had a new platform: the “Debrezeit youth conference” which contributed further to the fragmentation of the Eritrean opposition forces.

Exacerbating this was the aforementioned conflict between the Executive Committee and the zonal sub committees.

The ENCDC’s EC offices are based in Ethiopia. This has been the cause of much vilification by rival forces who live in Western countries, mostly scheduling their activities around their vacation and retirement goals, while the Addis Abeba-based opposition are full timers.

Now, with the rank-and-file applying strong pressure, the spokesman of the NC has issued positive and reconciliatory statement confirming he and his team will attend the emergency meeting.

What Next?

The agenda of the preparatory committee is future-oriented. Still, if past performance is an indicator, there is fear that the meeting will devote most of its time to discussing history instead of planning for the future. The facts show that the differences have been discussed exhaustively over the last two years on public media and further bickering is unlikely to resolve the dispute.

The NC would be well-advised to encourage its members to overlook minor differences, rise to the occasion, assume responsibility, and help the ENCDC move forward.

Transitioning to democracy after decades of tyrannical rule is not an easy task, but that is a road the opposition forces have chosen to travel.

Bringing diverse people from different political persuasion and social background is not an easy task; we hope the experience of the past helps those participating to be magnanimous enough to help advance our common goal of salvaging our people and our country. This is a historic opportunity and taking advantage of it could help us redeem ourselves of past mistakes and move on with resolve, commitment and determination to win against the tyranny in Asmara.

Finally, we hope that the NA will consider the following suggestions:

  1. It’s vital that the second congress is convened no later than the beginning of the summer of 2015. The NC should set a fixed date to hold congress within six-months.
  2. There are forces outside the ENCDC umbrella and the ENCDC should spare no effort to persuade them to join. It’s a known fact that some of them have reservations; if all sides are appreciative of the seriousness of the situation inside Eritrea, and the state of the resistance, they should be willing to break the ice and join hands.
  3. The NA should identify political parties and civil association and determine the conditions of joining. Unknown entities should not be allowed to wreak havoc in the struggle as was witnessed in the Hawassa congress where recognition of a group required only a payment of $100 registration fee. Participation should be limited to serious and known entities.
  4. The task of the PC is serious and it should be manned by competent individuals. Members of the PC who do not see in themselves the skills to carry out the expected duties should be encouraged to withdraw and be replaced by competent persons.
  5. Start to talk about the management of security and military wings and bring them under a unified command.
  6. To advance participatory democracy and allow interactive discussions, we strongly urge the ENCDC to have its meetings broadcasted live in the Internet.

Hoping to see the revival of the Eritrean spirit, we appeal to the wisdom of the NC and wish them a truly successful meeting.

Related Reading:
List of names of National Council members elected at Hawassa in 2011

About Awate Team

The Awate Team is a group of individuals who collaborate in preparing editorial contents that mainly appear under the PENCIL signature and other columns that carry the Awate Team signature. It represents the collective team's view.

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  • Abraham Hanibal

    Dear Solomon G;
    I think you’ve to re-read my comment, I didn’t say that I think there exists in Ethiopia political parties more favorable to Eritrea than the EPRDF; I was just asking if there are any such parties because I don’t have a closer knowledge of the policies of the diverse Ethiopian parties outside the EPRDF coalition. As far as the EPRDF is concerned, it has constantly shown that it is anti-Eritreans by refusing to abide by its obligations, and leave the Eritreans concentrate their efforts in resolving their internal problems.
    I know that the EPRDF had supported Eritrean Independence, and that is something to be appreciated, even though Eritreans had secured their Independence through 30-years struggle and a democratic referendum. But all this is history, I’m speaking about policies anno 2014.

    • Solomon T.

      Dear Abraham,
      It seems you really believe that Ethiopia is occupying territories that belong to Eritrea. You couldn’t be any further from the truth.

    • Solomon T.

      Dear Abraham,

      It seems you are really losing sleep thinking that Ethiopia is occupying territories that belong to Eritrea. In case it helps you sleep better, let me state the truth for you one more time (not that you haven’t heard it before).

      Badime and all the other pieces of land that you keep demanding Ethiopia to vacate are Ethiopian villages which were put on Eritrea’s side of the border by mistake because the 5 old men in the Hague were too lazy to check the facts on the ground before they passed the arbitrary border delimitation decision (in some cases based on maps unilaterally drawn by Italy). Those pieces of land have never been administered under Eritrea since its inception as a separate entity and they are and have always been inhabited by Ethiopian citizens. The land belongs to Ethiopian citizens who have lived in those areas for millennia and if you believe Ethiopia will vacate those territories without negotiating what to do with its citizens who are the real owners of their ancestral land, you are mistaken. So for the sake of your own sanity, please focus on getting rid of the mad men in Asmara who have been the real obstacles to a meaningful resolution of the border issue.

      Solomon

      • Abraham Hanibal

        Dear Solomon;
        I think is it not serious to reduce the work of the EEBC that took two years to finalise, as the work of “five lazy old men”. The process of finding a solution to the border dispute based on colonial treaties was agreed upon by both governments, and the outcome was supposed to be final, irrespective of its implications to the sides. When Ethiopia entered the Algiers Agreement and EEBC process, it had no knowledge of whether Badme or any other villages it was administering would fall on its or Eritrea’s side of the border.
        The refusal of Ethiopia to abide by the ruling and its obligations, breaking international law, is the heart of the problem between the two countries. The actual reason why Ethiopia is reneging on complying is the symbolic value of the area. especially, because it can be seen which ever part that loses this village is to blame for the war and seen as the losing side. In addition to this, the EPRDF had invested a huge effort in convincing the Ethiopian people that Badme belongs to Ethiopia, and had caused a great loss of Ethiopian human and material assets to re-gain the village. Under such circumstanses, it was a bitter pill to swallow for the EPRDF, to admit the loss of Badme in front of its people.

      • House of Stark

        Hi Solomon T
        Did Badime inhabitant participated in Eritrea’s referendum in 1993?.

        • T. Kifle

          No, they didn’t

        • Haile WM

          sure they did

        • Rodab

          HoS,
          What does that mean exactly? Eritreans inside the country and outside participated on the referendum.
          Badme was under Ethiopian administration. If that is what you wanted to know.

          • House of Stark

            Hi Rodab

            If Eritrean from Australia to the USA, from Sweden to South Africa can participated in the referendum, why not a village in the boarder. That is if you believe they are Eritrean and the land belong to Eritrea. Yet four years after the referendum you open a war to reclaim the land and the people who did not participated in the referendum.

            IIRC, Addis as well was under Ethiopian administration and yet Eritreans in Addis participated in the referendum.

  • Nitricc

    Okay SAAY and Haile let’s close this thread with lesson learned. First, I do believe, sometimes venting is good. Make no mistake, it will happen again. Like everything else; Entropy is good to any system once in a while. So, when you have the week we have witnessed, there are lessons we all can take home.
    One thing I personally learn in a debate is what I have acquired and adapted one of Miguel Ruiz’s Agreement. “Don’t take personally” in my opinion here where Haile down fall is. He cares so much, he takes things personally then emotion and anger takes over. Here are the four agreements and see for your self. I use them in my every day life and they made my life simpler.
    The four agreements are as follow. I quote.
    1) Don’t Take Anything Personally!
    Nothing others do is because of you. What others say and do is a projection of their own dream. When you are immune to the opinions and actions of others, you won’t be the victim of needless suffering.

    2) Be Impeccable with Your Word!
    Speak with integrity. Say only what you mean. Avoid using the word to speak against yourself or to gossip about others. Use the power of your word in the direction of the truth.

    3) Don’t Make Assumptions!
    Find the courage to ask questions and to express what you really want. Communicate with others as clearly as you can to avoid misunderstandings, sadness, and drama. With just this one agreement, you can completely transform your life.

    4) Always Do Your Best!
    Your best is going to change from moment to moment; it will be different when you are healthy as opposed to sick. Under any circumstance, simply do your best, and you will avoid self-judgment, self-abuse, and regret.
    END of qt

    The moral of the story; don’t take it personally!

  • Abraham Hanibal

    As Ethiopia walks the path of democracy, one would ask whether there are any political parties in Ethiopia that have a differing view as regards relations with Eritrea than the EPRDF policies, and whether such parties are tolerated? The policies of EPRDF towards Eritrea have been destructive to this day as exemplified by their intransigence to comply by the border ruling, thereby creating the endless no war no peace situation that has hurt the Eritrean people greatly. These policies have so far been based on developing Ethiopia at the expense of Eritrea, by continuing to occupy productive Eritrean lands and compelling Eritrea to be at never ending alert situation. It is also not exagerating to claim that this status quo has caused economic harm to Ethiopia, and especially the Tigryans who had a much closer socio-economic relations with Eritreans. With this background, and considering the political atmosphere that is available in Ethiopia, it is natural to ask whether there are other political parties that would like to reverse this situation and aim for a balanced relationship that focusses on cooperation and collective development rather than the narrow line of thinking of the EPRDF?

    Having said this, I don’t deny that much of the problems faced by Eritrean today are caused by the policies of Isayas and his PFDJ. I’m just trying to look at the situation from the perspective of the EPRDF and Ethiopian politics towards Eritrea and the need of resolving the border impase.

    • Hayat Adem

      Abraham,
      The answer to you question is (in my opinion): yes, there are and yes, they are tolerated. But, as far as I know, EPRDF is the best shot and most favoring as far as Eritrea is concerned.
      Hayat

      • Abraham Hanibal

        Hayat Adem;
        Isn’t it contadictory of you to answer positively to my question, and at the same time claim that the EPRDF, that continues to occupy sovereign Eritrean territory and hence contribute to the suffering of the Eritrean people, is “the best shot and most favoring as far as Eritrea is concerned”?

        • Hayat Adem

          No. It is only because you were looking for one. Abraham please, you are flogging a dead horse over and over. and become boring. For the sake of saving you from yourself, I want you to get these 10 points (5 facts, 5 analytical views) regarding the border-sovereign-occupation mantra, and I’m really hoping some of them will find their way into your mind and heart:
          1) border is ruled and delimited but not demarcated yet
          2) based on the ruling, badume which was part of ethiopia is given to eritrea

          3) based on the same ruling, the xerona area which was part of eritrea is given to ethiopia
          4) as we speak, ethiopia is sitting in badume, and eritrea in the xerona area, both pieces of lands are similar land and population size.
          5) i am not sure if you can legalistically claim “sovereign territory” before actual demarcation, but whatever you say implicates both sides in the same way. if you say ethiopia occupies eritrea’s territory based on the delimitation, the same accusation could go against eritrea.
          ————-

          6) both the ethiopian and eritrean regime give more importance to claim badume over the xerona area for slightly different motives: isaias thinks it is a prevailing point to deflect the accusation of starting the war and countless crimes and he intends to use it as a potential political scenario to weaken the ethiopian government; the ethiopians see it as a justification point for their decision to fight it out and the sacrifice paid to reverse the aggression. it is a contention over justification and vindication than over territorial sovereignty at all.

          7) i agree on the fact that the border needs to be conclusively settled one way or the other but the argument you so incessantly advance that territory transfers will help the struggle against isaias is flawed; to the contrary, it would embolden him. the struggle has never been short of matrial; eritreans have more than enough much more bigger and lethal materials to work on to remove isaias.

          8) the border is not an urgent priority now as you seem to be obsessed with; but even if it were, isias would never be able to fix it because eebc is gone, unmee is gone, tsz is gone and it will require new infrastructure and rounds of talks to re-initialize the implementation process. it has effectively become an issue of task for the next government.
          9) the eritrean youth crossing the south border in thousands defying the risks on their life are not going there to negotiate about the border, they are practically telling you “f— off the border”. while your eyes are fixed on the land, the owners of the land are crossing to the other side.
          10) if we couldn’t get eprdf come to the table to sign and seal it and pack off of Badime 10 years ago when there were unmee and eebc, when we had no sanction on top of our roof, when we were not isolated as a country, when we had a better standing in the defense army, when the entire world was calling for the immediate demarcation, when there were no mass exodus of our youth towards south and elsewhere,…what gives you hope that we can get the eprdf do it now at this time?

          now, drop the border mantra and get to work to remove the monster. then you will have your border and your people.

          Hayat

          • Kim Hanna

            Selam Hayat Adem,
            .
            Wow, this particular response to Abraham about the border issue should be a template default answer anytime it is raised. Its quality and design speaks directly to professors and high school dropouts alike, at the same time.
            .
            I just thought of something, I think you forgot another institution when you mentioned UNMEE, EEBC as being gone. MELES.
            .
            K.H

          • Hayat Adem

            Thanks K. H. very true, he will be missed in every corner and sector.
            hayat

    • Rodab

      Hello Abraham,
      I too am of the opinion that the Woyanes (or EPRDF, by its jacket name) are more favorable on issues of interest to Eritrea, and I would keep them in power for as long as possible. I see no motivation for other Ethiopian political forces to outdo the Woyanes in favoring Eritrea because whatever support they get would be more by being tough on Eritrea than the other way around.
      One thing to note is, as Ethiopia develops its infrastructure and specially linkages to various sea outlets, the once hotly-debated issue of relation with Eritrea is declining and disappearing from Ethiopian politics.
      P.S. May I say many times I find me ageeing with your views, fully.

      • Abraham Hanibal

        Dear Rodab;

        I will quote two of your sentences:

        1)”I see no motivation for other Ethiopian political forces to outdo the Woyanes in favoring Eritrea because whatever support they get would be more by being tough on Eritrea than the other way around.”

        2)”One thing to note is, as Ethiopia develops its infrastructure and specially linkages to various sea outlets, the once hotly-debated issue of relation with Eritrea is declining and disappearing from Ethiopian politics.”
        I see a contradiction on the above two sentences, because if the case in no.2 is true, then one would expect that some Ethiopian political parties would rather look the other way-the way of respect of rule of law, reconciliation, and economic cooperation.

        • Rodab

          Hi Abraham,
          There isn’t contradiction. Regardless of the level of attention given to relations with Eritrea, Ethiopian politics will continue to favor those who do the tough talks. That is why the Woyane’s increase the volume during election seasons. Let’s also remember that the Ethiopian democracy hasn’t leveled the ground yet where opposition groups can run with no restrictions and win on platforms such as those you listed. The experience of election is still at its early stage.

        • Tesfabirhan WR

          Dear Abraham,

          We have a complete harmony on our domestic policy but completely different on Foreign policy. Dealing with Ethiopia is a matter of our own choice. They have every right to decide their own foreign policy and if it is arranged in such away that it undermines Eritrean Sovereignity, it is their own problem. Why I care on their foreign policy? Who cares about the dead fish except the spoling bacteria in which PFDJ is doing.

          abraham, I kindly request you to draw a clear foreign policy of your own. The question is, if Ethiopia has a destructive policy towards Eritrea like that of 30 years war, it is ok. We have challenged it. Now, Ethiopia and Eritrea are equal. based on this equallity, we chave equal opportunity to select our own policies.

          Ethiopia played a double standard foreign policy on Eritrea. First, it created an external NOPEACE-NO WAR policy targeting only to Eritrea. Second, she promoted PEACE and DEVELOPMENT internally and internationally. This is a double brain’s man work.

          On the other hand, PFDJ declared only one policy. No Peace – No war, both internally and externally. And it targets everybody, every country and every international institute.

          Are we then going to blame Ethiopia for here double brain’s work policy? You know why PMZ is nicknamed a “A mman with a Double Brain”?

          Therefore, we need to have such fine quality of policy strategy. If not, we will not survive on this “Natural-Selection” process. The world is selecting a policy and we can not get stack to one-brain hate based anti PEACE AND DEVELOPMENT POLICY of PFDJ.

          Due you respect is still there.

          hawka
          tes

      • Tesfabirhan WR

        Dear Rodab,

        If you are calling the mutually based strategy of former fighters work as a favour, I can only say, I am sorry to read this from you. We didn’t beg our independence. Let’s remember our martyrs when we talk up to this low level.

        hawka
        tes

        • Rodab

          Hey Tes,
          The topic is on the incoming Ethiopian election and as to which political party’s policy would be more favorable for our nation comparatively. Did you misread me?

          • Tesfabirhan WR

            Dear Rodab,

            Probably and I aplogize if I did. Yet, I do believe that there is no favorablity. Why Ethiopia should make a favor on us? Mutuaul respect and favorism are different. I read you from this angle.

            Dear Rodab, I don’t buy politics of favor. If they are doing a favor, it is only because our policy is against them and I oppose policies that oppose other parties.

            I wish the same in Ethiopia, but our fight, as Eritreans should be for PEACE qnd DEVELOPMENT and this can only be done by ourselves. We can not external policy channel to be favored on us.

            Thank you Engineer Rodab!

            hawka
            tes

    • haileTG

      Hi again Abraham,

      I know your question is for Ethiopians or those who would know it intimately. My take here is to share how I would view authoritarianism in Ethiopia vs Eritrea. EPRDF is a party based authoritarian system. Such systems are highly stable and “change” in their systems really amounts to protracted process of reform over very long time. They are pretty well covered from sudden collapse or exit from power. Other such examples are countries in South East Asia’s Tiger economies and even China itself.

      Authoritarianism in Eritrea is personal. The party is has neither control or influence. Such systems are highly likely to suddenly collapse, regardless of there being replacement (Mengistu’s down fall following series of military setbacks and there being EPRDF with full force to replace it completely), or Somalia, Iraq… where the regimes collapsed without clear replacement. When a personal dictator finally falls, there is high chances of extreme violence kicking in that could take decades to resolve.

      Given the current situation in Eritrea, the regime is under high pressure externally and internally and would likely be washed over by some sudden trigger events that would cascade out of control. And, normally, all sorts of power struggle would ensue if no replacement is primed now. Where as, however way we see the EPRDF to be, that is likely to stay much longer than we think. And this brings us to the question, whether it is better to look for replacement options or resolving of our differences somewhat. The border impasse is well understood and needless to re-explain it again.

      Regards

      • Abraham Hanibal

        Dear Haile;
        As you see my comment here is centered purely around the current no war no peace situation between the two countries and Ethiopia’s role in the situation. As far as the internal situation of Eritrea is concerned and your analysis about it, I’ve pretty much the same understanding as yours. But I believe that the EPRDF government is more to blame than the PFDJ for the border impasse, and the resulting continued displacement of those people who used to live in some of those occupied areas. I see the resolution or non-resolution of this issue is central to resolving the differences between us. I don’t think the negative impacts of this issue on the Ethiopian economy are insignificant either. I believe dialogue is important, however Ethiopia has to show a good will aiding a conducive atmosphere for dialogue. Withdrawing from those occupied territories is the main sign of good-will and reconciliation. But to this day, the EPRDF has rejected this.

        • haileTG

          Hello Abrham,

          I support the border ruling because we, on both sides, have too many ditractors wishing to see permnent hostilities. Hence, the ruling is the simplest route. I see the no war no peace ramification to Eritrea to be a made in Eritrea poison pill that has no external market even in Ethiopia. It is only consumed inside Eritrea. Its effects is slow death as mass flight of youth, isolation, civil war, ethinc and religious strif, national fragmantation and loss of Eritrea for good. Different actors sell this pill aggressively in Eritrean politics for different agenda. But no one is fooled and we know it is a poison pill, but it is the damn box again.

          Regards

          • Hope

            But Haile,with all due respect and with all your Greatness,,why can’t you swallow the bitter Truth,as did Bro Abraham,despite the same position he has like yours,that the EPRDF,a Party Based Authoritarian System,has contributed a lot to our problem?
            I am just saying—–

          • haileTG

            Hope

            OK here goes:

            – the EPRDF refused to implement constitution

            – the EPRDF disbanded Eritrean national assembly and liquidated Eritrean reformers

            – the EPRDF froze all economic activities, denied the traders business licensing, banned import export, banned handling hard currency, blockaded customs and excise

            – the EPRDF shut down the only accredited University

            – the EPRDF refused farmers to sell their produce in the market and the same with fishermen and their catches

            – the EPRDF abolished workers pension

            – the EPRDF extended military service on the guise of no peace no war and is saying it will return it to normal regardless of no peace no war

            – the EPRDF refused Eritrean engineers and doctors to work priately in their own time

            – the EPRDF undermined national bank and stashes national resources in privately owned HCBE

            – the EPRDF replaced courts and justice system with special courts and disappears at will

            – the EPRDF decided 17 year olds to go to SAWA and removed the right of students to choose their fields of study

            – the EPRDF even removes citizenship and burial rights

            – the EPRDF removed travel rights outside of the country

            – the EPRDF banned freedom of speech, association and faith

            – the EPRDF involved in human trafficking inside Asmara where payments of ransom were made to PFDJ regime offices (as evidence is submitted and deposited with the UN)

            – the EPRDF asks Eritrean farmers to go for militia training at the time of harvest so that it can harvest it using agelglot and take 50/50

            – the EPRDF uses agelglot for free labor including building regime villas and working plantations

            – the EPRDF engages in contraband economy within Eritrea proper

            – the EPRDF invited terror linked dahir aweys to Asmara to live for 4 years and made us work with al shabab as testified by a recently defected PFDJ official…

            Gosh that is too many pills hope, like to help out and take some of them yourself?…huh…so I thought

          • Tesfabirhan WR

            Dear haile TG,

            where can I get these pills please? I searched them but I couldn’t find. I need your urgent help.

            You blessed man, stay alive and on this occasion, I want to express my best of best wishes for 2015. Happy Noël haile TG hawey. I love you so much!

            hawka
            tes

          • haileTG

            Kbur Tes,

            May I wish all the best and much more for the New Year and ever more.

            You see tes, our political agenda should clearly focus on OUR OWN PROBLEMS. But, since PFDJ is politically bankrupted, its alternative is to join the opposition and oppose us from discussing our problems. Eritrean problems is haram to discuss, and Ethiopian is halal in its new strategy. If the people silenced from discussing (basically bullshitted with “what is you plan” mambo jambo) and only exposed to its vile propaganda, all they will chose is to quietly abandon the land and no nqhat to challenge it.

            Our politics is not external politics, not even grandeur dreams as becoming on par with the “average poor African country”. Our politics is to force the PFDJ hand to cease its hold on power. Our legitimacy is nothing more than our predicament. By trying to shut the avenue to discuss our problems, it is betting that it can dislodge the justness of our cause.

            Sadly, many are collaborating with such strategy by collusion or delusion. Our political struggle must be to put test and cut to size those elements. PFDJ itself can no longer tackle us politically, it is defeated on that front for good. However, its failed argument of externalizing our problems and denunciation of justice seekers with high treason is being fed by agency of saboteurs. Those who can only discuss Ethiopia and entertainment. ሕጂ እውን ጸገምና ኣብ ምቅላሕ እንገብሮ ጻዕሪ ክሕንኩሉ፡ ራኢና ራኢ ውድቀት ክኸውን ዝጉስጉሱ፡ ፖለቲካዊ ሃልክና ድማ መጽረይ ረሳሕ ፖለቲካ ህግደፍ ክኸውን ዘውደኽድኹ ብኣልማማ ጸፋጺፍና፡ ምስ ህግደፍ ኣብ ባይታ በጥ ኣቢልና ከነስታርሮም ኢና። ብሽብን ጉብን ዓጢቆም፡ ኣብ ዝተነነወ ዓንዲ ህግደፍ ጠልጠል ኢሎም፡ ንቕሓትና ጎቢኦም፡ መሳርዕና ክብትኑ ዝገብርዎ ሓፍ ፈጠቕ፡ ብዘይ ንሕስያ ክንቀራስሞን ነበራያ ነበረ ክንገብሮን፡ ይግባእ። ሽግርና፡ ሽግር እዋናዊ ክውንነት ኤርትራን ኤርትራውን እዩ። ካብዚኣ ዝቀለለት መዓቀኒ ስለዘየላ፡ ህጁሞም ናብ ረብሓና እናቀየርና፡ ላዕለዋይ ኢድ ፍትሒን ርትዕን ከነረጋግጽ ትንኣስ ትዕበ፡ ዝከኣለና ገይርና ሓይሊ መቐይሮ ነደንፍዓሉ፡ ኣብ ዓዘቕቲ ጌጋ ትጀፍጂፎም መጋበርያ ዓመጽ ኮይኖም ዘለዉ ድማ ዝሕወስዎ፡ ዓመተ ጻዕርን ዓወትን ንኹልና።

            Here is a song you probably heard several times:-)

            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DLkHxFkVubo

    • Nitricc

      Strange! Now TPLF and EPDRF are preferable to Eritrea and Eritreans interest?
      Well, when someone deports you taking every thing you ever owned because they did not like the color of your eyes, it means nothing they did that to you because they like you.
      When a government comes with every fire power and human resources to eradicate you from the face of the earth, means nothing, they did that because they love. When a government decides to reverse your hard won independence just to show its mightiness to its internal opponents, it means nothing they did that because they care about?
      Seriously! What other choice do they have? They tried everything there is to try and the people of Eritrea foiled it one by one. I know it is crime to give the credit when it is due.
      TPLF or EPDRF are the enemy of Eritrea and no other party in the future will be as worst enemy as TPLEPDRF. The only reason they seem preferable to you naives is you don’t know better. They tried everything to bring down Eritrea and Eritrea stood and fought them back. Where is the favoritism?
      If I tried to kill you and I failed to do that; do I get the credit for your living?

      • Abraham Hanibal

        Nitricc;
        Is your comment really addressed to me?

      • Hope

        Nittric:
        Here is what Bro Abraham said:
        ” The policies of EPRDF towards Eritrea have been destructive to this day as exemplified by their intransigence to comply by the border ruling, thereby creating the endless no war no peace situation that has hurt the Eritrean people greatly. These policies have so far been based on developing Ethiopia at the expense of Eritrea, by continuing to occupy productive Eritrean lands and compelling Eritrea to be at never ending alert situation. It is also not exagerating to claim that this status quo has caused economic harm to Ethiopia, and especially the Tigryans who had a much closer socio-economic relations with Eritreans. With this background, and considering the political atmosphere that is available in Ethiopia, it is natural to ask whether there are other political parties that would like to reverse this situation and aim for a balanced relationship that focusses on cooperation and collective development rather than the narrow line of thinking of the EPRDF?
        Having said this, I don’t deny that much of the problems faced by Eritreans today are caused by the policies of Isayas and his PFDJ. I’m just trying to look at the situation from the perspective of the EPRDF and Ethiopian politics towards Eritrea and the need of resolving the border impase.”
        Courtesy of Abraham..
        To me,it is fairly well balanced,compared to other “Fanatic and Extremist” positions,which soley blame the PFDJ.Abraham,to his credit,used the term “much of the problems”,eventhough my psoition would be :”partially” caused by PFDJ and to some extent by ourselves–for being “Silent Majority and for NOT challenging the PFDJ Mistakes”.

  • Kaddis

    Saay –

    Labelling ‘ all Ethiopians coming here are Woyanes’ is very random ( Terra in Amharic ) and shows your rush to label people; just based on Ethiopians arguments in relation to only the Eritrea Eth relations. There was no enough discussion
    on EPRDF policies to label all Ethiopians Woyane. This also shows – you still think Ethiopian politics revolves around Eritrea…not at all. It’s a fraction of an agenda …

    Plus – your other label ‘Ethiopia is a one party state’ doesn’t even serve your struggle of democracy in Eritrea. Why do Shabia bother to have a constitution, regular election, permission to have private media, the right to form parties, associations etc…at least to the level of Ethiopia when oppositions like you will at the end will label it as a ‘One party state’. Unless you feel better by equating Ethiopia and Eritrea in your political scale ….

    The more we discuss…the more we are driven apart …

    • saay7

      Selamat Kaddis:

      In response to Adme’s criticism, I developed the SAAY Nuance Scale, using standard polling questions (support and intensity of support for a government/administration.) In this case, support and intensity of support for the Eritrean government and the Ethiopian government. There are 25 possible outcomes for an Ethiopian, and of the 25, 4 are most prevalent in this forum. And when you look at the 4 closely, they are actually 1. Please refer to the Awatista nuance scale and see if you disagree.

      On Ethiopian (and for that matter, all African) elections, I have said our first struggle is to get Eritrea to climb up to the status of an average African election–rigged and one-party-dominated as they may be, they are better than what we have in Eritrea which is OneManocracy. Similarly, with justice, I have said that our first struggle is to get Eritrea to climb up to the status of the average African due process/justice level–corrupt they may be, but they are fat better than what we have, which is a jungle and it is so horrific that Eritreans actually miss the Derg and Janhoy days on matters of prisoners’ right.

      A former Eritrea prison guard interviewed by assenna was explaining the difference between Eritrean prisoners of Derg and Eritrean prisoners of Isaias regime. He said, an Eritrea imprisoned by the Derg will go in with elementary education and emerge out with a Ph.D; an Eritrean imprisoned by the Isaias regime will go in prison with a Ph.D and emerge out, if at all, completely broken and at Azilo (pre-school) level.

      My point is: eyes wide open over here, Kaddis. It is only in comparison to Eritrea that the Ethiopian justice system and the Ethiopian democracy is something to brag about. And if that is your standard, you are aiming low.

      • T. Kifle

        Dear SAAY,
        It would be misleading to weigh the diversity of views from the Ethiopian side here at www. Awate.com as the people with the disposition of discussing the Ethio-Eritrean political discourse are understandably few. The other point you repeatedly expressed here is Ethiopia being a one-party-state and when you say so you said it explicitly that one-party is the TPLF proper. This very simplistic characterization is of course better than what you used to spin a decade ago but clearly you have more miles to cover before you recognize the intra-party dynamism within the ruling coalition, the EPRDF.

      • Kaddis

        No Saay – I am not aiming low – I am actually discussing very low to the Eritrean level with no constitutional, electoral, judicial experience in their country; with an Eritrean opinion makers who thinks there is no positive lesson they can learn from its neighbour. Democratic Governance in simple terms is like marriage – you don’t know it unless you live it. I have seen countries like Belgium while having a government and no government, but you would not notice it since the service is spotless on both occasions. My standard is not here or there. My standard is to see my country Ethiopia out of its fragile state and embrace stability to a level of no going back to the 1974, 1991, 1998, 2005 crisis.

        If you insist – my standard or I foresee – we will be as good as India if all goes well. Chaotic, un-even, democratic for those who demand it and hell for those sit and wait, go forward and backward at the same time and develops a kind of unique mixtures of values…at the end we won’t resemble anyone… at least in my life time

        I don’t remember bragging about anything….be it democracy or justice system but recognise having a progressive government of 23 years old with no democratic precedence has some elements which one can learn from . Imagine, Ghana’s Nkrumah came to power as an opposition in the 60s… when we were hanging the Neway brothers for demanding change. You can see how fragile, one chaotic incident away Ethiopia is to go back to our fragile state when you still see discussions whether Woyane has the legitimacy to govern Ethiopia or not. I don’t know whether our oppositions are struggling to get rid of the government or the state – however blurred. What about you Eritreans …where does your struggle lie?

        My point is – you guys are too smart not to learn from EPRDF’s mistakes over the years – take some examples

        Free media – they have messed up the media enviroment by first left it unregulated, violent and extreme then they become very defensive, with no hope of having an alternative tv station for life –

        Diaspora policy – they thought giving tax free previlages for diaspora will bring knowledge and capital but ended up pushing the scarce educated doctors, engineers out of the country in disappointment

        Election – they let all the NGO’s, the private media, the endowments to gang up on them, panicked to the core, killed innocent people, shut all third party right based NGOs to a level of undermining the work of the honest ones… ( Kenya is doing the same thing but too late )

        Saay – your eyes are open but only see and repeat these vague terms like Democracy and justic system which doesn’t say much by itslef.…can we put the fact that our regional goverments few years back have decided to not to be audited by the federal government for the budgetatry support they receive every year saying we have our own Chief auditor and its their mandate – in the practicing Democracy category?..
        Are you ready to practice democracy or declare ( awaj ) democracy?

        Saay – can you at least be as ready as EPRDF was 23 years ago which could convene a peace and political convention, with a pre-prepared Charter which was capable of keeping armed oppositions like OLF, EPLF around for at least few years later to neutralise. I believe Awate.com can positively influence the political actors in Eritrea but doubt due to your strong and sometimes extreme oppinions and positions …people may find you extremely not impartial

        • saay7

          Selamat Kaddis:

          You really should write more often: I still remember your and Eyobs first post at awate forum. You might quite a compelling case and I always learn something from your posts. Now then:

          1. Yes I can learn from the EPRDF on lessons learned from its governance. And this is why this forum made a concerted effort to attract Ethiopians. If you call when you first joined, many of our awatistas were saying “why do we have Ethiopians; I thought this was an Eritrean site” and we said what matters is ones willingness to be bound by the posting guidelines not what one nationality is. The posting guidelines do forbid misrepresentation –Eritreans pretending to be Ethiopians and vice versa but its, necessarily, based on an honor system. When I bemoan the absence of Ethiopians who don’t support EPRDF it’s also because I think we could benefit from their lessons.

          2. I agree that democracy is a long and messy process and the sooner you start the sooner you learn the lessons. Generally. I tend to approach things not from a right-wrong, good-bad paradigm but from a problem-solution perspective. This often puts me at odds with my moralizing compatriots and I sometimes find myself giving advice to the Eritrean government which is incomprehensible to my compatriots because they have equated the Eri government with the Nazi party. Much as the EPRDF has come up with revolutionary-democracy model that had to adjust to Ethiopian realities, the PFDJ has shifted from its earlier allegiance to neo-liberalism to the “developmental state” model where the government dominates the whole space.

          3. In the democracy path, where you end up and how quickly you end up at your destination is dependent on where you start. And it’s here that I have my biggest problem with the EPRDF and its role with the Eri opposition. The events it organizes, the politics it empowers,the politics it discourage will, I fear, result in a highly polarized Eritrean body politic. Ethiopia has the power to legitimize and de-legitimize Eritrean political actors. For an easy example, refer to Gash Salehs reportage on how Eritreans now are creating a unique ID for themselves not on the basis of religion or ethnicity or geography or ideology but on a language spoken with a different accent. You may say that this is an Eritrean issue and all ethiopia is doing is being a generous host, but that’s not what the facts show. Simply speaking, Ethiopia has created a free-for-all and there are no minimum thresholds to be an Eritrean group recognized by Ethiopia.

          Where do we start? You mentioned Ghana. There is an awesome documentary on the 2008 elections in Ghana. Ghana is a unitary state, and it’s a two party state, organized on the basis of (broadly) center-left and center-right politics. The veteran Omer Jaber once made two great points (in an interview with Saleh Gadi): we Eritreans are all related and ethnic politics makes no sense (he gave his personal ancestry) and the PFDJ are just veterans with family obligations. That tells u in a nutshell where our beginning point should be.
          That, personally, is my preference. To get there, it went through through multiple coups, multiple revisions to the constitution and now it has a system where the losing party does something amazing when it loses: it accept the results or it appeals to the Supreme Court. That is something I would like us to aim for. It’s that and a 12 other case studies that I would like our scholars to step into the debate and be a counter balance to the mob-politics we have now.

          Finally, if awate.com can host something productive and if you think my role would be unhelpful: don’t worry: we have a great division of labor within awate team 🙂

          Thanks and please stick around.

          Saay

      • AOsman

        SAAY,

        “…our first struggle is to get Eritrea to climb up to the status of an average African election–rigged and one-party-dominated as they may be, they are better than what we have in Eritrea which is OneManocracy.”

        Am sure we can do better (nothing special about us), just aim higher than the mess we have in Africa. See below, passionate quarrel Kenyan style

        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gskpARTorN8

        Regards
        AOsman

    • Hayat Adem

      Kaddis,
      What puzzles me with Sal’s point of view on the particular issue you raised is that he seems to think Ethiopia has many political parties better than, or as good as EPRDF while he also seems to imply Eritrea’s opposition parties so far are as bad or worse than PFDJ. That is why he constantly mocks on Ethiopia’s election and fails to appreciate the democratic space the opposition parties of Eritrea exercise.

      Hayat

  • Mahmud Saleh

    Ahlan Gud
    About your questions: I have no idea, it’s just a feeling. If you have statistics supporting your claim, please forward it to me. You yourself seem to be not so sure. I see you using words like “seems” and “may be”.
    *At any rate:
    A. You are right, and I am wrong.
    B. You are wrong and I am right.
    C. Both of us right (even if we get a number we may disagree on its interpretation,” big” for me may be small for you, therefore, we may remain right on our own right)
    D. Both of us wrong ( we don’t really know the man)
    *Curse SAAY for the combinations.
    But he remains to be Amanuel Hidrat the great. I read his articles, and find them interesting.

  • haileTG

    Haha…donqoro zbluki’s ayegageyun…

    Actually, TG was coined after you were floored nose down..haha remember that? In fact, when I argued for the legal settlement of the border (before the the oppo were going to addis and calling for them to hammer a united call for the border resolution rather than talk about government in exile or constitution waste of time), brother saay was fully opposed to me. When I had a big clash with brother Semere Andom, on the issue of wrongful calling of “Nazi” to our diaspora children in YPFDJ an I angrily attacked the opposition who did that, well brother saay stood for them and told me that the fact PFDJ enacts its “bestial” (his word) policy on our people and show them the YPFDJ dancing, that was valid to call them fascists. I disagreed with honor and took the responsibility on us for not having effective communities to attract them. Fast forward after the open military assault of PFDJ by the Ethiopians in 2012, repeatedly and with great fanfare that they can perform any security operations inside Eritrea at will, and PFDJ bowing and receiving it, I am justified to revise my view to talks aimed at resolving problems within the legal decision. Yet, that is not a priority to me today, a day world media are reporting the Eritrean woman who gave birth at sea last night. My priority is to see change in that. But the saay has now moved a seat to support things that he knows are past time and undermine solutions to current problems. You wouldn’t matter much as you are simply a hired worker slaving for your stomach, but even those who spent their lives struggling to bestow Eritrean identity, are openly spending their days stripping that off from Eritreans. Why would a person who spent all his life and more to restore Eritrean identity would be trigger happy to strip that on accounts of political disagreement? Weren’t over 65000 plus over 20000 died to make that identity cast in stone? Your eshi goytay nick is real honor. Eritrean heroes are dumped underground to this day under that nick. I haven’t even crossed middle age and my experience of PFDJ is my experiences with it in early adulthood and comings and goings there after. And to get the same nick as the true heroes an honor. They may have had their issues but asked the right question at the right time. and nothing changes with donqoro like you.

    Now, go deliver that message, and your bone and leash is waiting…

    • Gud

      HaileTDD, Hamedke ide,
      What got into you dude? you all shaken to the core or something, nothing is coherent in what you wrote above. Your drooling got worse.
      What seems to be apparent though is what Tafla said. Emotional wreck, fits you good. The other apparent thing is the fact that, SAAY can make or break you. That was demonstrated here, and you yourself said he is the one praising and shielding you and all, and the one time he called you out to cut the bullshit, you just crumble and fall, and what you were reduced to was, seeking sanctuary in the name calling of PFDJ, ….Denkoro, says the fool!
      But, let me see if I get this straight: You were on the side of the Eri. Gov, part and parcel of PFDJ, until woyanie crossed our border and humiliated Eritrea, and you chose that time to abandon the Eri Gov.? So, you gave your back to Eritrea, during the weakest moment? Amazing!!
      There is nothing worst than a characteristic of flip flopping.
      What a shame!

  • Peace!

    Hi All,

    Now we know why the opposition groups suck. Well, the Amen-Corner needs to go to EPRDF’s office and say: look your strategy is not working; in fact, it is helping PFDJ and deminishing the opposition groups at the same time. Basically, stay the course scenario means we the Amen-Corner will be expelled from the groups and the chance of other oppositions to stay here in awasa is very slim.

    Regards

    • Hayat Adem

      Dear Peace,
      The PFDJ-caused fatality is exponentially greater in extent and intensity on Eritrea and Eritreans than it is on Ethiopia and Weyane. If the opposition camp is getting weaker, if PFDJ is nowhere nearing its end, if Eritreans couldn’t be empowered to see hope and help coming their way, then it is you and me who should be worried more than the Woyane. PFDJ’s stress factors against Woyane are withering away by the day; contrastingly, they are getting more lethal on Eritrea- constricting and suffocating Eritrea to death each day. Woyane can afford to comfortably watch from a distance. Can we? So why do you think the continuation of PFDJ’s existence is more painful to Woyane than to Eritreans. ከምቲ ንዓና ቅዝፈትን ‘ደራዕን ወሪዱና ዘሎ፣ ንወያነ ኣይ ሕማሞምን፡ ኣይ ረስኖምን።
      hayat

  • Hayat Adem

    Hi Elenta,
    I’ll agree with you on most of it. I disagree on what you said in the last 3 or so paragraphs. Some lines towards the middle sound like they are there as an advice to me, and as such, I guess I’m free to pick it or drop it.
    Hayat

  • Hope

    Quote /Comment of the Year”:
    “ሓደ ሓቂ ኣሎ፥ ኩልና ኤርትራውያን ደለይቲ ፍትሕን ዲሞክራስን ኣብ ልዕሊ ዉልቀ መለኽቲ ህግደፍን ኣዕናዊ ፖሊሲታቶምን ክቱር ጽልኢ ኣሎና። እንተኾነ ግን ገለ ገሌና እዚ ክቱር ጽልኢ ኣብ ልዕሊ ፖሊሲታት ሰበ ስልጣን ህግደፍ ናብ ጽልኢ ሃገርን ህዝብን ኤርትራ ከይልሕመና ምጥንቃቕ ከድልየና ኢዩ።”
    Courtesy of Abraham Hanibal…

  • Hope

    Gud,
    oops,you forgot the Abay Tigray Dream..with a Sea outlet “By any means possible”.

  • Gebrekirstos

    This does not fall into the accepted categories. Furthermore, how can they stand the countenance and wrath of the great feeble who would arrive to bestow them with other unheard of labels. The truth is that there is a lot of self-censorship in the forum in order to pass the litmus test of “true Eritreanness” which is measured by how much hate you express towards Ethiopia and you scrutinize any word, act from Ethiopia. And who measures that, you know ! By contrast issues such as the sinking of Eritreans in the sea, the harvest of their organs, the rape and abuse they live in everywhere, the perilous journey across the Sahara dessert, and the indefinite slavery in their own country are less important and not worth talking. Those are good -they serve an grand scheme.

    Camouflaged in articles, comments, viability, sovereignty, vacating border, labeling and dry jokes and diversions is one grand agenda – to drain Kebessa Eritrea of its demographic capital. And the statuesque is doing exactly that. Do the Kebessa see that? Well, I do not know. Remember a recent article here on awate which claims that the kebessa are minorities? So you see it all ads up! In the meantime, the Kebessa elite are trapped in the agendas set for them such as “Amen corner”, “OMI”, and others of their own such as “agame” , “weyane”, and many more ! It is all epic, the sort that you find in films.

    • AOsman

      Gebrekirstos,

      Wow you are amazing, don’t take yourself serious on this one.

      You know when people debate in this forum, at times they push their opponent to one extreme to make their case, but that is the nature of heated or passionate debate. It is up to the reader to discern and take the gist of what is debated and take some lessons/insight. Yours is going to conspiracy theory that is weird, a lowlander can make a similar case based on the refugees in East Sudan, well you just need to read Ali Salim…you antithesis.

      Anyway, chill out….such heated debate are needed and better if exhausted in a cyber world so tomorrow people can focus on the development and betterment of Eritrea. However, I sometimes wonder how some debators manage…it must be draining.

      Beyond some of the artificial debates, there is one underlying problem that everyone is facing. We are in a situation like one is watching his child in an imminent danger, but he is only watching it live on CCTV. What is the next course of action?
      1. To shout and cry from the CCTV control center
      2. Attempt to seek help from anyone close by
      3. Try to leave the place and attempt to save the child yourself
      4…………
      5………..

      2 and 3 dependent on proximity and the believe that you can make a difference immediately….but in the Eritrean circumstance, I feel, the opposition at the moment is emasculated and the dependence on others may be viewed from that perspective. How do you shift gear from #2 to #3, that is the crux……another combination…I think we have been there before 🙂

      Regards
      AOsman

  • Dear All,

    It is unfortunate that some people are worrying about things they should not worry about at all, vis-à-vis, Eritrean independence. Eritrean independence is a closed issue, and even ultra nationalist Ethiopians have come to terms with this fact a long time ago. Nobody is really discussing Eritrean independence here, but about what sort of Eritrea there is going to be in the future, and what type of Eritrea the present generation is going to inherit to its posterity. Is it going to be Eritrea that is part of the horn of Africa community, or a pariah state that will be at odds with all its neighbors, Eritrea that would engage the region economically and politically in a positive way or a place where innocent citizens would continue to suffer for no crimes of their own? These are the core issues in most discussions, and not whether Eritrea should be independent or not.

    More than two decades after Eritrea has become an independent country, Eritrean independence cannot be entertained for discussion in any way imaginable, and shouldn’t have been a reason for worry. If people make an issue out of it by distorting and hairsplitting other peoples’ views, there is nothing that one can do. Even if I had doubted Eritrean independence, which I never did, it should have been ignored, instead of losing one’s temper over it. Having an opinion on how Eritrea and Ethiopia can
    cooperate and solve their problems is not doubting Eritrean independence in any way.

    In his press conferences, the President of Djibouti was insinuating that future relations with Ethiopia is going to be much more than economic cooperation and integration, and it may even go as far as union of the two states. Eritrea is being left out of the horn of Africa’s political and economic development, and events happening in the horn are leaving her behind. Instead of worrying about these issues and the major political and economic loss to Eritrea, due to the regime’s unconventional external and internal policies, some people are wasting their time with things that are no more an issue.

    • Hayat Adem

      any addition to this piece will spoil it, well articulated, horizon.

      • Kokhob Selam

        yes really. I am not having time to read those days but I don’t miss Horizon’s one.

    • T. Kifle

      Dear Horizon,

      As much as you make sense in many of the issues you raised, I sense a kind of lack of fundamental understanding of the Ethiopian (African to use SAAY’s words) politics. The wish of the chauvinist class to reverse
      the Eritrean independence is still potent. Don’t get hoodwinked by the seemingly plausible semantics of “Assab for Ethiopia” which you also seem to subscribe to that, albeit yours in a peaceful manner, if I can go by your earlier comment of bartering Badme with Assab. There is no sane way they can attain Assab short of a willful grant of the same by Eritreans short of tempering Eritrean Sovereignty. Assab for them is not an economic device but a symbol of pride and worth dying for it. The “SAAY’s “TPLF-2” (which he wantonly categorized me with), granted the power, are claiming the same. So it would be a natural consequence of the political dynamics in Ethiopia if some extra-sensitive Eritreans become wary of the mood transpiring in their southern neighbour. What’s unsettling is the defiance of some in this forum when they engage themselves in ኣብ ዝወዓልኪ ውዓሊ kind of arguments absolutely oblivion to discern a friend from the enemy.

      • Dear T. Kifle,

        Do not take for granted what the chauvinistic class is saying. It is political talk without substance. The old generation and its mentality of imposing its will through force is gone forever, and it cannot reverse history.

        • T. Kifle

          Dear Horizon,

          The political struggle in Ethiopia has been a matter of legitimacy which among the range of issues this particular class is armed with is reversing Eritrea’s independence. In their book EPRDF is
          illegitimate to govern and anything sanctioned during its governance period is illegal and waiting a day for its reversal. It’s not a PR rhetoric or s matter of post-retirement hang-ups but a serious issue of priority repeatedly expressed by the old and the new alike.

          • Nero

            Dear T. Kifle,
            I agree that political struggle in Ethiopia is framed over legitimacy. However, EPRDF has made gains in many aspects of legitimacy that even the extreme right will find difficult to disagree with, even though their rhetoric is to the contrary. I agree with Horizon and some of the Ethiopians that have said in the past on this website that most Ethiopians have come to terms with Eritrea’s independence.

            The question of a ‘sovereign access to sea’ (not necessarily Assab) is a potent symbol and is still a subject that resonates among pan-ethiopianists and ethnonationalists alike and not necessarily always by the chavunist class. Some say it is the last legitimacy hurdle for EPRDF.

            N

          • T. Kifle

            Dear Nero,
            I understand the EPRDF of today claims much territories in the scale of legitimacy than it has been decades ago. But the fact is those who were against article 39 and by extension against the Eritrean referendum are still stuck in their old positions. We need also to note that their diversity is on the rise as some from the revolutionary democrats have chosen to align themselves with the old chauvinist class following the assessment of their “Eritrean obsession” of the past . How appealing their positions to Ethiopians is quite different matter but their intentions are potent and given a chance of governing, they have the capacity to wake up the demons of mayhem and destruction.

          • Saleh Johar

            T. Kifle,
            Would you say the “chauvinists” are emboldened thinking Eritreans are not committed to their independence anymore, gauging by the few who declare so? And, would you think they are emboldened by counting on the Eritrean camp that is vocal against the TPLF/EPRDF?

            Whatever the case, there is an Arabic saying: ana we akhuy Aala ibn Aami, Ana w’ ibn Aami Aala ‘lqerib. Me and my brother ally against my cousin; me and my cousin ally against a stranger. In such a scenario, the alliance will be surprising. That is the nature of politics 🙂

          • T. Kifle

            Sir Saleh GJ,
            Well, we have two varieties here. The first kind have been the ones who inherited the old legacy of territorial projects and their political adventures are intrinsic, uncaused by any of the moods in the Eritrean side. They were, they are and they will be. Their reactions may not necessarily be because they think they can subdue Eritrea given the chance to be at the helm of affairs but as slow learners they are(if at all they are capable of learning), they think that Eritrea is the last ploy they peg their hopes that sooner or later will kill EPRDF.

            In the second variant we find the new converts mainly splinters from the TPLF and their sympathizers which are angry about EPRDF, the EPLF, and even about themselves and I can safely assume their hyper-reactions are of two-pronged. They seem to harbour a deep rancour and hatred towards EPLF’s Eritrea and they think their prides could count when and if they annihilate it through brute force with ultimate outcome of retaking at least the port of Assab back. They also see TPLF as a colonial viceroy of the EPLF since their marketing strategy is through “Sovereignty” which they believe is being compromised due to the unholy alliance of the two PLFs which results in Eritrean independence. Some in this group show a vestige of solidarity in their utterances and some times quote them in their writings of those they think are vocal critics of Ghedli from your side but their hatred towards Eritrea mainly comes from their desire to claim a place in the corridors of the “Chauvinist” class. Our political configurations is mainly based on a rejectionist constituency and if someone have the desire of politicking, they have to find a place in either of the political poles. Since they are rejected from the EPRDF political pole, they should push every button to please the other pole which is the citadel of the old political establishment. For all practical purposes their politicking is to claim some space so that they make business by being extreme critics of the ruling coalition through the tabloids mainly financed by the diaspora, NGOs and other international “rights” organizations which have been at odds with the government for many years now. The Ethio-Eritrean political discourse seems to me suffering from similar ailments of binary politicking.

          • Saleh Johar

            T. Kifle, thank you…that is what I thought, almost, but needed a second opinion.
            Thank you

          • Abinet

            Selam Ato Kifle
            Don’t you think eprdf is winning the hearts and minds of the ” chauvinists” atleast when it comes to eritrea?
            Thanks

    • Abraham Hanibal

      Dear Horizon;
      If these seamingly reconciliatory words were comming from another balanced Ethiopian they would make sense. But they’re comming from the same person person who displayed the old Ethiopian “zeraf” style, by declaring unless Ethiopia gets an access to sea, there would not be peace between the two countries. And mind you, acccording to your own view, this access to the sea is not going to be through lease or other legal use, but through absolute ownership. If you don’t think such opinion is a transgression of Eritrea’s sovereignty, then it is upto you. But it would not be left unanswered from my side or any other Eritrean. You need to come out of your mis-guided belief that Assab or for that matter Eritrea would not make it unless they cooperate with Ethiopia. Cooperation should be based on equal footing and mutual respect, not one side enforcing its will on the other.

      • tafla

        Be careful Abraham Hanibal, they’ll call you HGDEF if you don’t “co-operate” and “dialogue” :).

        HTG is not entirely wrong about the MeAlesh corner though, but that corner does not belong to PFDJ’ites, but the Arabist Eritreans in the opposition, including the owners of this website.

        SAAY and SGJ are extremely skilled and experienced political writers (not like HTG’s emotional roller coaster 🙂 ). SGJ is quite direct, but SAAY is less obvious, b/c his sense of humor is a deadly weapon (one recent example…Notice the Seattle seahawks jokes to Mahmud Saleh-asking which team he belongs to?). As long as we Eritreans run N-E-W-S to find allies who can give us an upper hand (Zeray mdlay) in our internal politics, we are doomed as a nation and it would be better to separate peacefully without any bloodshed over the throne (Not a struggle for democracy).

        A reformed PFDJ is our best and safest bet. I’m really looking forward to 2015 though, it will be a very eventful year for us Eritreans. Hopefully a year when we’ll see the end of migration, suffering and beginning of rule of law and prosperity.

        Best regards Tafla

        • Hope

          Ahlen Tafla,
          kem Afka yigbero.
          Insh’Allah-God willing.
          I am admiring Attoreny Ghezae Hagos as he seems to have grasped something he did not before.but he sould keep pounding until he rests his case as he is trained to do so.

        • Saleh Johar

          Tafla, I will speak for myslef only here. You stated, that “the owners of this website” are Arabists!

          I would like to ask you to kindly explain and clarify the following:

          1. What makes me an Arabist?
          2.Would I be an Arabist if my name was not, obviously, Saleh?
          3.If one is an Arabist, then there is Arabism. What is Arabism according to you?

          Though your reply could potentially be educational, I would like to tell you that I am not an Arabist and I would appreciate it if you would disown your statement or at least correct your perception.

          God forgive you as well 🙂

          • saay7

            Dear Mr Founder/publisher of awate.com:

            In an emergency meeting that the Awate team organized, we have passed the following resolution:

            WHEREAS, Saleh Gadi Johar (“SGJ”) has repeatedly denigrated Islamists by mocking Salafi preachers;

            WHEREAS, SGJ has argued openly with many Salafists/Wahabists and taunted them with “my ancestors were Islamized by the message and yours by the sword!”

            WHEREAS, SGJ has openly denied that he is an Arabist because quote “I don’t do ‘ist’ and I am “benatem abesha babatem abesha”

            BE IT RESOLVED, then, that SGJ is stripped of his title and his salary and expense accounts and the awate logo (Hamed Idris awate riding a horse) is to replaced by “There is no deity but God and Mohammed is His prophet.” And further effective immediately the English edition of awate will cease to exist and be replaced by Arabic only.

            The interim leader of awate.com will be Sheik Saleh Abdurahman Ahmed Younis.

            Seal of awate.com

          • Eyob Medhane

            I see an obvious coup here.. 🙂

          • saay7

            Eyobai:

            Interim. Gzyawi wetehaderawi mengst. After the transitional we will have provisional. And, as Musevini said, I want to quit but the party and the people just won’t let me:)

            The vote was 99.6% in favor of Saleh Abu Dunya al Asmerani. Wait sorry that was the vote for EPRDF in the the 2010 elections :). I think it was 100% for TPLF in Tigray. I had 110% vote 🙂

          • Eyob Medhane

            Sal,

            I love the new name. Al Dunya…Of course the correct word is ‘Adugna’. Arabs, as they always do with these good Amharic words, and corrupt it…’Adugna’ means wealth, prosperity in Afan Oromo as well as Amharic.. Is it the same in Arabic?

          • Saleh Johar

            Are you supporting the coup Eyob?
            I have HaileTG on my side–Saay and HaileTG are distressing me. But hey, they decided to oust me, and here I am. I have to establish another Arabist entity and make Tafla my adviser.

            We Arabists believe that duny is keTnt jemro Arebegna. It means both the physical “World” as well as “Life”in this world. I am almost sure many Ethiopians complain, “Adynya embi alech” meaning life betrayed me, when they get poor or fail in life. When someone prospers and gets wealthy, they exclaim, “Addunya meTachilet” or “Addunya berrun ankwakwachilet.” So let it be know, the word is our but you can continue to use it 🙂

          • saay7

            Abu Salah:

            When you say “I am not an Arabist” are you using the American definition of Arabist or what the rest of the world means by Arabist?

            In the entire world (except America), an Arabist is a non-Arab who specializes in Arab culture, literature, history. Like Orientalist or Africa Specialist. In the United States, an Arabist is someone who looks at the Arab-Israel feud and is more sympathetic to the Arabs (which is a big no-no in the US, specially if you are a government employee.)

            In the Chegwar Danga world, an Arabist is someone who can speak and read Arabic (when he has no reason to do so, if he is Habesha)

            So which Arabist are you not? 🙂

            saay

          • Saleh Johar

            Saay, why complicate it? Let Tafla explain it. Maybe it means anyone with an Arabic name 🙂

          • Youni Abraham

            Eritrea … the worst in the field of investment activity!

            And the title of another state issued adorns the small African Horn and experiencing the horrors caused by the existing system of governance there for over two decades. “Eritrea” has got the title of the worst state in the exercise of business activities, as it came in ranked last for building permits and access to credit and other, also suffered

            Harshly criticized because of the executions and murders outlaw, as well as torture and lack of openness. “Based on the report” Doing Business Activities “for 2015 issued by the” World Bank “. And published in all the world’s media. According to a summary published in the Lebanese An-Nahar newspaper, in its issue today Friday, December 12 that “Eritrea is the worst countries in the world in terms of investment climate, and per capita gross national income of about $ 490, the World Bank, describing it as one of the least developed countries in the world, where more than two-thirds of the population in rural areas. This is not known in Eritrea that the state budget was discussed in any organization, whether within the ruling party and the only one in the country and within the government headed by the Head of State Isaias Afewerki for nearly two decades, as the party’s institutions in full control on all economic facilities in the country

          • Kim Hanna

            Selam Mr. Johar,
            .
            That was a brilliant evasive political answer. I would not answer Mr. SAAY’s direct question either, when he is in this kind of mood.
            The Professor asks a question and if the answer is not to his liking, he brings in his sledge hammer.
            .
            We need the Awate University to continue functioning. Therefore, if I were you I would not sit close to him at the next end of the year meeting. Hopefully after the new year things will calm down a bit.
            .
            BTW, I really had a lay man’s definition of what an Arabist is. It is not as complicated as the Professor’s.
            I wont do it now in the interest of world peace and goodwill to mankind.
            .
            K.H

          • Saleh Johar

            Funny, Kim,
            Let’s hear it from you. What is it as used in the context of the “non-Arabist”? And then we can agree whether it is complicated or not. But I assure you it is lazy, boring, and annoying 🙂

          • Youni Abraham

            ريتريا …الاسوء في مجال النشاط الإستثماري !

            ولقب آخر يزين صدر الدولة القرن إفريقية الصغيرة والتي تعاني الويلات جراء نظام الحكم القائم هناك منذ ما يربو على العقدين . فقد حصلَت “إريتريا” على لقب الدولة الأسوأ في مجال ممارسة نشاطات الأعمال، إذ جاءَت في المرتبة الأخيرة بالنسبة إلى تراخيص البناء والحصول على الائتمان وغيرها، كما تعرَّضت

            لإنتقادات لاذعة بسبب عمليات الإعدام والقتل الخارجة عن القانون، إلى جانب التعذيب وعدم الإنفتاح “. إستناداً إلى تقرير “ممارسة نشاطات الأعمال” لعام 2015 الذي أصدرَهُ “البنك الدولي”. ونشر في كل وسائل الإعلام العالمية . ووفقا لتلخيص نشر في جريدة النهار اللبنانية في عددها اليوم الجمعة 12 ديسمبر ” ان إريتريا تُعدُّ أسوأ دول العالم من حيث المناخ الإستثماري، وبلغَ نصيبُ الفرد من الدخل القومي الإجمالي نحو 490 دولاراً، ووصفَها البنك الدولي بأنَّها واحدة من أقل البلدان نمواً في العالم، حيث يعيشُ أكثر من ثلثي سكانها في المناطق الريفية. هذا ولا يعرف في إرتريا ان نوقشت الميزانية العامة للدولة في أي مؤسسة سواء كانت داخل الحزب الحاكم والوحيد في البلاد و داخل الحكومة التي يترأسها رئيس الدولة اسياس أفورقي منذ ما يقارب العقدين ، كما ان مؤسسات الحزب تسيطر سيطرة تامة على كل المرافق الإقتصادية في البلاد

        • Abraham Hanibal

          Selam Tafla;

          I join you in your well wish for our people; though unfortunately the facts on the ground are far from promising. Whether some might call me HIGDEF or not, I think the atmosphere of debate in this forum is much civilised and reasonable in comparison to the pro-PFDJ sites. The moderators and admins of this site as well as the participants in the discussions deserve a praise in this regard. The pro-PFDJ sites, esp. tesfanews have null tolerance on dissident views, anyone who would dare to challenge the policies of the PFDJ is most likely to be branded as “Woyane”, “Agame”, etc. It is really boring. I agree on your view that we should not externalize our internal situation, we should rather take the decision regarding our policies in consultations with our people.

          I disagree with your view saying “A reformed PFDJ is our best and safest bet”. PFDJ has had ample time and space to reform, we all know the ill-fate faced by those who dared to reform it. The organization is led by individuals who’ve placed themselves and their interests above the people’s interests. Mind you this is an organization which never had a single organizational meeting to evaluate its policies since its re-organization twenty years ago. The only alternative is for it to cease to exist and give way to a participatory and inclusive governance.
          Regards

  • Nitricc

    I think I am lost on this ridiculously lousy and redundant debate between SAAY and the “Amen-group” what I don’t get is when the Tigryans, like T-K goes off documenting every misdeeds of Eritrea and Eritreans the Amen people showers him with admiration and he is a hero. On the same token when SAAY brings up an Ethiopian news that was publicly podcasted and mentions the inhuman deportation of Eritreans who were rapped everything they owned by the TPLF gangs, the Amans, the Hailes and the Hayats go banana? Why? My question again, why is it when T-K dishes it out okay and he is a fearless hero but when SAAY brings up an “Ethiopian news” regarding deported Eritrean, it is the end of the world and SAAY is an evil who wants evil things between the two people?
    Aman and Haile, help me understand this thing.
    Where is Mahmuday, can you help me on this one?
    Why all this cry?
    http://i.imgur.com/zO3Mx.gif

    • Mahmud Saleh

      Nitrikay,
      I’m discouraged by how things deteriorated; I’m mused on how far some Eritreans did go to justify why it’s OK to be loyal cadres of a foreign nation which is technically at war with Eritrea. Kudos to TK, the son of aboy SebHat, You ARE OUT Of THE neo-tplfites, and under observation for a total recovery. What you said is exactly what aboy sebHat said. We are looking for that type of assertiveness from the Eritrean side, and that’s what saay was referring to. Instead of saying” excuse us, we’re not TPLF Amen Corner, they spent days why they’re so proud to be members of that corner. To her credit, only sister Hayat challenged Rodab why he put her there.Mind you, saay didn’t mention names. Anyway, I call upon saay and Amanuel H to de-escalate the heated exchanges.we know your political positions; both of you have a formidable base of readers. Please cooperate where you can, and let things both of you disagree on for us, we can practice on them. I admire both of you on your unique way, so time to stop it and get to business. Nitrickay, my skill at using Mobile phone keyboard is not good, if needed, may add some later on.

      • Nitricc

        Mahmuday, I hear you and I am discombobulated as well by the discussions between SAAY and Haile. Since Ethiopia got nothing to do with our miseries, then it must be they must be the demons. Some one told me once the Weyane told an Eritrean opposition member who to name for leadership. And the Eritrean opposition member says to the Breket Simon, well, with due respect we are capable doing it our self and handle our affairs. And Bereket responded, if you had the balls to do it and handle your affairs; PIA won’t be sitting in Asmara; that is why we have to do it for you. and fianally Bereket told him to shut up and do what is told. So, for Haile not to believe that TPLF is not interfering on Eritrean affairs is unbelievable. I am lost at Haile’s reasoning’s. They guy is a dynamite but when he gets angry and emotional, he loses all his sense of direction and his greatness.
        Anyway; reading all the comments do what I am doing; wear this while reading the comments it will save you from agony.
        http://media.catmoji.com/post/v7ag/psychedelic-cat-gif.gif

        • Mahmud Saleh

          Nitrikay,
          You make my day buddy, keep coming. On the issue at hand, I will just pass it saying most of us were not in our best disposition. I will open your link later.

          • saay7

            Ahlen Mahmuday:

            This is the traditional Awate mid-December blow up; we will work through it. There was a lot of elbows thrown (Seattle Seahawks) and maybe some below the belt jabs (Seattle …) but we will self-officiate, self-regulate and self-correct.

            Consider, the same week we were having our mild disagreement in the Awate family, over at Nitriccs favorite PFDJ site they had a long Tigrinya article (where SGJ and I make a cameo appearance: he appears as Saleh Gadi and I appear as Younis Johar: don’t ask why)and there was a feud between two PFDJistas as to who stole orphans funds and the website took a side. So that guy has been tried in the kangaroo court of PFDJ: his decades long of committed service goes puff, his citizenship is recalled and he is out: he can’t even go home now. There is no self correcting and no reset button in that juggernaut.

            saay

      • Yoty Topy

        I am curious if the feature ” comments closed” might be of some use in bringing some of these heated discussions to a completion in a more humanely possible way.

    • Hayat Adem

      That is too harsh a depiction, nitricc. Okay, I’m not happy the way things are now but I’m not that miserable, either. I also never drunk beyond soda.

  • Gebrekirstos

    The control for the narrative

    ————————————-

    I have watched the Awate Team for long enough time to have an informed opinion. They have, no doubt, created a great medium where people can inform each other, discuss and debate socio-political issues. This is great.

    At Awate, a writers writes an article (sets an agenda) and discussions and debates ensue. Personally, I find the ensuing discussions and debates interesting and I have a great respect for some of the members who are great debaters.

    However, I find it extremely painful to see those great debaters and minds be dragged to a level of some feeble minds , not once, but often times. Admittedly, a certain feeble mind can write articles and good English (not good content) and can label many people and groups with colorful labels that he plagiarized from here and there. To my surprise, every great mind is talking about the article and the agenda it set and about the labeling he generously bestowed upon every one, and about the diversions that he introduces in almost every comment. This way a great amount of time and intellect is wasted on discussing subjects and shallow-at-best articles (tabloid articles).

    However, make no mistake that the Awate Team in general and the feeble mind in particular has a great power over the people that come to this forum, and that is the control over the narrative. The control over the narrative means setting the agenda for a discussion and debate and thus effectively deciding what people talk about . Even further, agendas are set in every comment by labeling, categorizing and digression. By this, they control the public discourse and the minds of the thinking people. By sorting topics according to importance (the more you talk about a topic the more important it becomes), they create a social reality (in the mind). “He who controls the narrative controls the universe ” . This power, the Awate Team in general and the feeble mind in particular are keenly aware of.

    How painful is it to see many great minds discussing about “Amen corner”, “outrage manufacturing inc”, ” nbretachew tilew yehedu” and hair-splittings in a nation whose youth are in slavery, sinking in the high seas and fleeing in droves? But then again make no mistake that Awate has a goal and the main one is making sure there be no link between Kebessa Eritrea and Ethiopia. See it for what it is, people ! Do you remember YG’s “anesthesiologists”? Get it, guys , that is it !

  • Guest

    The control for the narrative
    ———————————–
    I have visited awate team for a time long enough to discern a great pattern in its editorials and acts of its team members. They have, no doubt, created a great medium where people can inform each other, discuss ideas and debate with each other.

  • Gud

    Rodab,

    Allow me to bring my signing out remark up here (Too many xxxx xxxx clattering the area down there)

    Here is what that Tes dude have to say:

    “…..I was one who was freely asking and critisizing the PFDJ administration while I was home……”

    And yet, not only did he lived to tell, but also he was sent for further study, by the Government!
    Note how he expressed it in a “matter of fact” or as a “general truth” kind of way the fact that Eritreans can FREELY ask and criticize their government in meetings INSIDE Eritrea.

    “When, I was back home, I was much more informed about the ill-politicsof PFDJ, internally and externally……” Emphasis on the “externally ”

    Courtesy of Tes, who jumped up, but on the way down, accidentally fell on the right/ truth side of facts inside Eritrea. I said accidentaly, I don’t know any one as confused (or as confusing) as that dude

    Now, Mr Rodab, some closing messege is in order here:

    The reason as to why the Eritrean people are sticking with their government through thick and thin, is not and never been because they are closed and deprived of anything happening outside, it is rather because they identified their interest and well being with their government, with its intents and actions and are holding their ground firmly, by choice!!

    By the same token the reason as to why the Eritrean people never seem to give a hoot about the lost souls who call themselves opposition and the other selfish individuals barking so loudly, is not because they don’t know about them, but because they identified the for what and who they are : useless lost souls, who shamelesly are baring their behind for the very enemy of ERITREA, the Woyanie .

    Hey, it take a LOT to impress Eritreans in ERITREA, let alone to gain their respect and support

    Signing out

    • Tesfabirhan WR

      Dear Gud,

      I will add one point you left: To know is different and to act is different. If you criticize and then if there is no change, do you think that barking infront of the door will work?

      Since 2008, I started to question on the re-structuring of the Ministry of Agriculture and the Ministry of Education with a special focus on the higher education.

      When I was doing, I was risking my life but I was young to be considered serious. In fact, I had signed a warning letter by the security agent. This happened to me when I protested against the deteriorating life condition at Hamelmalo College, where I was working. After 13 other and I formed a committe who speak on behalf of students, things were getting on fire in the college. Students started to talk about their life condition. By that very time, from the streets of Keren, I was kidnapped by security men and prisoned for one night in Forto Keren. After spending one night, I was questioned about my intention and ordered to sign for not to organize students for any such activities. After that, I continued to work on what I started but in a more humble way.

      I continued to criticize in meetings every now and then but with lots of careful ways. Above all, they trained me to be their cadre and in this way, I was some how covered from being an open victim.

      Had I stayed one more year in Eritrea, for sure, prison was awaiting me as my criticism was getting intense to wards their policies and approach.

      As for the scholarship, it is in the ration of 1:10, 000. Just imagine a country to have only 13 master students, just 13! Can I be happy with my opportunity? If I were happy for being among the 13, I could not be here. I am here fighting to give a chance to 1300 masters PLUS students every year. Education should be FREE not by a quota.

      Surely, I can say, yes I am among “the chose one” but did we fight for 30 years to give a chance for the chosen ones? Ask this to yourself. Eritreans should be FREE to chose. No chosen ones but the ABLE people should have it. Education should not be limited to the straignt “A” students but to ALL who want it. Sadly, PFDJ policy will not allow such kind of FREE ways to education.

      Dear Gud, do not divide things, see them as a whole. See me among the people, not as a CHOSEN MAN. If people were allowed to study where ever they want, I am quite sure, Eritreans will be among the competing students to get international scholarship. And soon, the educational system inside could have changed.

      Take note on this dear Gud. We Eritreans didn’t fight to give a chance to the CHOSEN PEOPLE but FREEDOM to ALL. I oppose QUOTA system, I oppose COUPON SYSTEM.

      hawka
      tes

  • saay7

    Kbur Abal Hagherawi Bayto Amanuel Hidrat:

    Let me try, although I think it is futile. On (a) that is a straw man argument because I never said I am more nationalist etc etc and (b) the number of times you have failed in understanding my position is so numerous, I could spend the whole day discussing it.

    My favorites are where you build a series deformities and then challenge them. Consider this classic:

    “Sals argument is clear and an unambigous at least to me. His preferred arrangement of government is an executive fiat of civil and military bureaucracies to govern the heterogeneous society that tears down the social fabric of our society. His focus is only on Issayas and hasn’t any problem on the structure of the government and its institutional relationship within the state of Eritrea and the international community. He believes there is a statecraft of PFDJ that is conducive for economic, health, land, social, political development.”

    http://awate.com/minister-nesredin-bekit-puts-more-red-tape-on-import-licenses/comment-page-1/#comment-159568

    Sentence 1 says that you understand me. Then you follow it by 3 sentences which show you don’t understand my position at all. Am I really supposed to respond to this or just conclude that, for whatever reason, Emma has just chosen not to understand my viewpoint? For God’s sake, you made me write an article about it:) You can disagree with it, but don’t misstate it.

    Moving on, my question was directed at you as a long-time observer, commentator and participant of Eritrean opposition politics. I asked you to give me your opinion of what you observed since 1999. You then skip a decade plus and go to 2011-2012 and then you speak like a witness called to the witness box. I was asking for your opinion. And if your opinion is NO, I don’t think Ethiopia has ANYTHING to do with how the Addis-based opposition has been underperforming, just say it.

    The last one: you know I can dig it out. But is it really worth it since you have shown such a consistent pattern of failing to understand what is written?

    saay

  • Asmerom

    Mr Mehari
    Instead of attacking personality why don’t you just respond to the idea flotted by Horizon . Attacking personality is not dealing with issue at hand just point out where you agree or disagree with Horizon in a civilized manner
    Thank you

  • Tesfabirhan WR

    Dear All,

    I know my words are not good for effective communication but I do believe that PFDJ is the only enemy of Eritreans. For me, PFDJ is not a bunch of leaders but an ideology and a system that crippled the Eritrean dreams in particular and the once thought great peace and development potential in the horn of Africa.

    PFDJ system is run on military garrison that believes on ethics of a soldier. PFDJ is a system that believes economic accomplishments through persuasive guidelines. It is a system that believes on pre-imagined and non-founded living standards. It is a system that is guided by conspired non-mutual foreign policies. It is a system that never acknowledges freedom of others.

    Equally, I feel sorry when people see PFDJ as a bunch of echelons. Worse, it becomes beyond my imagination to see individuals work day and night to diffuse their own subjective definition of today’s Eritrean politics being under the
    umbrella of justice seekers.

    I feel a great hurt when I read individuals whom we put great respect and consider as mentors in the struggle for justice and democracy punch their great mind on the continuity of the PFDJ system. More than that, for their own political discourses they write article after an article different in title but within the same message.

    In line to this, I have been told by a Cuban professor who used to work in Eritrea the political paradox of Cubans and how people who live in Florida played a negative role in keeping the Communist party led by Castro to stay in power for such long time. CUbans who flee from home stayed in the nearby US territory and continue to play a business oriented politics. And, I sense the same in the Eritrean political paradox.

    Ethiopia was our enemy but now we don’t have enemy except PFDJ. Ethiopia will come only when we are internally weak.

    Finally, staying here at Awate Forum helped me to see great minded people and to see how “Divide and Rule” policy works through labeling.

    Dear All,

    I think this should be our way. We need a way that gives us a posiitive way. Let’s work for the common objective. Labeling will not help us. Whether we divide it into 6, or on possible 50+ combinations, all we have is our own failure. Personally, I believe on diversity. I believe on uniqueness. I believe Eritrea has 6 million PLUS parties.

    Hawkum
    tes

    • Tesfabirhan WR

      When I say Ethiopia is not our enemy, it does not mean that we don’t have problems. The problem we have with Ethiopia is solvable through international norms but the enemity of PFDJ can not.

      What ever years it may take, Ethiopia does know that what it has occupied does not belong to her. And if there is luxury in doing so, let them enjoy temporarily. As for us, let’s do our classwork. We have an enemy that need to be get rid out of Eritrea and this is PFDJ.

  • Hayat Adem

    Hi Everyone,
    “አገሬን ጥየ ሄድኩ”
    “ቤት ንብረቴ ጥየ ሄድኩ”
    I asked someone whom I think owns an impeccable Amharic to reflect on the ETV news. He told me it can be interpreted as happening “at will” or “because forced”. he gave me more examples but I retrieve the above two from my memory. Both can be understood as in :because of forcing circumstances or because of own judgement”. I believed him. It was really a living lesson how people are reckless to make a mountain accusation out of nothing. Even if it was wrong to say that, this were a mistake to be attributed either to the reporter or to whoever spoke it and was quoted. These was not a political or policy forum organized by the concerned from both sides. Such fora are to be nurtured and not butchered. And the way it was promoted is as if the commented was naively positive about Ethiopia’s moves but was surprised to find out he was being double-talked while the truth he has never given the benefit of the doubt when it comes to Ethiopians. But then, what else is new, it is the psych-with-in stupid.
    Hayat

    • Amanuel Hidrat

      Dear Hayat,
      This note should be addressed to kubur Saay and not to everyone of us. And you are right this fora mean to be nurtured and not butchered even by the team members. Keep your challenge to make this fora of sane minds and enlightenment place. I am sure eventually the “psych-within-us-stupid” will loose in the battle of peace and stability.

      Amanuel Hidrat

      • Hayat Adem

        Yes Emma,
        I am more bothered by the compulsive urge and desire to go to a length of seeding some suspicion between the two people’s at the price of slackening of any little positive effort towards healing and normalization. What is that!
        The unfortunate war and the hostility has damaged enough. Political separation and economic separations have already happened effectively because of the military and political tensions. And now people are coming at the one fabric remaining: social and cultural gatherings and discourse. We can always debate and prove them how wrong and harmful it would be for both to have a red-line border between them (and it is worse on Eritrea comparatively speaking) but when people are determined to advance the agenda of total separation and blockade and you know that for sure, it really gets into you.
        Hayat

        • Nitricc

          “The agenda of total separation”
          Well obviously you are in denial but it has 23 years ago since the total separation took place. And I can assure you there is no “one people” or “brotherly people” bull crap. They got their country which is built on the culture of dependence and begging and we will built our country on the culture of work ethic, self reliance, discipline and accountability. If in fact Eritrea is turned to Ethiopia.s way of life, then I rather not say it. One thing for sure is there never will be Ethio Eritrea one people nonsense. I wish the Ethiopians the best but for us, we work to do.

        • T..T.

          The open system of the Eritrean opposition, where
          the rogue’s infiltrators freely roam to halt the opposition’s collaboration and developmental stages, has
          sometimes to pass through degenerative stages and in the process
          creates weak chaos yet correctable through open discussion.
          The opposition members as defenders of their open system with its weak
          chaos, they don’t blame their failure on others.

      • saay7

        Emma:

        Well, you know some people in the Amen Corner cannot see things clearly because Weyane has their eyes. They will wait for the Ethiopian government to apologize for the terrible choice in words then, permission granted, they will say: well, Ethiopia already apologized!

        Here’s my exchange from someone with more than impeccable understanding of Amharic:

        Me: Qedem sil: habtew: nbretachew Tlew yehedu Ertrawian…”
        Ethiopian: Yeah…that was a bit funny…II am sorry I had to lough not about the situation, but the description of it….
        Me: These guys are constantly spinning:)
        Me: stopped me dead on my tracks. You got to give them advice
        Ethiopian: that was a real mess up….

        Saw the broadcast on November 13 and it would have been just another story I see and I forget until Berhe Y wrote his epic piece.

        So tell the Weyane Amen Corner can go back to counting the rosaries:)

        saay

        • Amanuel Hidrat

          Dear Sal,
          The issue we have to see and observe carefully is whether the Addis government is doing as they have promised. By that I mean if they are returning the property of Eritreans. That is where my eyes are. I don’t engage on words mincing. So far I know many Eritreans got back their property. I expect all Eritreans who lost their property during the border war to get their property back. Again, I plead to you to stop labeling at least for the sake of the website even if you have personality issue. I expect this website a school of education. I am really afraid the way your engagement is. It is really consequential to the website.

          Amanuel Hidrat

          • saay7

            Selam Emma:

            Please stop worrying about awate.com; your concern is very touching but I think you should concentrate more on the sanctimonious attitude that creeps up when you when you are, all at once, taking a side, and then putting on your robe as the wise neutral judge. Gedima, as our Sudanese friends. On this thread, this was said about me:the “psych-within-us-stupid” and I am sure you, whether you understand what it means or not, it was you who said “I am sure eventually the “psych-within-us-stupid” will loose in the battle for peace and stability.”

            Look way up on the description of awate.com. When we call ourselves fearless, there is no asterisk attached to it:)

            saay

          • Hope

            Aman Hidrat: we Cousin SAAY:
            I think we are crossing the redline and let us NOT cross the Yellow line.
            Aman,
            I think it is only fair to challenge ideas and come closer to the Midway and debate for a lasting Solution.
            Let us put aside our Egos and “I” and “My way” stuff and stick to a common ground.
            Accusation and counter-accusation and pickiness like kids is NOT going to take us “NO where/Any where.
            All of us have own “Skeletons” under our closet.

        • Amde

          Saay,

          I did not listen to the broadcast so perhaps I may be missing something (about people coming back to reclaim property they abandoned). But I feel this is mountain-molehill territory here.

          Assuming this being an ETV broadcast that will be expected to somewhat reflect the sense (if not the exact wording) of the government at hand, I say a big SO WHAT? You act as if this is the first time a government has chosen to use self-serving words to explain a policy.

          I know personal childhood friends who were deported, some who left before they might be deported, some who stayed and had Ethiopians go and sign documents vouching for them. I know also of many that stayed and had no problem. The whole policy and process was driven by TPLF fear that there was an organized EPLF fifth column within all sectors of the Ethiopian society. How this policy is implemented in a country as large and as diverse as Ethiopia can only be imagined in all the permutations of chaos and order possible.

          The main issue is that some 15 years later, Eritreans that had property are coming back and being encouraged to come back and continue the life they had. That is a lot more than Ethiopians who were dispossessed and deported from Eritrea ever got. They were never given the acknowledgement of their own government about their plight, leave alone claiming back what they had built up. This is one of the very real policy issues the TPLF is in hot water among ALL Ethiopians – the perception or reality of constant neverending preferential treatment of Eritreans.

          There is also a nagging sense also that the political affiliation of these Eritrean returnees will be to bolster the TPLF’s continued dominance of the political system. This does not come out of a vacuum, but from the memory people had of the years of 91 – 97, when it looked like if you spoke Tigrinya you were for all intents and purposes the ruling class – irrespective of which side of the Mereb you come from. The Badme War was interpreted by many as a process of the trans-Mereb resolution of the pecking order within that particular ruling class.

          Addis is awash with Eritrean returnees. The government welcomes them back for a number of reasons (good ones in my opinion), but domestic politics is still raw about the whole affair, and there are still many unresolved issues. ETV (especially ETV Amharic) is for domestic consumption. In my opinion they found artful wording to describe a controversial policy and process. I say less high horse, and more humble pie my friend.

          If your fundamental unspoken issue is that one more Eritrean returnee is one less Eritrean committed to the project of the shaebiya-birthed Eritrean state, then I tend to agree with you. You may see that as a tragedy, but I think that is a good thing 😉

          Amde

          • saay7

            Hey Amde:

            At the risk of repeating myself, I watched the news in mid November, shook my head at it, and forgot about it until Berhe Y wrote a thoughtful piece about the deported. This reminded me of the news piece and I mentioned it: provided the link, and people were free to discuss it.

            The reason the molehill became a mountain is that people who only show up here when something critical is said about the Ethio government found all sorts of explanation for it. Some even put on their Sherlock hat to interview experts with their “but what does it really mean?” inquiries. An Ethiopian, like you, can give a perfectly plausible explanation, like you did (the news outlet is geared for local consumption, which I think is a polite way of the saying that “those who abandoned their properties” is more palatable (artful) than “those who have returned to reclaim their properties after their wrongful uprooting.”). What is grating is to hear those who equate criticism of the Ethio government with criticism of ethiopia, Habesha, etc etc.

            So the molehill was made a mountain because the usual suspects drew all their gabi to cover it up and create a broke gabi mountain 🙂

            saay

          • Amde

            Saay,

            Fair enough. It occurred to me though that I have not seen what your (Saay’s personal) opinion is about the Ethiopian deportees.

            Do you agree they exist?
            Do you agree there were waves of Ethiopian deportees both in 1991 and 1998?
            Do they need to be compensated?
            Should the Eritrean government apologize and make amends to return their property?
            Should the Eritrean government make a policy of their return and re-integration?

            Hearts and Minds, Sal. Hearts and Minds.

            Amde

          • Abinet

            Selam Amde
            Only the honorable SGJ mentioned them before. And I think Hayat said something regarding them about a year ago. Ato Saleh even talked about them with PMMZ. For the rest of eritreans in general , they never existed. What makes me sick is our government denied them any kind of help while sleeping with the eritrean government and it’s newly independent people.

          • Amde

            Hi Abinet,

            It reminds me of this young Eritrean (an Amiche no less) woman at the time that tried to tell me that unless I can say that I specifically know this person so and so was deported from Eritrea, then I must be lying, and these people don’t exist. Pissed me off for a bit but then I realized she was just spouting off the latest talking points from the Shaebiya propaganda bureau. She was just one of the cult at the time (as unfortunately most of them were then), so I got over it. We had a short talk and it was evident how overcome she was with emotion and pride about Shaebiya. There was no reasoning with her at that point. I hope she got out of it and is a bit embarrased about it. I wouldn’t be surprised if she isn’t back in Addis claiming back her – as they say – “comfortable bourgeois” life.

            But I do remember the long line of plastic shelter covers all along the JanMeda stone fence. And that is a looooong fence (over a kilometer… may be two). That particular place is convenient for the EPRDF, they are in a “public” place but conveniently out of sight of where the “smart” people, tourists and diplomats could see them. Out of sight out of mind. There is a joke/anecdote I heard about one of them. Apparently one of these homeless had befriended a dog (or the dog befriended him who knows). So early one morning the dog starts barking loud for whatever reason, waking his master up. The man opened one eye, pulled the plastic bag a bit and says to the dog… “minnew bobbi… leba meTa inde?”

            It is eye-openingly amazing though that this is even a controversial fact for Eritreans to accept even after so many years.

            I had not heard about Saleh G, raising this issue with Meles. Wow – that is something I will always remember. That is integrity. My hats off.

            Amde

          • Saleh Johar

            Hi Amde,
            I didn’t raise the specific issue with Meles because it was not he who did it. Had I met Isaias and didn’t ask him about that, you would be right. But rest assured I have mentioned it so many time in this very forum–I beg you don’t ask me to do the job for you, look for it yourself 🙂 I will pass the integrity insinuation. God forgive you.

          • Amde

            Ato Saleh,

            I am sorry you read sarcasm into what I wrote. I took what Abinet said at his word, and I thanked you for it. I am sure there are many things I will need God’s forgiveness on, but this is not one of them.

            So, don’t worry – I forgive you for reading accolade but hearing sarcasm. 🙂

            Amde

          • Hayat Adem

            Hi Ato Amde,
            Gashe must have known you in the past for your plenty sarcasm-laden notes and he took this one for granted not to be different. But on the flip-side, you are lucky: many of us tried to go sarcastic and most attempts dry unnoticed; yours is the reverse- you came plain but Gashe Saleh saw the deeper side of it. That’s a complement, I’d say..
            On the other point, I think this man (Gashe Saleh) has nothing to prove as related to his integrity as he had so many finest hours even amidst the crowd-madness of 1998-2000 when many of us were pocketed for a free ride on the road of insanity by the mindless morons. I only wish he and his website consciously work as energetically to bring these two peoples and nations to the kind of relationship that exactly mirrors their natural commonness.
            Hayat

          • Amde

            Dear Hayat,

            Well I guess I will take that as lesson learned. As the Amharic saying goes, “be af yiTefu belefelefu”. I am sure Abinet will think of a more a-propos saying. lol.

            On the topic of integrity, you don’t have to take a back seat to anyone. Actually I also love many of your sarcastic responses as well (your latest one to Hope saying “Losing Hope?” had me laughing out loud)

            To be honest with you, I do not know if Awate.com is in any position to bring any reconciliation between Ethiopia and Eritrea. I read them as conflicted as probably most Eritreans are. Reconciliation between the two states and countries is a secondary (even irrelevant) project for them. My sense is that for the most part they believe Eritrea was cheated out of the imagined promise of independence – they haven’t decided if it was because of Issayas’s personal incompetence, or Shaebiya’s institutional root. Until a new leadership team comes to Eritrea and re-boots the Independence 2.0 version, they will not get a proper answer to that question. Only then will they start looking seriously at the Ethio-Eritrean relationship. How long that will be is anybody’s guess.

            Keep the faith Hayat.

            Amde

          • Hayat Adem

            Dearest Amde,
            I wish you were wrong about Awate.com, but may be you’re not. The saddest part is the inability to see that urgency and not to work on that is completely against the greater good for everyone, much so for Eritreans. Just recently, Sal said, “I’m not against the reconciliation…”. As much as it sounded positive, the intonation was so cold. How do you lack the energy at least to say it that you want to be part of the effort. “I don’t mind marrying you” is not the same as “I’m going to marry you.” Edward Shevardnadze once said, “the opposite of love is not hate but indifference”. Some master namers (my only coinage) think indifference is the most they think they can give to peoples’ reconciliation!
            Faith in peoples’ togetherness can not be lost, never.

            Hayat

          • Amde

            Dear Hayat,

            I consider Eritrea just another poor African country with a lot more potential than most. Unfortunately, it has burdened itself with an irrational need to compete against and dominate Ethiopia. To me, that is the only issue that is wrong with Eritrea. There are many countries more diverse than it, poorer that it, more environmentally damaged than it, dryer than it, more illiterate than it, etc…. you can pick any problem… there are many countries that have it worse. And yet, none of them are flooding their people out like Eritrea is, nor are their government officials making money by trading on the flesh of their citizens.

            As state policy, the counter-Ethiopia instinct shows itself in the policy and resource allocation choices the state has made and continues to make. In short, it is more Sawa, less Asmara U. More Shabaab, less African Union. For almost a generation now. For all intents and purposes, it is a national project.

            At this point, I guess there are two options. Option One is to find a “better and smarter” way of playing the hegemonic competition game against Ethiopia. Option Two is to stop playing the hegemonic competition game and see if there is another kind of game worth playing.

            I suspect when Sal says “I am not against reconciliation but…”, he is really signalling that his heart lies with option one. I also suspect that he expresses a sentiment that is shared by many many Eritreans. It may in fact be that most of the Awate audience is in that camp.

            I can understand that most of the adults who were old enough to understand events while Eritrea was part of Ethiopia may be vested in the independence cause and the national project due to principle or personal loss. Unfortunately, the new generation that has no memory or experience of Ethiopian governance has also inherited the national project and its ills, but without the personal experience that birthed the sentiments behind it. For them it is just a matter of surviving momentum.

            The good thing is that it looks like the Option two camp is getting bigger by the day. On that score, the Awate team are gracious enough to provide us the forum to debate and help expand it.

            Amde

          • saay7

            Gwad Amde:

            You have been suckered by the dot dot dot trick, my friend. Would it change your entire perspective if you saw this:

            “I am not opposed to Ethio-Eritrean reconciliation…”
            was actually this:
            “I am not opposed to Ethio-Eritrean reconciliation, I am all for it.”

            Having been suckered into it you came up with a diagnosis (of course!) on what is ailing Eritrea. It is the patriotic duty of every Ethiopian to tell us what is wrong with us.

            Consider this alternative:

            (a) Between 1981-1997, Eritrean supporters of the EPLF and Ethiopian supporters of the EPRDF could argue that Eritrea and Ethiopia are perfectly reconciled. It is just there are these other refusenik Eritreans and Ethiopians (back then known as “chauvinists” in the parlance of the TPLF). That was a liberation front to liberation front and government to government reconciliation, never mind what those out of power in Eritrea and Ethiopia felt.

            (b) Since 1999, there has been perfect reconciliation between Ethiopia and segments of Eritrea (or at least self-declared leaders of segments of Eritrea), particularly the Kunama and the Afar. That is a government-to-opposition-leaders type of reconciliation.

            My preference is to have a people-to-people reconciliation. On the basis of their freedom of assembly. Ethiopians and Eritreans grouping themselves on whatever identity they see comfortable: by trade association, student association, religious association, ethnic affiliation, whatever they are most comfortable is without any intrusion from their respective governments.

            That would be ideal. But the governments would never allow it as they see it being a potential threat to their national security. So, what we can have is a representative government to a representative government reconciliation.

            For that to happen, we Eritreans have a lot of reconciliation to do among ourselves. When I say “Reconcile everyone with everyone”, “no Eritrean left behind”, that’s exactly what I mean.
            Now even if we do that, unless Ethiopia does the same, we will always be working with a government that will always be at odds with a segment of its population. It can write them off as “chauvinists” or “terrorists” but they will always feel bitter and left out.

            I don’t mind debates….
            I don’t mind debates; in fact I love them:)

            saay

          • Amde

            Saay,

            First off – I did not see the post dot dot dot half of the phrase. So on that I would say mea culpa.

            I am however, mystified on your accusation that I went into psychoanalytic diagnosis. I meant to say Eritrea is a normal poor African country, with normal poor African country problems EXCEPT its competition with Ethiopia (a neighbor X times its size). If I said Mauritania is a normal poor country, with normal poor country problems EXCEPT it still practices slavery, I don’t know how that is termed psychoanalysis.

            1. I hope you can tell the difference between psycho-analysis and an objective interpretation of publicly available information. Eritrea’s militarization is fact, not psychoanalysis. Eritrea full mobilization is fact, not psychoanalysis. Eritrean youth exodus (“fleeing indefinite military service”) is fact, not psychoanalysis. Eritrean diplomatic isolation is fact, not psychoanalysis.

            2. These facts are NOT due to bad people-to-people relationship, at least from the Ethiopian side. On the contrary, Eritreans are returning in droves to the country that had deported them, even when there is no sign of such a reciprocation from the Eritrean side. These facts are NOT due to bad Government-to-political faction relationship. There are no such factions who can effect anything that potent.

            3. These facts ARE, however, due to government policy. I can understand an argument that says they were initiated due to an extraordinary historical circumstance. But that was 15 years ago. Every year since then, the Eritrean government has decided on policy, allocated budget, assigned resources and executed plans to continue on the same path. This is equivalent to the “battered spouse who reloaded 15 times” defense.

            4. If you don’t like my use of the phrase “hegemonic competition” perhaps you can agree with “sustained belligerence” as far as Eritrea’s policy vis-a-vis Ethiopia is concerned. There is no Ethiopian equivalent to Eritrean arming of the Shabaab – which demonstrates that even if one can’t say it is all one sided belligerence, it is for sure highly skewed to the Eritrean side.

            5. Now please note I did not say this was a problem of the Eritrean people. If I said so it would be psychology or sociology. And the solution might be found in resolving the “people-to-people issues”.

            6. However, I say it is a constantly renewed policy of the Eritrean government. So the “people-to-people” issues have nothing to do with it, unless YOU are saying that the policy choices are driven by unexplained “people-to-people” issues.

            7. Did/does Eritrea have reasonable alternatives to the policy? I think it had, and it still has. Waiting until the instrument of internal reconciliation is perfected before exploring these options…. well, the direct linkage is not necessarily evident to me.

            8. There is in fact no state in our region that has a history of “democracy” as we understand it in the west, or even of being a “broadly representative” government. This will not happen overnight. The current Ethiopian political system cannot really be called “democratic” or “broadly representative”, but for whatever reason, it has yielded a system of governance that currently has established some peace and economic activity. (EPRDF right now is engaged in continuous elite co-option – something HaileSellasie used to try and do via political marriages).

            Amde

          • saay7

            Selamat Amde:

            The problem with the dot dot dot was not just with the person who said it (the person is a compulsive misrepresenter and dot-doter), but you used it as a basis to create a fork on the road where Eritreans can take different roads and you that “his heart lies” with those who want to play “hegemonic competition game with Ethiopia.” That’s what I meant with the usual Ethiopian diagnostic of the Eritrean heart.

            Beyond me, I have to say that, outside a tiny clique which surrounds Isaias Afwerki, I don’t know anyone who wants to play “hegemonic competition game with Ethiopia.” Even Isaias Afwerki, in moments of utter frustration, has referred to Ethiopia as “goblel.” I think we all can count: In 2020, Ethiopia’s population will be 111 million and Eritrea’s will be 8 million (including all its exiles.) And while Ethiopia is working hard to connect its 111 million and increase their sense of oneness, we are exiling and polarizing our smaller population.

            saay

          • Hayat Adem

            Amde, if you are there, I have a question for you. I recently heard about a report that the Djibouti president proposed unification of Djibouti and Ethiopia.
            Is it true and, if yes, what was the context for such a proposal?
            hayat

          • Asmerom

            Dear Hayat
            A reporter asked the presiden of Dijibouit the possibility of unification of Ethiopia and Dijibuti and the president answered ” if it is the wish of the two people we will work towards unification ” and this was reported on the Ethiopian Reporter magazine on Monday .no clarification or anything was given from either of the government officials .

          • Hayat Adem

            Thanks Asmerom. If it was initiated from a reporter, it might be more of politicking than a development. Nonetheless, would any Djibouti leader say the same thing if he was asked same question 10yrs back? I doubt so. Our leaders would never hesitate to say exactly those words in 1993-1997. Times change, don’t they!? At the risk of sounding jealous, I’m not happy that everyone around is eating our lunch. Assab is in total dereliction right now while Djibouti Port is overcrowded, Tajura is warming itself to assume a new port life. Eritrea continues to be at odds at will while Djibouti started speaking the language of unification with Ethiopia. May we live in interesting times!
            Hayat

          • Abraham Hanibal

            Hayat Adem;

            It is surprising of you trying fatally to disguise yourself as an Eritrean. Words like ኣቕቢጩ, ከዓ, may give some indication as to your real identity. And btw, the Eritrean People at this time are asking an end to the border impase, and a formation of a democratic and just government in their country, so that they could finally funnel all their efforts to building their nation. Not this unrealistic dream and nostalgia of “unity” you’re displaying. Why do you place all the mistake for the bad relations between Eritrea and Ethiopia solely on Eritrea by words like “Eritrea continues to be at odds at will…”?
            Please stop this madness of trying to speak as an Eritrean, when, in fact, you belong somewhere else.

          • Hayat Adem

            Abraham,
            Don’t worry about the identity issue. It matters less to me let alone to you. But, it is Eritrea in the person of PFDJ that starts the quarrel, the conflict, the war and the de-normalization, if you like.
            Hayat.

          • Abraham Hanibal

            Hayat;
            Ok, the quarrel has happened, the conflict has taken place, and the war was fought to the bitter end. All this culminated in the EEBC and EECC rulings the two govenmnets had signed and agreed to respect. Eritrea,represented by the PFDJ, has fulfilled its part as to those agreements; while Ethiopia drag its feet to respect the decision to this day. Is this a sign of good-will and an invitation for normalization from the Ethiopian side?

          • Gebrekirstos

            ኣታዮ! ሃሳስያ ሓደ ደርፉ። ካሊእ ደርፊ እስቲ መኩር። ልኣብነት ላለየ ላሎ 🙂

          • Amde

            Hi Hayat

            It is actually the whole Addis – Djibouti corridor that is booming. The new rail link is on pace to be completed soon. I dont know if you know of a town called Mojo. It used to be a dusty stop on the way from Addis to Nazreth. Now it is becoming dry port, simply because the port of Djibouti cannot handle the volume of transactions. The idea is that as soon as ships are offloaded the cargo shipped directly to Mojo to be processed.

            There is a plan now under discusson to create a fuel pipeline from Djibouti to the town of Awash. Awash will be the junction of the Addis- Djibouti rail and the rail extending to Meqele. If there are proven petroleum resources there have been longstanding plans to make Awash the refinery spot. So whether to is hydrocarbons coming in or going out, Awash will be a major city very soon.

            Even with these investments, Djibouti will never have enough capacity to handle the volume – that is why they are building the brand new port of Tajurah exclusively for the Ethiopian trade. Tajurah will be connecting to the town of Weldiya, which is going to be the rail juntion intersection going north to Meqele and west to Baher Dar and Gonder.

            These will all make switching cost to use Assab higher in the future.

            Amde

          • Abraham Hanibal

            Hi Amde;
            It is good news to hear all those positive developments in the economic field and the booming Ethio-Djibouti relationships. What we Eritreans want from Ethiopia is to leave our sovereign land so that we could focus on overcomming our internal problems and ultimately embark on the process of building a prosperous nation. We would value cross-border trade and co-operation with neighbors, including Ethiopia,but that would not mean our economy would be dependent on this cooperation. We would not go down and beg Ethioipia to make use of our ports; it is upto Ethiopia if they want to use our sea-port services or not. And, mind you, Ethiopia is not the only customer of these future port-services, nor would the Eritrean economy solely be dependent on sea-ports.

          • Hope

            Hayat,
            Here we go again your deliberate “Ignorance and Hypocrisy”.
            Tell us theTruth as to who offered Aseb to Ethiopia for “FREE”,yes.for FREE; and as to who,refused and sabotaged..that “OFFER”,.unless you were born after 1998,eventhough you seem more Intelligent and Articulate than most or some of us here in this forum….so as to read history “ARTICULATELY”!???

          • Hope

            Ms Hayatina(assuming that you are a Real Miss),
            ……Plus,do NOT forget that the future Aseb might be the “Better Singapore Port” or even better said,THE “International Port” just simply coz of Aseb’s Natural,Strategical and Geographical Location.
            Moreover,do NOT forget that the Future Eritrea will never be the same Eritrea of today…..for GOOD!
            Mark my word and count the days……

          • Eyob Medhane

            Hayat,

            Here is the Djibouti’s president pronouncements about that. In fact, he has given the interview in pure unadulterated Amharic..Don’t you think that is a sign ? 🙂 ( forward to 3:15 to listen to the news)
            http://www.tubechop.com/watch/4362556

          • Amde

            Eyob,

            I am actually more impressed with his linguistic range than by what he said. (You don’t stay president for decades without knowing how to turn a charming phrase).

            But it occurred to me that with that Amharic, and assuming he is fluent in Somali, Afar, French and English, and perhaps more than comfortable with Arabic, he literally will need two hands to count how many languages he is fluent in. If, as I have heard, he grew up or spent a lot of time in Dire Dawa, then Oromiffa may not be out of his span either. He is quite an accomplished person. I don’t think my assumptions are unreasonable. Perhaps he has picked up some Tigrinya, but who knows? At this rate, I might vote for him to be President of Ethiopia :-).

            Thanks for the chop.

            Amde

          • Abinet

            Amde
            The proper Amharic for this particular situation would be
            ” etsedq biye bazlat tenTelTila qerech”

          • Hayat Adem

            Abi,
            request – can you write them (idioms) in Ge’ez font so that we learn exactly how they should be sounded?
            Hayat

          • T. Kifle

            Dear Hayat
            Let me volunteer myself to provide the Ge’ez version of Abi’s ideom

            “እፀድቅ ብዬ ባዝላት ተንጠልጥላ ቀረች”

          • Hayat Adem

            ጠፊእኻ!

          • T. Kifle

            ኣስኪአ እከታተል ኣለኹ። 🙂

          • Hayat Adem

            ንሳሌሕ ዮኑስ ኣታሓምየኒ- ኣቕቢጩ! ሃይለ ዝበሃል ሓያል ገበል ከዓ ተወሊዱ’ሎ፡)

          • T. Kifle

            ሳልሕ ዩኑስ ዓርሱ ከምዝኣምኖ ፖለቲከኛ ኣይኮነን። ዝመስሎ ተዛሪቡ ኣብ መገዲ ዝድቅስ ዓንካባር’ዩ። “ከብዲ ካብ ሃገር ይሰፍሕ” ዝብሉዎ ናይ’ኒ ኣማኑኤል ሕድራት ኣቀራርባ ውይውን ብስነመርትዖ ዝ ሃፍተመ ምጉት ኣያና(in the sense of His Greatness) ሃይለ ዝለውዮ ኣይመስልን። ፀባ-ፀገብ ዕባይ ቆላ ምዃኑ ዘመስከረ ይመስለኒ።

          • Hayat Adem

            እወ’ሞ! ኣነስ’ባ ጸባ ትዕቢት ዕቡይነት መበልኩ! ጸባ ቆላስ ንህይወት’ዩ። ንነብሱ ጥራይ ሒዙ እንተዝኸውን እምብይመጸገመን- ብዕድላት ህዝብታት አሽከዕላል ግን ዓገብ! ምእንቲምንታይ፣ ንረብሓ መን? ትማሊ ትምሊ’ ዶ ኣይኮነን ብኸምዚ ወድዚ ኣራሲና ዶ ንህዝብና ናብ ሰበበኛ ኲይናት ሸሚምና ሎሚ ተራእዩ ዘይፈልጥ ሓሳረመከራ ወሪድዎ ዘሎ? እንታይ ክንደግም?!

          • Saleh Johar

            Just saw this Hayat,
            Thanks for the nice words. Nothing goes unnoticed Hayat, certainly not “dry unnoticed,” even if a bit late. 🙂

          • Hope

            Your Excellency,
            Did you trust PMMZ,RIP?
            There were/are million reasons NOT to trust him but there is NO single reason to trust him.

          • Saleh Johar

            Maybe Hope, but I am not you.

          • Hope

            Your Honor,
            I did NOT ask you to be ‘me”, but to read history as is and the Facts on the ground…but,again,that is your choice,not mine.

          • Abinet

            Amde
            Yes that fence is very long . From 6killo to menelik hospital.
            The thing is they were not out of sight , they were out of mind. If you drive 3-10 minutes from where they were, you will find most of the major embassies. American, Italian, French, German, Russia, British. You can add Egypt at a walking distance . On top of that, the German and British schools are right there.
            When it comes to Africa there is no human right only human wrong.

    • Hope

      Hayat,
      Are you serious and in your right mind?
      People were pulled out from their homes in the middle of the night and they were not even allowed to dress or to put on their shoes.
      What about the young Post-partum Mom with her Neonate being escorted bare-foot and made to walk..on bare-foot?
      Where were you at that time?
      Do NOT even try to be a better witness thanthe victims themselves.
      Let me tell you this,and I will be fully responsible of what I say:
      You lost total credibility and you are NOT, and you cannot be an Eritrean by any standard..
      It is ONLY waste of time and energy to debate with you….SAAY might know something better..
      ..

      • Hayat Adem

        What happened? Are we losing hope?

        • Hope

          Hayat,
          Losing Hope?Heavens NO.That would imply giving up my Christianity/Catholicism and betrayal of the Greatest Hawariya/Deciple of the Great Hawariyat(Deciples),St Paul/Saul.
          Hope is my only Hope—-
          But ,unfortunately,as a human being,I have lost little “hope/faith on Hayat Adem due to her ‘Hypocrisy and her double edged sword and honey-covered Ere/bitterness.
          Please,stick to TRUTH and Honesty…no matter what!

          • Abinet

            Hope nefse
            You tricked me . I was expecting St Saay. Instead you came up with St Paul . Good one ! Well, there is hope.

          • Hope

            huhuh Abi Nefsi,
            You should open some Comedy Show here as you almost surpassed my Gonderie Friend Tamagne Beyene.
            As to SAAY,he is being nominated to be Saint SAAY..but for sure he surpassed the stage of Sheik/Saidna/Gadi…..even Mufti….

  • Dear All,

    Excuse me for intruding. I hope that you would not accuse me for putting numbered comments below, why Eritrean opposition groups, within and outside Eritrea always fail. Forget about Ethiopian opposition, I mean those outside the country, for they get red-eyed, if they read any economic development in Ethiopia.

    1) There is only superficial unity, and no real unity of opinion and action among members of the Eritrean opposition groups,

    2) There are the fifth columnists in all organizations that work hard to castrate and nip them in the bud. They work in a very subtle way to make these organizations fail.

    3) There are those who have not severed the umbilical cord that joins them with the rogue regime in Asmara, although they say they are in the opposition.

    4) Some believe in the old and defunct view that Ethiopia is an anathema that should be avoided by all means possible. Ethiopia is the nemesis and PFDJ the vanguard of the Eritrean independence, and the only force that can keep Ethiopia at bay and guarantee Eritrean independence is the PFDJ, and this status quo should be maintained, if Eritrea is to remain
    independent, and the next government in Eritrea should by all means be PFDJ2-3 etc

    5) Many in the opposition are afraid of true democracy coming to Eritrea, because they know that if Eritrea is democratic internally, she will be forced to be democratic externally; i.e. she will have a peaceful and nonbelligerent external policy towards her neighbors (especially towards Ethiopia). This is a nightmare to many, and that is why they are proposing non-practical and non-existent political views like democratic coup, to incapacitate real democracy, and indirectly sustain the present system with some sort of face-lifting. Concepts like chop off the head (DIA) but retain the body (the system), scarify the creator of the system and sanctify the system itself, even if it has brought the Eritrean people to the verge of extinction, are being disseminated. It is said that in ancient
    times, people scarified virgins to pacify an angry monster. This time, in today’s Eritrea we are told to sacrifice the head-priest and the creator (DIA) to calm down (humanize) the monster (the PFDJ system), as if they are two independent entities.

    6) Eritreans always hate to own their failures, and they always look for a scapegoat to blame; because exceptional people do not have weaknesses of their own. Unfortunately, unless people accept their shortcomings and descend from their high horses, it is impossible to find a solution for the predicaments of the Eritrean people, unless of course, sacrifice has become a culture, which is upheld mainly by those who live in their own paradises.
    It is like some NGOs who lament for tribes of the Omo valley, whose culture is going to be lost, and they might not be able to take pictures of half-naked girls. On the same token, there could be people who would not like to see well-fed and healthy children in Eritrea, as their own children are in the West. They feed their children with hamburgers, coca colas, cakes, etc, while the menu for children back home contains dignity, exceptionalism, never bending to the enemy etc. Both children have a restless sleep, the one due to overfilled belly and the other due to an empty stomach. If the second group of children run to neighboring countries because they cannot take it anymore, they are branded as abducted children.

    7) Ethiopian government or any other government for that matter, cannot replace the opposition, or spoon-feed them, if they fail to mature and form a reliable and responsible organization. If Ethiopia is the problem, they can go anywhere else they like in this vast world. The problem is that Ethiopia is an enemy, Sudan cannot be trusted, the red sea is not practical, and Muslim states would handcuff and deliver them to the regime in Asmara, as they did to Andargachew Tsige of Ethiopia.
    Thus, the opposition is at each other’s throat, DIA and the PFDJ and their supporters, who wear different garbs, feel safe and happy, and Ethiopia is demonized for a sin that is not hers.

    Dear Eritreans, it is not necessary to ask an Oracle to find the answer for the failures of the opposition, because it is written on the wall. Simple many Eritreans have their backs turned to it, and prefer to accuse poor old Ethiopia for everything under the sun.

    • Abraham Hanibal

      Dear Horizon;

      I agree with most of your assessment here. I’ve, however, some reservations regarding what you’ve written in poinnts 5, 6 & 7. I think it is inappropriate of you to claim that “Eritreans always hate to own their failures, and they always look for a scapegoat to blame; because exceptional people do not have weaknesses of their own.” it is a gross generalization to claim this to apply to all Eritreans. I don’t know why you’ve such a generalised view and whether it arises from possible low self-esteem on your part. You write ” Many in the opposition are afraid of true democracy coming to Eritrea, because they know that if Eritrea is democratic internally, she will be forced to be democratic externally; i.e. she will have a peaceful and nonbelligerent external policy towards her neighbors (especially towards Ethiopia). This is a nightmare to many…” Why would these “many” in the opposition prefer to have a beligerent stance towards Ethiopia? It is simply ridiculous, why would a right-minded person in the opposition have the intention of non-friedly attitude towads Etthiopia or any other nation?
      Regarding the PFDJ, I think the majority of those involved in the opposition agree that it should cease to exist as a political and socio-economic entity in a future democratic Eritrea. PFDJ serves the interests of the dictator and his few collaborators, it is, therefore, a natural consequence that it would be rooted out. In your analysis you put aside Ethiopia’s destructive role in the creation of peace and a good neighborly relationship by its refusal to abide by the border ruling and vacate sovereign Eritrean territory. Don’t you think this refusal by Ethiopia is creating a favorable ground for the PFDJ to exploit it and use it to undermine Eritrean opposition groups’ efforts and blame them as working against the territorial integrity of Eritrea by dealing under the auspices of the occupant?

      • Dear Abraham Hanibal,

        For you information, I do not have low self-esteem, because I know myself very well. If you have high self-esteem, that is your problem, and I say enjoy it.

        When we say Eritreans on this web site in conjunction with mistakes that have been committed, we have by default Eritrean elites in mind, and never the Eritrean people as a
        whole.

        The PFDJ and many in the opposition believe that Eritrean independence can exist only as an antithesis to the Ethiopian state. They believe that friendly Eritrea is in danger of being sucked in to Ethiopia, mainly due to Ethiopia’s bigger economy and bigger market. With time, borders might lose meaning and even the essence of independence might not have its expected significance. Just look at the EU, where borders play a secondary role and economic and political integrations are taking place. Eritrean elites do not want to see this.

        When you insist on demarcation to such an extent as you are doing, you fall in to PFDJ’s trap. PFDJ is using the border impasse to extend its dictatorial rule, and you are fanning the flame for them, although you know that a small barren piece of land (economically and strategically insignificant) should not have determined the fate of the whole nation. Even if Ethiopia vacates Badme, the dictatorial system is not going to change. After about fifteen years, Eritrean opposition should have put Badme on the back sit, and should have been united to face the dictator. Many countries have border problems; nevertheless, they do not make it their main national priority, and they prefer to leave them
        for latter days to be solved.

        • Abraham Hanibal

          Dear Horizon;

          Even if your comment “Eritreans always hate to own their failures, and they always look for a scapegoat to blame; because exceptional people do not have weaknesses of their own” was directed to Eritrean elites, I say it is still a gross generalisation. All those Eritrean inntellectuals engaged in the opposition agaisnt the dictatorship cannot be put in the same basket as being arrogant and unable to accept and coreect their mistakes.

          You write “The PFDJ and many in the opposition believe that Eritrean independence can exist only as an antithesis to the Ethiopian state. They believe that friendly Eritrea is in danger of being sucked in to Ethiopia, mainly due to Ethiopia’s bigger economy and bigger market. With time, borders might lose meaning and even the essence of independence might not have its expected significance.” I agree the PFDJ rulers may have such feelings to further their repressive policies towads their people. But why would those engaged in the opposition have such views? If the Eritrean People didn’t believe in the fact that they could create an independent nation capale of standing on its own feet, they why would they spend decades and a huge price in fighting for their Independence?

          Eritreans are perfectly capable of creating a prosperous nation with or without co-operation with Ethiopia, they’ve just to overcome their current internal problems.

          Regarding the demarcation, the demand for the restoration of sovereign Eritrean territory is not only PFDJ’s demand ( though the PFDJ is misusing the issue), but also every Eritrean’s view that supports the territorial integrity of his/her nation. And if as you write the occuppied Eritrean land is “a small barren piece of land (economically and strategically insignificant)”, then why should the Ethiopian government persist on occupying it at the expence of peace and great cost to the Ethiopian economy?
          I know that the PFDJ would not suddenly endorse democracy the time Ethiopia vacates the occupied lands. But at least Ethiopia would help deny the PFDJ regime a lame excuse of “territorial integrity” to justify its violations. Furthermore the issue of ocupied sovereign Eritrean territory has nothing to do with democratization of Eritrea, it is a pure matter of sovereignty.

    • Aman

      @Horizon
      You seem to have some information gap and stuck in the past
      and unable to get uptodate and move on !
      First of all there is no what is called Ethiopian government
      there is only an illegitimate woyane government . Ethiopians
      are in a struggle to put what can be legitimately called a government .
      The First Democratic Government of Ethiopia !
      So it seems that all what you are talking about belongs to the past
      era and past regimes now in the grave !!
      Note : That is what I as a contact person of one of our New Ethiopian parties
      advised Awate forum writers and readers like you to order a free copy of past
      era regimes politics and new developments that entirely replaced them from
      our offices throughout the USA , CAN & EUROPE.
      Yours
      Aman

      • Dear Aman,

        If you think that I am a person who supports the Ethiopian government unconditionally, or a person who says my government, right or wrong, then you are making a big
        mistake. Simply, I like to give to Caesar, what belongs to Caesar, without saying that I know everything.

        I have no problem in supporting the developmental achievements of the present Ethiopian government compared to previous governments (whatever the present government may be called, EPRDF, TPLF or Woyane, I really do not care), but I have never shunned from criticizing it for its democratic shortcomings (the bogus anti-terrorism law that has put many Ethiopians in prison and the absence of truly free and fair
        elections.).

        I hate to see some Ethiopian intellectuals standing shoulder to shoulder with International Rivers opposing Ethiopian hydroelectric dams or indirectly supporting Egypt’s outrageous demands on the Nile, because they oppose the present Ethiopian government. Hydroelectric dams, roads, railways, universities etc are not going to be the personal properties of EPRDF or Woyane, but that of the Ethiopian people; and there is no logic whatsoever in opposing these.

        The simple fact is that I do not see Ethiopian politics through a party telescope.

        Regards.

        • Rahwa T

          Good stand, Admas.

    • Abraham Hanibal

      What a pity! Here are three Eritrean heavy-weights at Awate forum giving their endorsement of an individual who time and again have shown his utter disrespect and contempt of the Eritrean sovereignty and territorial integrity. Do you really support outrageous claims like “Eritreans always hate to own their failures, and they always look for a scapegoat to blame; because exceptional people do not have weaknesses of their own”, and “Many in the opposition are afraid of true democracy coming to Eritrea, because they know that if Eritrea is democratic internally, she will be forced to be democratic externally; i.e. she will have a peaceful and nonbelligerent external policy towards her neighbors (especially towards Ethiopia”?

      ሓደ ሓቂ ኣሎ፥ ኩልና ኤርትራውያን ደለይቲ ፍትሕን ዲሞክራስን ኣብ ልዕሊ ዉልቀ መለኽቲ ህግደፍን ኣዕናዊ ፖሊሲታቶምን ክቱር ጽልኢ ኣሎና። እንተኾነ ግን ገለ ገሌና እዚ ክቱር ጽልኢ ኣብ ልዕሊ ፖሊሲታት ሰበ ስልጣን ህግደፍ ናብ ጽልኢ ሃገርን ህዝብን ኤርትራ ከይልሕመና ምጥንቃቕ ከድልየና ኢዩ።

      • haileTG

        Merhaba Abraham,

        Actually, I would have preferred it if you had framed your comment in the form of asking for clarification as to what each individual saw in the comment to like or what not. I am sure each of those persons would have their own unique responses to you that would reflect their individual take. That would also have been rather democratic than taking your perspective as a yard stick and holding the rest to fault. I will volunteer my particular take towards the end, which would most unlikely not be the same as the others, at the end.

        Firstly, let me ask for a clarification as to why you’ve liked and disliked a one and the same point simultaneously:

        You liked ” One thing that crippled Eritrean organizations is that they run like military establishment where dissent is forbidden.”

        You disliked “Many in the opposition are afraid of true democracy coming to Eritrea”

        Regardless of why each of the commenters arrived at such conclusion (Horizon thinks it is influenced by anti Ethiopia tendency and SGJ thinks it is influenced by lack of discipline and democratic exercise), they both arrived at IDENTICAL conclusion. You liked one and disliked the other, why is this so?

        Here is another hypothetical question: suppose a Guest commenters Guest1 and Guest2 make the following observation, and you have no idea their nationality:

        Guest 1: “Eritreans always hate to own their failures, and they always look for a scapegoat to blame”

        Guest 2: “Eritreans always love to own their failures, and they always look for a responsible approach to to solve their problems”

        Which of the views of Guest 1 or Guest 2 would you agree with? Remember that you pointed out to me yesterday that:

        “Whether we classify ourselves as “Amen Corner”, “Maelesh Corner”, or whatever else term we coin, we’ve failed as a People to stand up against a repressive regime run basically by a handfull of culprits. This is the great Eritrean shame and it would go down in our history as the most disgraceful period. And until the day comes that we, in unison, reject the PFDJ both in words and deeds, and put a meaningful opposition to the regime, we would find ourselves having to grapple with our predicament for the unforseeable future.”

        Is it fair to assume you agree with commenter Guest 1 (which is what Horizon concluded regardless of what he makes the reason out to be)?

        My reason for liking:

        Dear Abraham, I liked the risk that Horizon taken to tell us what he thinks about us. I like to hear what people think about me, that helps me to be more grounded and balance my self-perception. Some people don’t like about being told how they are viewed by others. And if that is not consistent with their deeply held self-perception, they renege to interact. That is fine too. I wouldn’t insist for people to have identical views as me, but would put my arguments to convince them otherwise if I disagree.

        One additional reason was the fact that he initiated a conversation that didn’t devolve into the old “You’re Ethiopian mind you business” type short circuiting. You guys went straight to the points and I liked that. I think it was saay once coined “the great civilizing effect of the Awate University”. So, I was glad Horizon made his views candidly and was glad you responded in ways you felt he was wrong. That is to be liked, isn’t it.

        Finally, when we as justice seekers say we need to own our agenda, lets start with our view points and frame of mind. PFDJ has a zero bearing in the way I perceive and analyze issues and I do next to nothing to appear to meet its false criteria that it inculcated in the minds of Eritreans to gouge their self worth vis a vis their country and people.

        Investing in peace and reconciliation and going the extra mile to do so are not a mark of “hating” but “honoring” your self and country. PFDJ has made the Eritrean mind jittery and insecure to the point that self contradiction has become the hall mark our public discourses.

        Saying all the above though, I think you and me have much more in common than against each other.

        Regards

        • Abraham Hanibal

          Dear Haile TG,
          The reason I liked SGJ’s comment was because I believe he is honestly engaged in the democratization of Eritrea, and he has unwavering support for Eritrea’s sovereignty and territorial integrity. I disliked Horizon’s comment because he has made it clear repeatedly that he doesn’t respect Eritrea’s self determination, and hence he doesn’t qualify as an honest critic. Just refer to one of his previous comments where he indicated that Eritrea should barter Badme in return for Assab; that Eritrea should make available a sea outlet for Ethiopia if there is going to be any peace between the two.
          If you can expect to get reconciliation out of such a guy with such beliefs, then I think it is a great naivety.

          • haileTG

            Dear Abraham,

            Now, am I all clear to assume that you had no problem with what Horizon said but with horizon himself in the way you’ve come to judge his attitude towards Eritrea? If this is so then I understand this to be a personal issue and hope that you appreciate that feeling may not be shared by all. For example, few months back, I think it was when the Selam club was floated, horizon was the one who argued that Ethiopia should honor the EEBC determination and hand over Badem. You may not have read the comment at the time, but those of us who did remember it. So, considering that idea, how would you rate him?

            Again, dear Abraham, let’s stay realistic about the limits of a commenter. We are not looking for Badme from Ethio commenters here, nor are they looking what ever they are asking from us Eri here. These are free exchange of views and ideas and imply or transfer no actionable power what so ever. If we encourage better understanding by setting an example, better tone and self as well as other respect, appreciating the limits and diverse backgrounds of debators, their perspectives and so forth. That only helps to facilitate better communication. The actual actionable tasks are performed by people in governments and leaderships far far away from debtors here. I am looking for reconciliation policy from the organized political groups, leaderships and governments. But, I am prepared to be as open minded and understanding other’s shortfall, as they would do of mine.

            Hence, so long as the reason you differed with horizon is based on how you view him rather than what he said, surely we can find a space for those who actually responded to the message than the messenger.

            Thanks Abraham, we’re all clear now.

          • Hope

            Haile:
            You said that Horizon said:” For example, few months back, I think it was when the Selam club was floated, horizon was the one who argued that Ethiopia should honor the EEBC determination and hand over Baduma”.
            But you should also say that Horizon said:”—-Eritrea will only be in Peace if and only if,it gives up Aseb to Ethiopia…”

          • Saleh Johar

            Dear Hope,
            Sometimes ago the PFDJ ambassador to Israel mocked Eritrean refugees and told them sothing to the effect of,”If you do not approve of us, go raise guns and fight remove us [the regime].”

            What do you think of a campaign to pressure the Eritrean regime to fight and regain the Eritrean territories it gambled with? Do you think that will solve the bickering about the border?

          • Abraham Hanibal

            Dear Haile;

            As Gud has pointed out, this is a cyber space, and I personally do not know the commenters here. The only means for me to “judge” one’s attitude towards certaain issues is based on the messeges in their comments. And as far as Horizon is concerned, I’ve problem with some of his viewpoints, for example the one he said about the fate of Assab and Badme. When I upvoted SGJ’s comment, I did so because I see that he is engaged in the struggle for democratization of Eritrea, and his comment is, therefore, well-meant to this end.

            And the fact is, yes, I’ve problem with accepting Horizon’s personal attitude to Eritrea’s territorial integrity and some of the contents in his comments. I mean why would, according to Horizon, many in the opposition reject true democracy? Because that would mean they’ve to be non-beligerent toward neighbors, particularly Ethiopia? Why would Eritreans have a beligerent stance towards their neighbors? It it self-contradictory to their interests not to be friendly with their neighbors. And why would Eritreans think of themselves as exceptional, and incapable of commiting mistakes? What about the role of Ethiopia in the general peace between the two countries, not vacating sovereign Eritrean lands, and, hence, the gift Ethiopia is handing the PFDJ to play on the border issue and blackmailing opposition to its system? I think Horozon should also have considered this destructive role of Ethiopia in his comment, then it would have been more balanced.

            I know very well that the PFDJ is using the border issue to further its futile policies, and personally I don’t believe the dictators are interested in the final resolution of the issue. But this understanding doesn’t hinder me to criticise someone who comes with malicious ideas regarding the sovereignty of my country.

          • haileTG

            Selamat Abraham,

            As far as the situation in Eritrea and the misery of our people, we both agree. I do not agree with your approach in the Ethiopia issue. We have fundamental difference onthat. PFDJ isn’t the only entity that is pushing for total enemity wirh Eritrean neighbour adjoining its highland regions. Sadly, we can’t see eye to eye on that. My view of the conflict with Ethiopia is based on what we can do to help realize peace. I see the usual suspects are out with their daggers ready to strike truth, in the hope that you and me would give them the guise by engaging in futile squable. I think horizon is a fine guy I like, and you don’t. We can respect each other’s views or ours is right and the other isn’t worthy. My preference is the first one. Like the asymetric blob you mentioned, you think she is worthy of agreeing with, and I wouldn’t touch her with a
            mile long barg. But, let’s respect our differences
            and develop the debate on that we agree.

            Regards

          • Abraham Hanibal

            Selamat Haile;
            Good to hear that we agree on the internal situation and the misery faced by our people, no doubt about this. However, you say that me and you’ve a fundamental difference as regards Ethio-Eri relations. I’ve to say I disagree with this perception. My view on this issue is clear: the two sides have to engage on a constructive dialogue to resolve all their disagreements and Ethiopia has to fulfill its obligations according to the EEBC decision. I believe Ethiopia’s refusal not to abide by the ruling and vacate those territories that were given to Eritrea is one of the reasons for the misery of the people that we both are dismayed by.
            The problem associated with Ethiopia’s non-compliance is multifaceted: those people whose lands are under occupation could not lead a normal life, the PFDJ is using the issue to justify its all sorts of violations and keeping the country and population in unending state of alert and servitude. Eritreans could not concentrate their efforts on resolving their internal problems and the PFDJ is exploiting the issue to blackmail those who challenge its rule. Please tell me where me and you have fundamental difference vis-a-vis my stated opinion on this issue. Having said this, I fully agree with your position that we’ve to respect each other’s differences.
            Regards

          • haileTG

            Selamat Abraham

            You will take the blame for bringing me out before finishing the anger relieve pills saay prescribed me with. I am not sure if they’ve kicked in yet because I slept on my roof last night…haha just kidding.

            Before I answer directly your questions, let me digress and explain why your straightforward question ended up letting a full blow up to take place. You see Abraham, you disagreed with Horizon for your reasons. That is your entitlement. I agreed with Horizon for my reasons, that too is my entitlement. You weren’t happy that we/I agreed and you asked us why, that was honorable. You extended it to insinuate some sort of “hating the nation”, well that was disagreeable to me because why would one hate his brother, sister, mother and father’s place? Still, you were entitled to assume and be challenged on your assumptions. To that end, I read your question and answered it fully and respectfully. So far, so good. In essence, I should not be boxed in your criteria of love of nation. Nor should you be boxed in my criteria of love of a nation.

            What really became dishonorable and unscrupulous, was not your candidly airing what you thought. I respect that be it good or bad, we are still brothers in arms. However, those residents of a self styled box that preach owning of decisions, not being run by others, not being beholden to other’s dictate came in force not only to like your assertions but to add fuel to the fire, castigate, insult, chastise and what have you. That was real shame that exposed them big time for who they really are. If they meant a grain of what they preach at the top of their voice, they could have easily come and said to you “well Abraham, we fully agree with you on why you dislike Horizon’s views and the rest but we also think that those individuals you mentioned are free to hold their views too. Surely they are our fellow citizens and we can disagree with them but must respect their right to be independent, own their views, self reliant much like we wish it to be in principle”. No, they didn’t say that, instead they went down to every possible low to liken us to “TPLF PR” and heading to Mekelle and Adiss for purposes they consider harmful and what have you. They are indeed dwellers of their own delusional box. They have no sense of independence to think freely and stand up and be counted for principle. That is the tragedy of Eritrea in essence, we out source our reasoning capacity to the..behold here comes the BOX.

            G-15 are let to be buried and forgotten because the boxes they live in doesn’t have enough room to stand up, every suffering our people is put to the back burner and dividing the opposition brought to the fore because their box doesn’t have enough room to stand up to the glaring fact, in Eritrea wen they remember Nadew or Q’taw, their comrades don’t remember the name of their leaders at the time because the box doesn’t have enough room to stand up. The people who danced amid the Lampedusa tragedy sure enough are saddened by the young Eritrean couple dying clutching each other’s hand, even saw the mother who died giving birth yet their box doesn’t have enough room to stand up for justice, only for dance.

            Well, Eritrea and her tragic situation is brought about by its box mentality. And those who came forward to like your opposition of our expressing our idea also live inside their boxes. Their box is full of tools to fan hostility internally and externally but has no room to stand up and say “hang on aren’t they as entitled as you to hold a view?” The funny thing is each box thinks the key to our salvation is inside theirs, sadly it ain’t. This shows you that they don’t really believe in others owning their decision, nor are they committed to it at the level of principle.

            On our “fundamental” differences, let me quote what I said:

            “I do not agree with your approach in the Ethiopia issue. We have fundamental difference on that issue.”

            As you see Abraham, it is your approach that I disagree with. One objective of the PFDJ is to isolate the Eritrean people. When you isolate them, you weaken them. And when you weaken them then you can rule them for eternity. For such a reason, they jump over the moon when you attack Ethiopians and those that seem to be open minded towards the Ethiopians. Did you see how the PFDJ goons and residents of the self styled box of “let us own our decision” came to heap insults, attacks and slanders on me? You excited them and they came out swarming, what a spectacle that was!!! This was so because the surest way to isolate us is to keep us under confrontational status quo. If you start to talk and dialog and go the extra mile to be patient and accommodating shortcomings of the other, all their red lights go up. You may end up breaking the ring of isolation they are aggressively trying to maintain around you.

            Many who came out to do their did yesterday to add fuel to the fire, have born witness that I not only have identical views as you but also stood defend them directly when I disagreed. We agreed and disagreed with Horizon and T Kifle countless times. They are clear on what they agree and disagree with me. And we are capable of putting those aside and taking common position on many things that bring us together. So, I see your confrontational and “what ever you say I won’t talk to you even if I agree with what you say” approach is one I fundamentally differ with you on. That is why I said “approach”. That serves the interests of the regime and the unprincipled self styled merchants of “ownership of one’s issues”. And their interests are to keep us isolated. I know the regime does it to hold to power, but if they professed opposition to the regime, they why are they using the same tactic of encouraging confrontation? Well, my hypothesis has been stated yesterday and you are entitled to have your views on it. Whether I disagree or agree with you however, I will respect your right to have that view.

            Regards

          • Tesfabirhan WR

            Dear Abraham Hanibal,

            My respect is due always on you. I could have liked your comments every now and then but I don’t want to turn awate.com into FB.

            Haile TG, his highness, has given you the logic. I can’t agree more with him.

            Let’s come back unto you.

            Dear Abraham, you wrote, “I disliked Horizon’s comment because he has made it clear repeatedly
            that he doesn’t respect Eritrea’s self determination, and hence he
            doesn’t qualify as an honest critic.” Just read again what you wrote!

            We are not in 1960s, 1980s and to be more precise upto April 1993. There is no question of liking or disliking Eritrean Self-Determination. It is a gone-bye history and Eritrea is now a SOVEREIGN COUNTRY. Had Horizon tried to undermine our history, I could be in the forefront to rebuff him, just like what I did to YG.

            Eritrea is a country. Point! As a people, or individuals, we can only act from this dimension. If we like or dislike one on unsaid opinions, it is gonna be just speculation and questioning the unquestionable. I have read Horizon’s opinion so many times, and I could say, he is one of the finest and consistent person on his thoughts and I have never read from him questioning the Eritrean history. He believes on positive engagement and since I like on positive engagement, I like his way. But keep in mind that, liking does not mean agreeing completely. In my conscience dictionary, disliking and hating, liking and loving, disliking and disagreeing, liking and agreeing are different. Sometimes, they may converge but not necessarily always.

            Dear Abraham, with all respect I have for you, there is no question of self-determination. This chapter is closed. Only PFDJ opens the chapter to play with his bancrupted politics, “NATION-FIRST”. We can not be fooled by this. You and me have many common opinions regarding PFDJ. But, may be when we talk about the ill-policies of PFDJ, we might have different angle of viewing.

            Therefore, dear Abraham, I liked Horizon’s comment because he is FEARLESS to shade his opinion. I respected that and I like it.

            regarding generalization, yes, HTG pointed out to you by quoting your own words. HTG is gifted and good hearted person.

            Just to tell you, for the time I engaged here, I am 100% in love with HTG. I wish I put everytime 100 likes under his every comment. Instead, I preferred just to THANK HIM. That is all I have for him. And second is Amanuel Hidrat, yes, a man determined to cool us down. A man of great soul and never afraid of being labeled. SGJ is third, a man who is gifted with a pen to penetrate, a true FEARLESS man and full of LOVE for his people.

            For saay7, it is an exception. I dislike his politics, I disagree with his politics but I like his way of debating and keeping the room alive. I confess, if the room was filled with people like me, indeed it could not, awate.com could have dried-up. Only in this regard, I like him as a mentor of skillfulness in the art of Eritrean politics. It is a blessing to having him with his blessed web-page but at the same time a curse to see him working hard to maintain PFDJ in power by removing DIA. NO to saay7 on this regard!

            To conclude, this is not a FB page and we can not put likes and dislikes unless we do have a special reason to it. For me, I never question Eritrean sovereignity, it is a closed chapter. I am ahead of such dead politics of PFDJ. I engaged with other nationalities as a partner not as an enemy.

            hawka
            tes

          • Tesfabirhan WR

            Just to add,

            I see awate.com as a rocket. Within this rocket, different parts play their own role.

            SGJ: is the Nose Cone – the penetrator
            saay7: As an oxidizer.
            HTG: As a technical engineer
            Amanuel Hidrat: As Compass
            The rest, as different components of the rocket. Without Awate readres, we can not have a complet rocket and hence they have great role in the functioning of the whole system.

            The only problem here is, awate.com is using a non-renewable energy source, the polluted one and it is expelling lots CO2, well beyond it should be, to the Eritrean and neighbouring countries, especially Ethiopia. And this because, saay7 is using a PFDJ ideologue to oxidize the politics.

            My call is, for saay7 to change his fuel into susstainable enrgy source, so that no political pollution will occur. First, pollution is for us and second to our neighbours.

            But thanks goes to our technical engineer, HTG, he is on his way to transform the fuel system into more sustainable source. Cooperation is needed between HTG and saay7.

            I don’t see any problem with our Nose Cone despite the energy he is fueled by. SGJ has always the right pen to go through deep into our political matters. I love this brave man.

            Yes, our Compass was very fine. Amanuel H., I think your energy source is INDEPENDENT, did you design it in Swiss? I know Swiss is the place of the finest clock/watch production. Thank you man. Just be friendly with SGJ, sometimes, he is away from the navigational routings. Do not forget to adjust angles according in a more fine way, just to stay tight.

            Others, your presence is HUGE in the making of the whole ROCKET.

          • Abraham Hanibal

            Dear Tesfabirhan WR;

            I know that Eritrean Independence is a gone bye history, but does this mean there are no forces that would like to see this reversed? No. Mr. Horizon has said it, in his own words that Eritrea should barter its sovereing Badme, in exchange for Ethiopia getting Assab. And that a landlocked Ethiopia would never be at peace with Eritrea. Is there any clearer rejection of Eritrea’s self-determination and sovereignty than these views?

            And in one of his comments to me Horizon writes: “The PFDJ and many in the opposition believe that Eritrean independence can exist only as an antithesis to the Ethiopian state. They believe that friendly Eritrea is in danger of being sucked in to Ethiopia, mainly due to Ethiopia’s bigger economy and bigger market. With time, borders might lose meaning and even the essence of independence might not have its expected significance.” If Eritreans didn’t have the will and trust in themselves that they would ultimately create a self-sufficient state, then why would they spend decades fighting for their Independence and pay a huge price in the process? With these words he is trying to send the message that Eritreans are incapable of creating a viable state for themselves, unless they base their existence as independent state on animosity with Ethiopia, and this incapability would eventually lead them being sucked into the much bigger Ethiopia.
            The question here is why would Eritreans base their independence on animosity with their neighboring countries? They have their economy and Ethiopia has its economy. Ethiopia has more than 90 mil population, Eritrea has less than 6 mil. If given the right atmosphere Eritreans can create a prosperous nation, there is no need for them to depend on neighboring countries, although cooperation is a natural issue of good neighborhood.
            Regards

          • saay7

            Selamat Abraham:

            Here’s my take.

            * The whole scramble for Africa was accelerated by the opening of the Suez Canal. So the whole mindset from the 19th century onwards was: ports=good; landlocked = bad.

            * Since the 1940s, when the fate of Eritrea was being discussed by world powers, the conventional wisdom was that Eritrea can never be a viable state. Volumes of words were poured on the inviability of Eritrea. Refer to the many analytical pieces written by Paul Henze.

            * From 1991 to 1997, the leader of both Eritrea and Ethiopia internalized both conventional wisdoms. The narrative of that period, from the Ethiopian perspective, was that Eritrea attempted to abuse Ethiopia’s dependence on its port and from the Eritrean people’s perspective, Ethiopia pretty much run Asab: an Ethiopian was more intertwined in the Asab economy than a local Denkeli fisherman.

            * After the war, both leaders came to realize that the arrangement was either too costly or that the conventional wisdom is wrong. Prime Minister Meles Zenawi was way ahead of his countrymen on this (that Ethiopia doesn’t need Qey Bahrachen); and, faced with the Ethiopian boycott, the Eritrean leaders were forced to consider other sources of hard currency. The ramping up of the mining industry, which up until then was largely ignored, is a direct result.

            * What we know (or should know) now is that both Ethiopia and Eritrea can be prosperous and at peace without making a “deal on Eritrean ports.” The problem is that you have Ethiopians like Horizon who are still stuck in Qey Bahrachen. And you have a dismayingly vocal group of Eritreans (with YG leading the banner) who have internalized the assertion that Eritrea cannot be a viable state without being totally dependent on Ethiopia.

            And if you disagree with their viewpoint, you are either naive or wanting enmity between the two nations and two peoples forever and ever. A normalization of relationship would be a great thing for the two nations on many levels but until the Ethiopian elite come to the realization that Eritrea cannot stand on its feet, will disintegrate, will not be viable without Ethiopia, the current arrogant attitude that they accept very casually is not likely to happen. Unless, of course, they empower Eritreans who have the “Eritrea can’t be a viable state” viewpoint.

            saay

          • haileTG

            Hello Saay,

            Impossible to keep up with you, trust me ☺You started accusing TPLF with intrference, you jumped into accousing oppo for border impass, you now jump to accuse none TPLF for Assab hang up! All in between indulging in casual character assasinations. You were my ardent opposer here when I spent two years flat on telling the opposition not only to unite around the border,but advocate for the legal ruling. Now when the death toll raised and we are prioritizingpeace, and dialog, you turned to support the older positionyou undermined me on. I don’t think wanting to permanently drench one section of our population in blood would help your current subterfuge of viability. Where are we now…..hmmmm 1970?

            Cheers

          • saay7

            Funny Hailat:

            No sir, I am replying to Abrahams inquiry about Horizons “Qey Bahrachen” and why many up voted him when he basically played his mixtape (top ten style) of all that is wrong with Eritreans.

            Ane de’a Weriduni Hailat Arkey: I am trying to keep up with you and opening my geography map of how the Eritrea-ethiopia border is “highland” 🙂 watch out for the HTG wagon; I think it is flirting too much (M & A soon) with the YG wagon 🙂

            Via con Dios

            saay

          • haileTG

            Haha even funnier dear saay,

            Our people in the highlang have no longer natural trade route:

            1) They can only use the ports if they they purchase a Sudanese traders license in the black market and then send goods to Massawa to enter as destined to the Sudan (Transiting) and reclaim it through contraband in Tesseney.

            2) They are geographically removed from the Sudanese border and they can not even bring flour to Asmara from Tesseney. It has to be hidden under trucks to be distributed by cover of the night.

            They are crossing in mass to Ethiopia and setting up tents in Tigray’s wilderness. The war has weighed so much on their livelihoods. And you wish to make stand up comedy about it. Well understood, but not impressive. I talk about the physical impact of the war, you try to confuse it by referring to its physical location, that is to be regretted.

            Eritrean independence and territorial integrity is not something I guard unquestionably to impress you or YG, it was the product of the blood and sweat of my brothers and sisters. Looking out for the interest of all sections of Eritrea may be a threat to your grand designs. Not mine.

            Your response to Abraham about something Horizon didn’t say in the comment in question and attempt to be the guardian of “Eritrean Viability” by calling for permanency of the conflict by narrating history is all short of credible argument. I don’t need to hitch hick on PFDJ wagon defend the interests of Eritrea. Also, I don’t believe in maintaining Eritrean viability by forked tongue argumentation.

            cheers

          • Eyob Medhane

            Sal,

            Skipping some glaring realities just to make your point doesn’t get you anywhere 🙂

            1) Ethiopians desire to have an access to the see has very little to do with the mind set that was designed by Suez Canal, and afterwards political development. It rather had to do with millennia long attack, and attempt to isolate and then chock us then subjugate us by you know who. Our desire of having access to the see is more about protecting ourselves, keeping an eye on our enemies and stopping them from choking us than economics. Meles Zenawi may have given up on making Eritrea an access to the sea for Ethiopia, but he also was at the same time cultivating a relationship with Djibouti, which is now bearing a pleasent fruit…Why? Well because we always in the back of our minds we want to make sure we need to have a say on the Bab El Mendeb strip to stave off those who want to choke us…

            2) It seems in a manner that is very methidical Ethiopia is creeping back to ‘qey bahirachin’ it may not be through Eritrea, but in a different route. Believe. We will be there. It would have been preferable, if it were Eritrea. But this one us also as good. Actually, may better, because much less hostile and they don’t have such a man called Saleh Yunis :-)http://ethiopianreporter.com/index.php/news/item/8233-‹‹የኢትዮጵያና-የጂቡቲ-ሕዝቦች-ፍላጎት-ከሆነ-ውህደትን-ተግባራዊ-ማድረግ-አለብን››-የጂቡቲው-ፕሬዚዳንት-ኢስማኤል-ዑመር-ጌሌ

          • Abraham Hanibal

            Eyob,
            But they’ve someone called France.)) I heard your own Sebhat Nega claimimg that it was, in fact, Djibouti that belonged to Ethiopia, and not Eritrea, when he was rebutting Haile-Selassie’s and the Dergue’s claims on Eritrea, asking why Ethiopia instead didn’t go for Djibouti to access the sea. I think you know the reason very well.

          • saay7

            Ok Hailat:

            Let’s scale it back. You are saying that the no-war no-peace situation affects the Eritrean highlands a lot worse than the Eritrean lowlands. I really want to discuss this very soberly and I am all ears.

            I also do not think you understand my position on the EEBC because I have (a) advised the Eritrean government to “drink the poison” in recognition of the state of emergency Eritrea is in; (b) advised the Eritrean opposition to take a stand that is not a wholesale endorsement of the Ethiopian position; (c) called on the Ethiopian government to faithfully implement it. Contradictory? I don’t think so and I will explain.

            saay

          • haileTG

            Hi saay,

            There is nothing I endorse more than sobered and relaxed exchange. I would tolerate and ignore cheap push back aimed at character assassination from the PFDJ lackeys. ህግደፍ ብፍሽለቱ ጠኒሱ፡ ኣብ ዕርበቱ ዝወለዶ “ፖለቲካ-ፈፈው” (ሓለፈ ንዝተባህለ ኢትዮጵያዊ ኣብ እግሩ እናወደቕካ ኣውያት) is their mark of patriotism and courage. Hence, they don’t perturb me. But when such comes from a long time debater who termed my debate with Serray as one of the best and practically seen my unyielding debate to argue for legitimizing and strengthening Eritrea’s narrative over the years, it is frankly unsettling. We can always stay clear of that beaten track of naming and shaming with impunity and help to exchange in good faith.

            Until you explain, let me flesh out my determination of the economic hardiship. Recently, radio medreK had conducted a harrowing and heart wrenching ordeals of an Eritrean woman in her journey out of Eritrea. The woman, who hails from highland village, explained that before deciding to leave, she first attempted a small trade activity by re-locating to Tessenay. Her family are practically men-less and her mother had serious medical condition. As a matter of fact, it is now a common undertaking for women from highland villages to travel to Tessenay to try to mitigate their economic hardship. How many of our people in the lowlands are moving up to the highland towns and cities to mitigate their economic hardship at this time? I hope you expand on this fact on the ground saay.

            I believe ALL Eritreans be afforded the benefits of free movement, trade and development. And yes, that is doable and good for the nation as a whole. A tense problem with the Sudan would undermine natural trade routes for the regular folks in the lowlands too. This is a national issue.

            Regards

          • saay7

            Selamat Hailat:

            ‘I don’t think wanting to permanently drench one section of our country’s region in blood would help your current subterfuge of viability.’

            ‘Looking out for the interest of all sections of Eritrea may be a threat to your grand designs.’

            Just a tiny bit over the top, no?

            Anyway. I am not a political organization and I am not a strategist for one. When I look at the misery that our people are enduring and I see the unresolved border issue at its nexis, I see 3 actors with varying levels of responsibility and I shout out my recommendations. Not that I expect them to be heard but because I consider it my duty to alleviate our peoples sufferings.

            1. The Ethiopian Government: just comply; live up to your word. Obey international law. Do the right thing. There is no guarantee that this will result in the reformation of Isaias or his ceasing and desisting from his adventurism. But somehow I sense they won’t listen to me so;

            2. The Eritrean Government: just drink the poison. No, it’s not fair that you are renegotiating a settled agreement and this will probably be a bad precedent but consider the misery of your people and swallow that pill. But I know they won’t listen to me so,

            3. The Eritrean Opposition: come up with a creative way to separate yourself from the Ethiopian opposition, hell come up with Nixon’s secret plan to end the war in Vietnam, do something so the Silent Majority see you as an independent alternative to Isaias regime.

            At the core of all three (and I am indifferent as to which advice is heeded) is one thing: how do we end our peoples suffering sooner? Basically now you have the Ethiopian government and the eritrean government and Eritrean opposition all focused on who is to blame for Eritreans suffering but none willing to do what it takes to end it. And all are sure their plan will work—-eventually. Even if eventually is 10, 20 years from now.

            saay

          • haileTG

            Selamat saay

            (Dear Abraham, I have read your post and question, I will address that soon separately)

            “watch out for the HTG wagon; I think it is flirting too much (M & A soon) with the YG wagon :)”

            How is that for denigrating the core of an individual’s loyalty to the cause his nearest and dearest laid their lives down for?

            Saay, you are neither an organization or a government, nor are you the purveyor of licenses of the guardianship for Eritrea and her interests. Well, are you? So, my disagreement with your approach to the struggle renders me to be the flirting one with so and so and on my way to Mekelle and Adiss? If I believe the solution is there and I have a means to go, I sure wouldn’t need a permission to do so. But instead of answering one single question directly that you have been asked by my self repeatedly, you went the PFDJ way. They are woyane, bury them deep under. Is that how cheap to be an Eritrean is to you? If for nothing else, even for the sake of the Ghedli that you swear on so much.

            So far you told us that Ethiopia is toxic and graveyard (please spare us the distinction of gov. vs country, that is really redundant because any one would be foolish to say the people and country x are toxic and graveyard.) In doing so:

            1) You said historically from the 1950 there was such and such malice towards Eritrea…you have no explanation what so ever on what/how this is affecting 2014 and the hundreds of thousands vacating our country.

            2) You said TPLF is interfering with the activities of the opposition…you have nothing to educate your people and justice seekers on who/what/when so they know to do better.

            3) You say all those in Ethiopia have no courage to support the border ruling…you have no SINGLE organization to present to us that actually stated the border ruling shouldn’t be completed as per the F & B ruling.

            You basically have NO basis to make any of the claims you are making (or if any are true, you are evidently incapable of handling them as you failed to properly argue them). Yet, you have gone from insulting to outright writing off people by insinuating doubts to be cast on their integrity.

            The independence war made the lives of our people in the lowlands particularly difficult and caused them to be massively destabilized (some what more than the rest by being the scene of the long conflict). The border war had rendered the highland regions blockaded and villages and cities are emptied in search of better conditions. Movement, trade, prices, day to day necessities are incredibly impossible to do with. Things are are exacerbated by additional blockades imposed on import/export, denial of movement of commodities from Tessney and nearby places to the hinterlands and thousands of villagers pouring to the Ethiopian side monthly is clear evidence of the dire situation.

            If you knew disadvantages coming from Ethiopia, it would have been your duty to educate and inform your fellow justice seekers in a way that would better the struggle they wage. Yet, you are here insulting, debasing, and even insinuating all kinds of subversiveness without due care.

            i am certain you have NO bases whatsoever to make any of the slanderous accusations you are hurling. Your hatred of Ethiopia as a political entity is forcing your hand to agitate for against Ethiopia, but not only that but you wish to make a good chunk of justice seekers a sacrificial lamb in this endeavor.

            Let me finally hit the nail on your strategic fallacy: the legitimacy of the struggle for justice is driven from the brutality of the system, as well as the treatment that it is dishing out. IT DOES NOT emanate from real/perceived sense of legitimacy of any organized group. By de-legitimizing individuals and groups, you appear to be seeking to de-legitimize the very struggle.

            Honesty and justice would require us to candidly speak about the situation in Eritrea and those most affected by it. But vested interest or otherwise might suppress truth for the time being, not for long though.

            BTW: ኣበው ክምስሉ’ሲ መን ምዃንካ ክነግረካ’ስ ምስ መን ከም ትኸይድ ንገረኒ ይብሉ። And no doubt that can clue you in as far as whose interest you are trumpeting here.

            Regards

          • saay7

            Hailat:

            I am still waiting for the sober part in the “sober discussion” we promised our readers on how the status quo is disproportionately impacting one segment of our population. Never mind sober, this is not even a discussion. It’s an “I am really angry” manifesto. So let’s skip this until you calm down.

            Now, our job as an opposition is not just to delegitimize the regime but legitimize it’s alternative. I am suggesting to you that the opposition delegitimize itself. Not by going to Addis but by allowing Addis to run its agenda. It’s curios to me that you either coined or popularized the “silent majority” and you don’t know its #1 reservation about the opposition. Actually, I think you have written off the silent majority and renamed them something unflattering because they don’t see the Eritrean reality the way you do. Talk about writing off.

            I will show you the last document written by the Alliance in its charter about its position on the border ruling. Then you tell me if its not identical to the position of Ethiopia. Since then many in the opposition have taken the position that that is the rope to hang PFDJ with and have chosen to be silent about it.

            Finally on naming names. Would you like me to give you the names of Eritrean political leaders who are now living in Addis who are unhappy with Ethiopias role? Is that a serious question?

            Hailat, when you get angry you say things. And if you half-believe what you write when angry (of the two quotes you wrote about me if you believe even 1) then you are just going through the motions and you should not consider me a comrade in your cause because by your definition we are not struggling for the same cause.

            Saay

          • haileTG

            hey saay,

            While I reflect on your “anger management” advice, let ask simple question:

            – Do you weigh and choose words to fit the the message you wish to convey, or simply plug n play?

            I must tell you, I do the spell and grammar check only time permitting, but the choice of words are carefully processed in this side.

            “section of our country’s region”: I chose this description to relate to you that “regions” are undermined. They may contain highland villagers or city dwellers that live there regardless of which “segment of our population” they belong. Notice, this is a carefully politically chosen wording. Much like you tried to equate “Amen” with “Maalesh” outside of my calculation and choice there of.

            “segment of our population”: This refers to ethnic, religious or other composition. Note that I have any issue to discuss matters concerning those, but I am aware of the “insecurity” and “jittery” state of mind many are reduced to. So, I carefully avoided using it.

            Let me make it clear again that words are all we have to communicate here, hence it is imperative we actually use them the way they are delinted. Afterall, this is a political discussion, and I would admit to strictly using “politically chosen words”.

            My view of the silent majority and expectation on it might have evolved, which is my prerogative, but I don’t think I have aligned them with external cause and hence not to be Eritreans. If one is serving the interests of outside powers then they no longer be deemed nationals. That is compromised. The regime does this consistently because Eritreans are basically worthless to it. In normal circumstances it is a grave crime to do so without well founded and credible evidence, it simply is a matter of life or death issue. I am asking you to avoid this high crime if it is unintentional. Take Eritreans for who they are and what they do as Eritreans. If they are supporting or opposing deal with that, but cut the stuff about Ethiopia this or serving Ethiopia like this. Else give us evidence, and no thank you for fb links. You are proposing fatal poison and you must thoroughly ascertain your claims. Otherwise, you really aren’t serving the struggle by waging war on it.

            The rest will follow when the elements subside…

          • ghezaehagos

            Selam Haw Haile, Emma and Saay,
            Just to interject, putting on Tesfabirhan WR’s hat, let us cool down. Those of us who read you for long, we consider you as finest debators ,educators from the great nation of Eritrea. In this ‘cursed’ time of us, we have few anchors, guideposts. Issues beyond our control can’t be solved by us. We can only try, humanely, sanely and honestly. Problems decades in making, bad-blood coming home to roost, need critical mass. Acknowledging the limitations of the parameters we can swing the cat is prerequisite for debates and dialogue. Besides, based on the background, we all have our proclivities and affinities. We don’t have to peel each other to the bone to determine our patriotic levels. We are trying to create a diverse nation of multitudes in the political world; not pristine saints for the heavens…
            We know we all can do better than unflattering debate we all are part of.
            All the best,
            Ghezae Hagos

          • Solomon T.

            Haile TG,

            Now I’m starting to see why they call you ‘the great’! Every statement in your post here contains a powerful message to whoever is willing to listen.

            Solomon

          • Tesfabirhan WR

            Dear Saay7,

            I can only say, “you missed YG so much. The reason is he is your favourite client. Unfortunately, YG is gone and you can only find him in the garbage wagon.

            come-on saay7, there is no shame to change your fuel into a more sustainable system. The energy you use is outdated and fully exposed as well as naked. No Eritrean can be fulled by your approach. It is time to change to an environmentally friendly fuel source. Do not be late though it is better than being retarded one. USA did the same like yours until Obama took a serious measures on alternative energy source.

            Hawkan zekbrekan
            tes

          • Tesfabirhan WR

            Dear Abraham,

            If Woyane is bargaining on the “Badme-Assab” issue, it is only because of PFDJ aggressive policy for peace and development. If Eritrea is a weak nation, like that of Ukraine where Russia put questioning on old unfounded and non international norms after Ukraine became a total dependent country on Russian oil export, yes, why not Ethiopia can also will go on questioning.

            PFDJ, instead of building a free and independent economic policy, he depended totaly on fabricated business relationships and black market with Ethiopia. This was the big fault. Had Eritrea followed the international trade norms from the very beginning, we could have built a sound and mutually respected economy.

            do you know that Eritrea is not a member of WTO, many more international treaties and organizations?

            Another big mistake happening right now is the trade-exchange between Eritrea and Sudan. Awate.com has reported it breifly. If things continue, things will be very complicated very soon and surely Sudanese people will stand against PFDJ system of trading. Did you read recent political developments in East Sudan?

      • Hope

        Abreham,
        Well said.I second to you.
        “ሓደ ሓቂ ኣሎ፥ ኩልና ኤርትራውያን ደለይቲ ፍትሕን ዲሞክራስን ኣብ ልዕሊ ዉልቀ መለኽቲ ህግደፍን ኣዕናዊ ፖሊሲታቶምን ክቱር ጽልኢ ኣሎና። እንተኾነ ግን ገለ ገሌና እዚ ክቱር ጽልኢ ኣብ ልዕሊ ፖሊሲታት ሰበ ስልጣን ህግደፍ ናብ ጽልኢ ሃገርን ህዝብን ኤርትራ ከይልሕመና ምጥንቃቕ ከድልየና ኢዩ።”
        Courtesy of Abraham Hanibal…
        Quote of the Year.
        That was/has been/is and will be my stand and approach!!!

  • Hope

    Gud,rather,very G O O D one!!!@
    Well said and cannot agree more.
    No further questiosn, your Honor,even if I have one!!
    Yep,you nailed it ….
    “So, Eritreans do not know about the Qatari troops in the border? Man, that is funny. Who is Eritrean to you? You mean the residents in the border, Asab and all, who could physically see anything happening there, are not Eritreans to you?
    Here is the thing, one of the good thing about Eritea is the fact that it has a very tightly knitted society, from end to end, meaning, if an Asab resident saw and knows something, your regular guy in Asmara definately knows it. Actually, the Gov, couldn’t prevent the flow of info, even if it wants to.”:
    And to balnce it,you also siad:
    “Having said all that, if you mean to say, in a genuine concern about Eritrea, it’s people and its government, that the Gov. should have to come out more frequently and officially inform its its people quickly enough before they become victims of bela below, well, you have a point and I would say that is a concern a citizen should have.”
    Courtesy of Gud.
    Source awate.com
    Addendum:
    The PFDJ should move fast now and correct its past mistakes as the Eri people know each and every mistake made by its leaders…..by gathering the info from inside(first hand witness) and from Ouside(as a ref).

  • Hope

    Hello AT and the Awatistas:
    Here is my opinion on these sensitive and seemingly gray areas:
    There is NO need of shenkolol here and there.
    Be it you/our view, your/our stand/position,etc.,please let us try to clarify the “Gray Areas” people are expressing as such,going forward.
    The concern here is that the Forum is a bit perplexed and confused based on your seemingly “Contradicting Reports and Editorials”,which I have NOT confirmed and NOT entitled to say so.
    Here is what people would expect from you in order to “sell yourselves and your Vision/Goal” and to buy your Audience:
    -Reconciliatory,neutral,inclusive,balanced and “accurate” Reporting and “Editorialization”.
    -Avoid codes or words like labelling or accusing others in a ” Blanket” style
    -Rather,try to persuade in a positive,constructive,rational and reconcilaitory way,instead of using terms like” Crusadors,NGOs,Opportunists,etc..”
    -Avoid animosity,old grudges,
    -Believe in and practise Real and Practical Reconciliation and Raproachment; and I am saying this based on the facts at hand…
    -Express yourselves, your concerns,opinions,inputs,etc..in a constructive,persuasive,diplomatic,etc–ways.
    Eevnthough it’s an “Eritrean Political Culture” to disagree among oursleves,to be polarized and to antaginize each other for lots of reasons,I am concerned that we are not doing well on the “reconciliation “aspect.
    Here is why:
    -The recent AT Editorial on Medrekh,and EFND—and the seemingly overt animosity among/between them
    -The animosity between/among the EDA/ENDC/NC,the AT and EPDP
    I see a perpetual antagonism and polarization among the above groups,the AT included.
    WHY??
    How do we expect a Successful Struggle,when in fact,we are working against the intended SUCCESS?
    We blame the PFDJ for blaming others–the CIA,the Weyane,etc…,when,in fact,we are doing it worse than the PFDJ.
    I could have said more but I better NOT due-to—-
    Having said all these,my questions will be:
    -The same question Hailt TG asked you—who is going to take the lead then if others are NGOs,Opportunists,Reactionaries,Impotent,Puppets,etc??
    -What are the weaknesses,the mistakes,the drawbacks,the wrong-doings,the hiccups,the obstacles,etc..that are blocking our struggle to succeed?
    I think we know them but we do NOT know how to tackle or resolve them,and that should be the Topic for debate….rather than “shenkolol or kemish Adey hanquiluni” style excuses and debate.

  • Rodab

    Hello Gud,
    Ok so you claim people inside the country have as much if not greater understanding than us of what the government does. Fine, forget about us and let’s focus on them. So how much do they really know about what the secretive government does? Does the highly censored state media tell them everything or anything they needed to know? On foreign policy for example, when dignitaries visit or ours make visits, is the usual single-liner template, “cooperation ageements signed” or “topics of mutual interests discussed” sufficient? Do people have access to ask basic questions that matters to them like ‘what’s the reason our kids are made to complete high school in Sawa?’, or ‘can we get CONCRETE information as why the national service is unlimited’?, or ‘the President made vague announcement about the constitution, its been 7 months, can we pleasssssseeee get some clarification?…
    Gud, You mentioned the internet. Wikipedia would tell you the accessibility rate in Eritrea is less than 1%. If you subtruct the bandwidth used by government officials and foreign embassy staffers and the very few privileged citizens, there isn’t much left for the rest of the population. So the only info source for the regular Daniel and Senayit or Aboy Gebru and Adey Tsirha is the state media. And the state media as you know is….
    Come on Gud, if you are saying you and me do not fare better in accessing to information than folks back home, it is you who is insulting them.

    • Gud

      First of, the reason I posted the above comment was because I thought a resonable person going slightly awry. I said slightly,

      The problem I had with your initial post is the fact that you kind of implied as if the Gov. says more outside the country, but hides everything from those inside. And I am telling you whatever came out outside the country, is known inside too. Actually, for certain things, those inside might know more, as there are other Chanels the Gov communicates with its people inside, for instance those meetings I told you. This is not counting all the medias of the lost souls not the ones sponsored by woyanie or other foreign body.

      The point here is Eritreans inside Eritrea are not in the dark as some people think they are. That is all

      Now that doesn’t tell how much info is allowed to go out, be it outside or inside.

      As for the questions you thought are haram to ask inside Eritrea, you would be surprised. I mean, you could argue as to what comes out of asking those questions, but as for openly asking them, well, you would be surprised. The only difference between the questions a lost soul, selfish individual or group barking from outside and that being asked in meetings inside ERITREA is: the first one doesn’t give hoots about those serving, all it wants is to just find a way to destroy the gov, or a vehicle to go to power or just to satisfy the need for revenge deep inside. While the later is meant to genuinly find a solution to the problem with out compromising the nation, the people or the government. Meaning, they don’t just say “national service is too, long and is causing problems, hence let’s remove the gov.” just like that. Meaning they ask the questions placing themselves as part of the whole positive and negative effects of the issue.

      • Rodab

        Gud buddy,
        If you thought I said the government hides information that it shares with ousiders, you are correct. That’s exactly what it does. Few examples off of the top of my head: (1) Just recently, it disclosed the annual figure* it earns from the 2% Erispora revenue. Take a wild guess as to whom it disclosed this first-time ever information. (2) On the conflict with Djibouti, do you think our people know Qatari troops are monitoring the border over there? May be. If they do, that is thanks to “controband” information. (3) Recently, an official made an important remark about the duration of the national service. That information was exclusively shared with folks OUTSIDE the country.
        Your turn.

        * I love the SEMG reports (btw, when is the next edition?) because they are full of information the government never discloses to the public. I recommend you read them, if you haven’t done so.

        • haileTG

          ah disqus!! pending again…

      • Tesfabirhan WR

        Dear Gud,

        Do not try to tell us the so called open questions during meetings. I was one who was freely asking and critisizing the PFDJ administration while I was home. If you are a closet cadre, sure you will get my recorded videos in Eri-TV or PFDJ library.

        Do not take people here also naïve by telling that there are even more open access to information or better people are well informed on what is going on. I do agree with you if you only say, “the thing people discuss on cyber is first handidly experienced by people living in Eitrea.” Yes, Eritreans know what happened to them in Adi-Abeto, Eritreans know what it happened in wiA. Eritreans know how corrupted military officers are involving in the human trafficking. When, I was back home, I was much more informed about the ill-politics of PFDJ, internally and externally. If you consider this is enough, I can only say, you are a NAIVE PERSON. To know is different and to act for what you know is different.

        Here, people in the diaspora have an advantage and that is because they can act on what they can and they are doing right if a good hearted person evaluates it.

        hawka
        tes

  • ghezaehagos

    Selamat all Awatistas,
    My question is for Sal Younis.
    I would like to ask for your explanation in respect to why Awate Team is promoting reconvention of National Council fully knowing it will be conducted in Ethiopia, while on the other hand YOU repeatedly are lambasting Eritrean opposition will not be any effective because ‘the opposition goes to Ethiopia to die’ and/ or ‘they are welfare-dependent on Ethiopia.’
    You appear to hammer the point that EPRDF has grand plans on Eritrea itself and hence it is weakening Eritrean opposition to ‘cure us’ of some ailments. As others said, I would like you to write a ‘complete’ expose on Eritrean opposition vs. role of Ethiopia, given the very complicated nuances of the subject; with of course what you think is/are the solution. Please bear in mind, which I think you do, there are Eritrean opposition groups critical of Ethiopia which have not fared any better in mobilizing the Eritrean mass in Diaspora; and please bear in mind there are groups that still maintain presence and office in Ethiopia with chapters and members all over the world, actively participating in ‘deleyti-fithi’ events…
    In the classic wording of the Haile Drue, ‘what is Badme?’ WHAT IS ETHIOPIA? is the question to answer. The government; the venue (or mere place) where one can do myriad of independent activities with cooperation and good will of Ethiopia because there are hundreds of thousands of Eritreans there? Or an ally that have a lot in common with some of our interests in weakening the PFDJ structures and apparatus (eg., economic and diplomatic isolation; shaming and naming mining companies operating in Eritrea; COI and SR investigations; (unlike Sudan); etc..) Or ample ground for minority nationalities to make maximum impact because they would be favored by the policies of current Ethiopian rulers? We need to flesh out the issues one by one as far as we can before labelling ‘Amen corner’ and ‘Embley’ corner, both pejorative and unnecessarily provocative terms….We will await for your article on this one..
    For now, dear Sal, here is repeat question. Your Team wrote Eritrean opposition needs effective umbrella and it is vital the NC has be reconvened in Ethiopia before summer. In none of the factors that crippled the NC in the past years Ethiopia was mentioned, may be obliquely. But in the comments section you faulted Ethiopia as a graveyard of the Eritrean opposition. Now, why should you as ‘a Team’ ask the NC to be revitalized again if your view of Ethiopia is clearly very negative in terms of its role in the Eritrean opposition? Logic dictates you should advise them to stay away from Ethiopia as much as possible…methinks.
    All the best,
    Ghezae Hagos

    • Amanuel Hidrat

      Ghezae,

      I can only say to you “tseba Sitte”. The team always contradict with themselves. And when you tell them they have the audacity to level to anyone that differ from them with adjectives especially Saay. Look Ghezae, they don’t have first hand info for the accusation they are making against. But like what you said, if they are sure enough about the interference, they should boldly call them out from Ethiopia and help them other venues, and we shall see if the political malaise of the opposition will be cured from being out of Ethiopia.

      Amanuel Hidrat

      • Guest

        Dear Emma,

        No doubt you are a smary guy, but why would you not challenge the team if you think such interference doesn’t exist in stead of up-voting and embodying comments contrary to the team’s position. Thus far, you have neither acknowledged nor denied that such problem exists.

        Now, I am reposting the question and it is up to you to challenge it.

        “Since 1999, where the Alliance of Eritrean National Forces (AENF) was established in Ethiopia, the Eritrean organizations have not made the progress desired. Ethiopian government should take:”

        Regards

        • Amanuel Hidrat

          Dear Guest,

          Ditto: the answers I gave to Saay. If you want more let me see it.

    • Hope

      Ahlen Attorney Ghezae Hagos,
      Peace be unto you….
      I was stumbling with my broken English to try to ask the above questions you asked eloquently and am glad you did.I will reframe my comment later on based on your eloquent analysis.
      I am sure you know what the AT is doing and what not.
      It sounds contradicotry and” Hypocritical??Doesn’t it?
      I would have gone into the details but it will be unfair…and unconstructive but I am feeling nervous when people mess up purposely.
      I thought SAAY is NOT a member of the AT otherwise it will be beyond contradicotry and “hypocrisy”(my apology using this term but—) based on his latest Articles on “Legitimacy”,”Reconciliation”,etc—
      I agree that the AT should be cautious and considerate.
      I admire and appreciate Haile TG in disecting the issues somewhat,though very softly and tangentially..
      Until my next comment,here are few basic questions to the AT:
      -Please clarfiy clearly as to who are the Resistance Forces and who are the Opportunists,The -Who/what is the NC and its members?
      -Who is attending and who is NOT?NGO,etc—
      -What would be the role of the Ethiopia in this Conference?
      -What are the weaknesses,probems,obstacles,drawbacks,etc–for the lack of the Success of the NC/ENDC?
      -What would be the practical answers and solutions?
      N.B.I am mixing this Article along with the latest one by the AT(Its Unsolicited Advice to the EU)purposely as they seem to be related.

      • Amanuel Hidrat

        Hope,
        I quote you: “I thought SAAY is NOT a member of the AT otherwise it will be beyond contradicotry and “hypocrisy”(my apology using this term but—).” Hope, rest assured that Saay is member of the Team.

        • Hope

          Aman:
          Yep,you quoted me correctly for saying:””I thought SAAY is NOT a member of the AT otherwise it will be beyond contradictory and “hypocrisy”(my apology using this term but—).”
          And that is the dilemma of the day…unless I am missing something??
          BTW,I know SAAY is, and has been, NOT just the member of the AT but also the Engine behind the Team.
          I was expressing my frustration for such a kind of “double standard.”,if I might call it or am allowed to say so…as an opinion!!..
          Listen Cousin SAAY:
          Please,with all due respect,make up your mind and stay Principled and Firm –to your words….otherwise,the Credibility issue might pop up, and we do NOT want to be the victims and metsawetti tsela’itina…..Aibelanando aitebilena….
          My apology if I crossed the redline but I am feeling it that way…and I stand corrected if I misperceived/misunderstood you.
          We are dealing with a serious National Issue,not just PR Gimmick or Political Acrobatism.I know that we all know our limits but we are trying to express our grievances and opinions for the BEST Interest of Eritrea

          • Kim Hanna

            Selam Cousin Hope,
            .
            Sorry to barge in like this. I read your above statements and wondered if you have missed these little gems Mr. SAAY have told us in the past, about a year or so ago, could be less.
            .
            I am sure I am quoting him well here. He said “…that ethics is situational and an activist who prides himself/herself on his/her consistency has no business being an activist…”
            .
            He also said in a mocking way of those individuals who stand on their principles as “…here lies a noble looser but, oh, how principled he was..”
            .
            You see, Hope, in that world Mr. SAAY is, he is always consistent. I know you probably don’t agree with my conclusion but I thought, at least, you should factor in what he said himself.
            .
            K.H

          • Hope

            Thanks Kim Hanna, and Ama Hidrat as well!
            I was just expressing my naive,unpredicatble and erratic nature by ,unnecessarily,challenging my Cousin and my Mentor/Prof…but,hey,he is a human being and I “Hope”, he will either correct me or “correct” himself.
            No matter what though,he will remain my unformidable mentor/Prof and Cousin….

          • saay7

            Hala Cousin Hope:

            .
            Kim Hanna (was she the one who was shocked that Metahit Eritreans rode horses? I get all my Weyanistas all confused sometimes) forgot to tell you that I was quoting Saul Alinksy’s 4th rule.

            .
            Ali Salim had quoted it wrongly and I was telling him what Saul Alinsky actually said.

            .
            You can find the entire exchange here:
            Abu Ulwa:

            You really have to get Saul Alinsky’s “Rules for Radicals” which should really have been entitled “Rules for Underdogs.” In fact, it should be mandatory reading for every opposition leader who never ever misses an opportunity to miss an opportunity. Complimentary copy of the book should be sent to YG and his disciples who have non-stop omg moments in assessing our revolution which followed standard operating procedure of a successful revolution (including the American revolution) in demonizing the Enemy.

            Rule 4 is not exactly how you described it; I will include a screenshot here from the book but it is essentially an argument that ethics is situational and why an activist who prides himself/herself on his consistency has no business being an activist.

            Relative to laws, Alinsky’s gives an example of two Lincolns: the one who had said that even bad laws, while in place, should be “religiously observed” then once he was in a position of power ignored bad laws. Eritrean politics is full of tombstones which read :”here lies a noble loser but, oh, how principled he was.”

            http://awate.com/constructive-ambiguity-and-eritreas-bad-choices/comment-page-1/#comment-148582

            .
            saay

          • Kim Hanna

            Selam Mr. SAAY and Cousin Hope
            .
            I wrote down the quoted lines when I read them at the time. Avoiding all the lengthy explanations, I want to apologize for attributing them directly to you. It is my mistake.
            .
            BTW, this Kim Hanna is not a she or a Weyanista.
            .
            Mr. K.H
            .

    • saay7

      Selamat Ghezae!

      Welcome back, sir. First of all, we are not “promoting”, we are reporting.

      There is no “saay going rogue” here:) We (Awate Team) have also reported (Gedab News) on Ethiopia’s destructive role which you can read here:

      http://awate.com/ethiopia-organizing-yet-another-eritrean-conference/

      I know kids who can barely place Eritrea on a map who went to Addis form the US because they were “youth.”

      The Ethiopian government’s destructive role is four-fold: (a) it convenes congresses haphazardly, regardless of existing Eritrean infrastructure which are barely getting started. (Example: refer to above link); (b) it directly intervenes in the process by trying to place its favorites in leadership position. For a good example of that, refer to Saleh Gadi Johar’s “An Office Full Of Mice” written in his inimitable way here:

      http://awate.com/an-office-full-of-mice/

      (c) It emboldens its favored leaders people to disrupt the process. For a good example of that, refer to this:

      http://awate.com/eritreas-national-council-suspends-qernelios-membership/

      And (d) it has multiple authorities–a military intelligence and a political office–representatives who are the liaisons of Eritrean organizations who encourage the member organizations of the Alliance or the Bayto/Majlis to bypass the chain of command (thereby weakening the authority of the elected executives.) One of the most surreal discussions I have ever heard on this subject was this: SGJ was pointing the flaw in this, and Amanuel Hidrat was telling him that Ethiopia has the right to do that. It got surreal because SGJ would say, “yes, but I as an Eritrean would like to express my preference” and Emma would go to his talking point, “yes, but Ethiopia has a right to do that and protect its national interest and that’s how it is everywhere else.” It was like Emma was the spokesperson of the Ethiopian government.

      The question of WHY it does this is open to speculation. Mine is this: the EPRDF (by which I mean the TPLF because the rest of the EPRDF is agnostic about Eritrea) has always maintained its opposition to the way Eritrean Ghedli was conducted (and nearly half of the Eritreans it sees in leadership position are products of Ghedli); it considers them un-reformable and it has been on a rampage to breed and groom their replacements. Except for those ghedli-era politicians who have seen the error of their ways and admire the grandness of TPLF.

      If this website was critical ONLY of Ethiopian government then your criticism would be valid. But we have also criticized all the European NGOs who attempt to incubate Eritrean organizations, have we not?

      I find all the brouhaha against adjectives mildly amusing because anyone who questions the wisdom of associating too closely with Ethiopia is suspected of being a closet PFDJ, right? There is no conflict between this website calling a revitalized NC and me expressing my view that Ethiopia is a graveyard of the Eritrean opposition (actually, I wish I had thought of that: it is a line Serray used to use.) What I am hoping is that Eritreans, wherever they are, regardless of the venue, assert themselves and own their own agenda. And that in Addis, if past is a good predictor of the future, they will face extreme challenges to do so, for the reasons I stated above.

      saay

      • ghezaehagos

        Selam Sal,

        Really? I suggest you read back the Team’s editorial with detailed information on the malaise of NC and even 6 recommendations for the future (none on the “destructive role” of Ethiopia, mind you), and you call it now that is reporting not promoting! I leave that to the readers, but it surely reads promoting…If not, the Team missed an important factor: role of Ethiopia. My follow up question is more rhetorical: what now, Awate Team does not Want to promote NC, while it is asking all deleyti fithi groups to strengthen and yes promote NC? 😀

        will be back….

        Ghezae Hagos

        • Amanuel Hidrat

          Courage requires to say, yes we are contradicting. When did advising/promoting became a reporting? Wow!!!!

        • Hope

          Attorney Ghezae,
          Keep on cross-examining,Sir, as the Jury needs more clarification.
          FYI:
          To those few of you, who may not know Ghezae Hagos,he is a staright “A” Asmara Law School Grad and I know him well and that is why I give him a hard time at times….

        • saay7

          Selamat Ghezae:

          You said “will be back”… should I reply now or wait until “baldongakha zwda’a”?

          Kbur Abal Hagherawi Bayto Amnuel Hidrat:

          I am sorry you have been so busy you were not able to reply to my earlier question. So here it is:

          “Since 1999, where the Alliance of Eritrean National Forces (AENF) was established in Ethiopia, the Eritrean organizations have not made the progress desired. Ethiopian government should take:
          ____________ responsibility for this failure.

          a. none of the
          b. some of the
          c. most of the
          d. all of the

          I am sure SGJ will lend you The Pencil to mark the correct answer:)

          saay

          • ghezaehagos

            Hi Sal,

            The device I’m using isn’t ideal. So, you can answer the reporting vs. Promotin query…If not promoting, shouldn’t you do so when you ask others to promote NC and be part of it…

            Hope:- If you knew me in AU, you would also know I was not straight A student…Thanks any way…

            Ghezae Hagos

          • Saleh Johar

            I am here again Ghezae,
            One thing that crippled Eritrean organizations is that they run like military establishment where dissent is forbidden. Why is it difficult to understand that one can hold dissenting views contrary to a given view of the group, team, association he or she belongs to? Just to illustrate, many many times individuals do not with certain views or decisions of their association, but they feel duty bound to uphold and defend a majority view. That is called discipline and democratic exercise. Gladly, we have managed to establish a system that allows dissent at Awate.com. Believe me, it works.

          • saay7

            Abu Salah:

            Ghezae, a law-school grad knows this. He is just having fun:) In law, there is “majority opinion”, “plurality opinion” and “dissenting opinion.” One of these days, we are going to have to stream an Awate Team meeting so people get a glimpse of the sausage factory. Some (and I am not saying who) are products of “democratic centralism” and they are bewildered and will continue to be:)

            saay

          • ghezaehagos

            Hi Sal,

            Actually, the editorial is good, very good and timely. Awate Team is promoting the NC re-convention, re-vitalization. You don’t have to mince words.

            There are some pointers to ponder upon.

            1. One of the most controversial issues that keep on coming again and again is the role of Ethiopia. We, Eritreans at deleyti fithi, have argued, debated and came to cyber-fists about this unending case. Hence, any serious commentator, especially who seem to have reversal of positions (please don’t drag us into what awate team wrote in defence of the ‘positive role Ethiopia played’ until two years or so) needs to explain to us clearly what are the real concerns and what are the proposed solutions. Preferably in article format.

            2. It boils down to this: the word Ethiopia means a lot of things to different people. That is why we need to clearly flesh out the word before the get-go. Many deleyti fithi want to wage struggle in many fronts. I have debated this issue with fellow compatriots at FB. I suggested and suggest we should parse the issues. In my opinion, it is great ground to wage for example, for HR-based campaigns (COI, SR), refugee protection, regional and international isolation, probably not so great to wage military struggle.

            3. Eritreans do acknowledge they made forced choice to camp in Ethiopia after Sudan expelled them. Our politics is the choice of evils, the art of the little possible things the Diaspora can do; unless you tell us Ethiopia is evil/toxic compared-to-what and here is the proposed solution to leverage Ethiopia, we will get stuck in no man’s land..and that is not Badme:)

            4. You know more than me the Eritrean opposition is very diverse. Their degree of relations and need of Ethiopian resources varies considerably. Some do get salaries but still maintain strong member-based funds to do their activities. (Dihnet, ESMNS and EPDP and possibly others.) Some have historically well linked with TPLF (Demhae and Sagem); Some have ideological affinity (DMLK and RSADO). I think instead of putting them in one basket, it is proper to see the strengths and weaknesses of every groups..otherwise, some would shrug noting, ‘it doesn’t apply to me.’
            5. Related issue, what is the proportion of blame, at the NC itself and ’30sth years itch’ (to quote you) and the old rivalries within the ELF factions and the EPLF and ELF? The mistrust, the utter incompetence to solve conflicts; the personalities and ego clashes; the unimaginably convoluted and cumbersome structures of the NC itself (I suggest, we should simply abolish the national assembly; executive branches with overlapping powers, choose one camera body); the EDA’s continued existence while maintain their firm control of their respective organizations; the dual membership of leaders beholden to their constituency trying to lead the NC; the rush to hold conventions without clear mandates; and lack or insufficient debates on the by-laws and rules and regulations; and if we are going to be honest, what about Awate Team’s ‘interference’ to support one pitting against the other, instead of looking for solutions; etc…None of the above TPLF’s hallmarks; it is solely our own incompetence and immaturity.

            6. Words matter. Enormously. With the already deep-rooted labels of patriotic Eritreans being labelled ‘woyanes’, ‘agames’ ‘Ethio-funded’ ‘regionalists’ ‘jihadists’ and others, it is very, very important to choose words carefully. Similarly, the words ‘grave-yard of opposition’ and others are disconcerting and contradictory when you still want us to go to the graveyard to revive ourselves.Of course, you know this well and it is only a reminder. Apropos to add these derogatory terms wouldn’t stop Eritreans from congregating in Ethiopia and even becoming the mainstream opposition. I will say this boldly: unless there are reversal of fortunes, we, the Ethio-based opposition will continue to be the main driving force of the opposition for the foreseeable future.
            6. The trend is people care less about Ethiopia anymore, compared to many years ago; and it appears that even our fights are not about Ethiopia anymore; as say when Herui Vs. Seyoum. In the last NC squabbles, the ‘youth’ EYSNS squabbles, all the participants agree it has got nothing or little to do with Ethiopia’s role. In fact in August 2013, Ethiopia tried to mediate, with another group EPDP balking out, reciting its same reservations at the inception of the ‘bayto.’

            7. At the end of the day, yes Eritreans, no matter the venue, have to be the drivers and executors of their agenda. We need to hammer this point at every turn. I hope your article, if it comes, would educate how we can form symbiotic relationship with Ethiopia; preferably with issues identified and cleared.
            All the best,
            Ghezae Hagos

          • Amanuel Hidrat

            Haw Ghezae,

            Yep! Yep! Yep! The path of the painful rebirth of Eritrea will at last reshaped and redirected with the views you have stated it eloquently. All our squabbles has nothing to do with Ethiopia. It has to do with the mistrust among us and the inherent incompetency of the leaders of the organizations. That is all. But Saay will tell you otherwise.
            Amanuel Hidrat

          • Tesfabirhan WR

            Dear Ghezae,

            Your input is a lot brother. I always appreciate your presence. Yah, you guys are blessed with good words.

            Hawka
            tes

          • saay7

            Selamat Ghezae:

            Not an article format (sorry) but here are my answers to your specific bullet points:

            1. I know you used it for shorthand, but there are a lot of people here who try to conflate the Ethiopian Government and Ethiopia (or Ethiopians.) There is no debate about the role of Ethiopia. There is a lot of debate about the role of the Ethiopian government. Always was, always will be. I have already answered it, but it bears repeating: unlike any other government in the world, the Ethiopian government actually believes that there is something seriously wrong with Eritrea’s mainstream leaders and its elite going back to the Ghedli-era. This leads them to take a ‘save Eritreans form their leaders’ messiah complex. How this has manifested itself with the Eritrean opposition in Addis is to quote myself: (a) it convenes congresses haphazardly, regardless of existing Eritrean infrastructure which are barely getting started thereby undermining them; (b) it directly intervenes in the process by trying to place its favorites in leadership position. (c) It emboldens its favored leaders people to disrupt the process. (d) it uses multiple authorities–a military intelligence and a political office–representatives who are the liaisons of Eritrean organizations who encourage the member organizations of the Alliance or the Bayto/Majlis to bypass the chain of command, thereby weakening the authority of the elected executives.

            I am sure this is exactly what goes on with Ethiopian opposition hosted by Isaias Afwerki. So it is not bug but a feature of dependency.

            2. We are talking about the behavior of the Ethiopian government as it relates to Eritrean opposition organizations. Not to human rights orgs or civil society.

            3. That you recognize that Eritrean organizations decision to move to Ethiopia from Sudan answer your own question: they moved there grudgingly, reluctantly because they had no options. Why is Sudan their first choice and not Ethiopia? So why do we go on pretending that Eritreans don’t have reservation… do you think if the situation was changed in Sudan, Eritrean oppo would continue to be camped in Ethiopia?

            4. Not only do I know the differences between the Eritrean oppo organizations but also which ones are the Ethiopian government’s favorites and why. Refer to “unlike any other government in the world, the Ethiopian government actually believes that there is something seriously wrong with Eritrea’s mainstream political leaders and its elite.”

            5. Unlike my friend Amanuel, who has observed Eritrean politics and written about it since the 1980s, I have no reservation telling that the percentage is shared. Let’s say 50-50? Dependency sucks.

            6. Good luck:)

            6. It is always fun to mediate a squabble you create. It is a full-time job, actually.

            7. Well, Ghezae, that’s exactly the point: Eritreans are very unlikely to be “drivers and executors of their agenda” so long as the Ethiopian government continues to hold the view that it knows what is good for Eritreans better than Eritreans themselves and as long as our political leaders are essentially political refugees living off the dole of a moody government.

            All the best,

            saay

          • ghezaehagos

            Dearest Sal,

            “In summary: my opinion: the gist of the matter, to paraphrase Jay Z is: ‘Eritrean opposition have 99 Problems’ and Ethiopia is the hundredth..in that order:)

            Let me recap by trying to put the bullet points into perspective.

            1. I assure some of us have no special love/favoritism for Ethiopia. It is a venue that allows us to do other neighbor countries didn’t. You reiterated Ethiopia’s direct interference in opposition meetings. Can you provide us with details, names and places pertinent to your allegation because we want to KNOW and LEARN and decide for ourselves. I sincerely want to know and I am sure others. Otherwise, it would simply be the usual accusation Meskermites and PFDJistas throw at every opposition meeting held in Addis. Derghayo Sal nebsi…after all this website is fearless, with no asterisk:)….My main references are the past two years, as I intimately know that of the ‘youth’ (lack of better words) younger generation squabbles of the EYs and that I learned of NC, the Dihnet/serawit hidri saga; while I guess you harken back to somewhat earlier periods. In my references, Ethiopia was no or less of a factor.

            2. Civil societies and HR activities are component part of our struggle and important bodies of the opposition groups. You just can’t rule the behaviour of Ethiopia towards them too. When we say Ethiopia ‘is toxic for Eritrean opposition’, ‘graveyard we say wow! hold up there; that is a loaded accusation. What is opposition in the first place? and how is Ethiopia faring comparing to other neighbouring countries. Oh HR advocacy and isolation of the Issaias regime, no one did better than Ethiopia. Every single ‘important’ achievement; the sanctions and their continuity; the immensely important documents of HRW and Amnesty and others, down to the Nevsun lawsuits were done with the resources in Ethiopia. The much anticipated COI is welcome in Ethiopia; while you know Sudan even barred our avenging angel, Sheilla. So let us put things into perspective.

            3. Yes, of course we all have the reservations about Ethiopia. There are some valid points you raised. The liaison offices dealing with Eritrean matters is one of them. I always start with this fact: Eritrea, its people and its opposition are the least lucky in many ways. These are the givens. If it was in Sudan, there would be some advantages but for sure you know this: we would also be endlessly hurled with the rise of ‘Islamists and jihadists’ by PFDJ as was early 1990s. Another gridlock…But speculations aside, we are in Ethiopia and we can only manage our givens with whatever is at our disposal. We are all ears to hear from you, now that Ethiopia’s role is indisputable, how we can leverage for our interests. What is not helping I assure is calling some ‘amen corner’ because labels beget labels. Besides, we are trying to explore solutions to one of the most difficult questions we ever faced. So I would urge you to focus on solutions, not on the individuals arguing with you…

            4. Which brings me to I reckon you would suggest wholeheartedly. Eritrean groups have to be independent. I don’t think you read me well there. The degree of dependency varies and you have to acknowledge that. There are groups who still maintain offices in Ethiopia while they have branches and strong membership in Diaspora nations. They may have accepted salaries from Ethiopia but their branches and their leaders perform independent activities, workshops, tours, campaigns out of their membership donations and fees. I again boldly say many of the opposition activities (whatever there is in Diaspora) are conducted by those who have offices in Ethiopia. For them they exist everywhere PLUS Ethiopia. How about that? They are the backbone of the mainstream opposition, doing most of the ‘heavy lifting’ challenging PFDJ apparatus, 2% issues, COI witnesses, demonstrations, media impacts etc. That is what I was arguing with Frezghi Mesmer whose main objective was to discredit any groups situated in Ethiopia while favoring one of the Eys and EPDP. That was simply a bull cr…If you were following that debate, you know it had more features than simply dependency issue. Of course, you can’t single out one but you can support whoever you want; but let us not deny the facts.

            5. Let us say there is seriously something wrong with Ethiopia’s handling with the opposition. The question is what can we do to change that politically? Engage them? boycott them? Actually, my worry is that “Ye Ertra guday” is becoming less and less relevant to Ethiopia..so are its opposition..

            6. Happy holidays…good luck:) we need that.

            6. On EPDP and NC, I think you are being a little dishonest here. Was it Ethiopia’s fault? How about the squabbles of Awate Team with EPDP…The nharnet team may want to say something here:)

            7. We are here to make changes for our nation; not to be pawns for Ethiopia. Of course, we want to be independent executors of our agenda. We can only ask support and partnership from Ethiopia. Ethiopia means many things and let us put things in their perspective….In summary: my opinion: the gist of the matter, to paraphrase Jay Z is: ‘Eritrean opposition have 99 Problems’ and Ethiopia is the hundredth..in that order:)

            All the best,

            Ghezae Hagos

          • saay7

            Selamat Ghezae:

            If you want to go full Jay-Z, you should say “99 Problems and Ethiopian ain’t one.” 🙂

            We agree on #4 and we agree #7. So let’s leave it at that for now.

            Happy holidays!

            saay

          • Abraham Hanibal

            Dear Saleh Johar;
            I agree with your views here. When one is a member of a given political party or gives his/her vote to a certain party, it doesn’t necessarily mean that they agree absolutely with all policies of the given party. Democracy is based on consensus, and there should be space and tolerance for individual viewpoints.

          • Hope

            Attorney Ghezae:
            My apology,I take it back.
            But your own classmate testified in this very forum…..when he quoted you by saying that you asked brillant and challenging questions to one of the Gov Officials,who was running the meeting…at the AU Campus or somewhere in Asmera City.You remember that?.
            What if I tell the forum that I also know you very well in Winnipeg,eventhough it does NOT matter and off the topic?.
            Be that or this,your “Innocent” but brilliant and challenging questions to the AT,is more than enough to label you as a ” Brilliant Eritrean Intellectual”,not just a “Straight “A” Law School Student.”
            You see how I am “erratic” and “unpredictable'”?
            I am so proud of the Eri Intellectuals but am so “Down” ,too for their inefficiency…

          • saay7

            Selamat Ghezae:

            I stand corrected: it was not just reporting; it was reporting PLUS: it was editorializing. Reporting is dispassionate of “when, where, what, who, why, how.” Editorializing (at least informed editorializing) is reporting PLUS giving an opinion. “Promoting”, in the Eritrean context is “B’Awet tezazimu”–of tiny baby steps promoted as historic events– whereas we are sharing with you the warts of ENCDC including the fact that it has been totally paralyzed since 2011.

            Now, on Ethiopia. The conflict you see between the editorial and my posts doesn’t exist. If the editorial was praising Ethiopia and I was criticizing it, then there would be a conflict. But the editorial is silent on Ethiopia (because it is an editorial and it reflects the collective view of a team.)

            We respect the ENCDC because it is (a) an elected body of a diverse group of Eritreans and (b) it is attempting to create an umbrella for the Eritrean opposition. On the other hand, we criticize its failure to meet up to its obligations and we recognize that part of its failure is attributable to the policies and heavy-handed approach of the very fallible (I know! Shocker!) officials of the Ethiopian government.

            A reasonable assessment of all we (Awate Team, Saleh Gadi Johar (negarit columns), SAAY (Al Nahda columns) and the postings here by me and SGJ shows that we are critical of the Ethiopian government when we believe it has been toxic to the cause of the Eritrean opposition. And I suspect no amount of bellyaching will change that:)

            saay

          • haileTG

            hey saay, This one cought my eye.. “Reporting Plus” . We have “Extra Report”, “Exclusive report”, “Field Report”, “Live Report”, and this one is innovative of all. All the rest don’t actually leave the sphere of reporting (dispassionate of “when, where, what, who, why, how.” Editorializing (at least informed editorializing)). So, when the PFDJ says it is being the victime of media campaigns, it really is saying that it is attracting lot’s of “Reporting Plus” 🙂

            Here is a view from the east (Wink;)

            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vHfbpL0NDmw

            Cheers

        • Saleh Johar

          Hi Ghezae,
          You will save yourself all the speculation and energy if you just recognize this website has a goal. It is part and parcel of the struggle and not a dispassionate spectator or without a stand and principle in the struggle. When we report owe do not do it out of professional obligation, this is not a for-profit news outlet. We do what we do because it is our way of struggling and advancing the Eritrean cause.

          You (and others, including Emma) should also know we have individual columns to express our individual views. When it comes to the editorial, that is a reflection of the website’s views. If this was Haddas Eritra, you will find all views falling in line, but thankfully, this website is an antidote to that. I think we discussed this in detail when you started your column which you might have forgotten about it 🙂

  • Amanuel Hidrat

    Dear Awitistas,

    Zekere lebona gave us a short worthwhile answer to our dilemma as to what is the exceptional about Eritrea. And let us find each of us on what category we fall. I found my self on the later. we need to start with a clean slate. Below is the link.

    http://www.asmarino.com/writers-corner/4132-riddle-of-the-sphinx-the-eritrean-state

    Amanuel Hidrat

    • Hope

      Yeah Wedi Memhir Hidrat,
      Let us do that.i,.e,let us do some soul searching /self-refelction and put aside our “Ego”,come back to our senses and follow the Good Doctor’s (Sara’s)advice and move on, and work hard for an “everlasting solution”–using a Midway approach,rather than the Ego-centric approach of my Way is the Hig Way.
      Let us live in the 21st Centuary

  • haileTG

    Selamat Awatista,

    Let’s visit a different corner in the Eritrean political landscape, now that all woo’s of the “Amen Corner” has been put out to dry. How about we visit the “Maalesh Corner” for a change? We know the the middle east is the back bone of the Eritrean dictatorship, it is where the regime draws the greatest support and least resistance. The regimes there have not only financed, aided and abated the tyranny in our country but also engaged in barring opposition, deporting refugees, shooting at an unarmed mothers and children, gave a blind eye to large scale crimes against humanity and provided lifelines in the forms of peace keepers to mitigate sanctions, airlines, free ride of intimidating and extorting our people in their countries by PFDJ hooligans. When the regime wants to show patriotic zeal, it calls meetings there and banks and front companies facilitate its everyday crimes. The strange thing is that the vast of the opposition movement has least presence there. Hardly any organized challenge of the regime there and the Maalesh corner see no urgent threat to Eritrea and Eritreanism from such an external entity that is responsible for the very continued existence of tyrannical regime, but are blazing all sirens to alert possible malleability from the Amen Corner.

    How does the Amen Corner compare to the Maalesh Corner. Does the maalesh corner see the threat to Eritrean unity and national harmony as being greater from the south or the east? Of course, the maalesh corner would tell you south, but how could failure to oppose correctly be equivalent to the very act of sustaining and maintaining the very entity being opposed? I think the maalesh corner has some explaining to do. In the scale and combinatorial order of things, the damage coming from the east is life threatening as far as Eritrea is concerned, where as the perceived threat from the south is minor and manageable. Yet, the maalesh corner is hear nothing, see nothing of the shark gobbling us up and all cursing and wailing about the small fish pestering us.

    So, awatista, the jury is out on the case of the Amen Corner vs the Maalesh Corner. The judgement is left to your verdict on the matter.

    I rest my case.

    Regards

    • Saleh Johar

      Haile TG, simply brilliant. The Maalesh corner is more lethal indeed.

    • Kokhob Selam

      ፍሉይ ህያብ : ሓያል ናይ ምስትብሃል ክእለት !

      ሕጂ ኣብ ውሽጢ ማእከላይ ምብራቕ ዝርከብ ደላይ ለውጢ ወዲ ‘ዛ ሃገር (ካብ ዝኾነ ጸቢብ ስሚዒታት ነጻን : ካብ ዝኾነ ናይ ደገን ውሽጥን መዝማዚ ኣራያእያታት ጽሩይን ዝኾነ ባእታ ) እንታይን ከመይን ዓይነት ተጻእቦታት ከምዝገጥሞ ክትግምት ኣየሸግረካን እዩ :: ክንዲ ሽሕ ይግበርካ ::

    • Mahmud Saleh

      HTG
      Your honor, the jury need some clarifications:
      1. Ethiopia’s threat is present, it is there; it’s happening right now, it’s occupying our land at this moment. The jury doen’t get the reason why you have introduced an alien element to the debate, that of historic Habesha/Arab. The threat of radicalism has been there for decades long before ISIS and AlQaeda; our people declined to follow suit, and as long as we don’t play with fire they will do fine. Regarding the regimes, nothing new. Dictators support dictators. Now, do we have MAC (maelesh Amen Corner) in the Middle East equivalent to that of Ethiopia, anyway? Could you describe it without mentioning names, (if you give names, it’s up to you). According to my reading of the situation, for that sort of describable group to exist, we have to demonstrate that there exists a situation that is similar to the one we have with Ethiopia. We don’t have such a relationship with our neighbors to the north; therefore, we could not have MAC. Remeber, when we say TPLF Amen Corner (by the way none of the folks who defended that corner, including you, existed in my mind when I challenged Guhui), we are talking about a corner that’s downplaying Ethiopia’s disasterous policies towards Eritrea unabashedly. Just because we hate PFDJ, it doesn’t mean we should acquiesce Ethiopian belligerence. The editorial mentioned the role Ethiopia played in regressing the situation. What’s called for is that we should be equally critical to the opposition, to Ethiopia and to those who want to whitewash its negative role. Do we have similar scenario in the middle East? Another point that could earn some one TAC is when that person gives up on his/her people and openly declare for the intervention of Ethiopia, a country that remains technically at war with Eritrea. Some may be carried away by emotionality but most know it’s wrong, may be even criminal. I have great expectations from you, Aman H, and of course, my bad friend Semere. But honestly, if the goal is to boost opposition camp, the last you would want it for it to be seen or peceived as micromanaged by Wayanay. It’s simple.

      • haileTG

        Selamat Mahmuday,

        Where is #2…haha. OK let’s get to the serious business:

        1 – “Ethiopia’s threat is present, it is there; it’s happening right now, it’s occupying our land at this moment.”

        This isn’t universal view, in fact there exist a major segment of the opposition that take such a belief to be the central “threat” in itself that is elongating the life of the dictatorship. You know very well that the Ethio-Eritrea border dispute has been finalized in a way that has raised concern by one of the the party. Unless you are applying non conventional meaning to “threat”, Eritrea at this time isn’t facing a present a threat that could be considered as such. May be a recourse to take an undisputed location or a threat to do might have counted as such, but to say we are facing a “threat” isn’t the word for me. I would say we are having a boundary finalization disagreement. We say it needs to be done as per the EEBC, they are saying let’s dialog first.

        2 – “The threat of radicalism has been there for decades long before ISIS and AlQaeda; our people declined to follow suit, and as long as we don’t play with fire they will do fine.”

        What do you base your predictions upon? And, what does amount to “not playing with fire”? Is there an Eritrean Jihad movement, yes there is. And what was the political push back of PFDJ to the FORTO incident? What were the discussions that went on here recently on EFND about? Dear Mahmud, we may not be as immune as we wish to project and in the course of dealing with our “real” challenges, we may come across fires here and there. But we need to candidly say what is what if we wish to do that to the other side.

        3 – “Could you describe it without mentioning names, (if you give names, it’s up to you). According to my reading of the situation, for that sort of describable group to exist, we have to demonstrate that there exists a situation that is similar to the one we have with Ethiopia.”

        If the “situation” that you are referring to is about vying for political influence, my argument is not only a similar situation exists but a more lethal one at that. The way the threat level is perceived might be relative and based on peoples way of life and livelihood, but yes a major intervention is taking place and the havoc it is wrecking is growing tall by the day. Mahmud, who are the interlocutors of the regime in the middle east? If we know there are Islamist movements, where do they draw their facility and logistics? However, if you are referring to border conflict or war of independence as in with Ethiopia, even that side hasn’t been spared from from being manipulated either.

        4 – “we are talking about a corner that’s downplaying Ethiopia’s disasterous policies towards Eritrea unabashedly.”

        In my case too, I am talking about a corner that’s downplaying the Sudan, Egypt, Qatar… disasterous policies towards Eritrea unabashedly.

        5 – “Just because we hate PFDJ, it doesn’t mean we should acquiesce Ethiopian belligerence.”

        Again, just because we hate Ethiopia should we acquiesce to a belligerence towards Eritreans (to the point of stripping them their humanity and likening them to “vultures”). In most cases without credible evidence of guilt but simply with intent to tarnish?

        6 – “What’s called for is that we should be equally critical to the opposition, to Ethiopia and to those who want to whitewash its negative role. Do we have similar scenario in the middle East?”

        Mostly explained above, but we not only have such scenario in the middle east but one with higher kill ratio to date.

        7 – “If the goal is to boost opposition camp, the last you would want it for it to be seen or peceived as micromanaged by Wayanay.”

        At this time, when even the hgdefites are calling each other weyanay after falling out about splitting their loot of money collected for martyrs fund and Lampedusa victim families, who is left to be not weyanay? Given there is an established group that touts that anthem too, how far did it progress boosting the opposition?

        Mahmuday, I have said to saay to handle this issue with care as it plays into dangerous configuration. We either focus on the objectives of the struggle or the subjects involved in it. When one goes for the latter, that is where the ability to “boost opposition” is lost.

        Regards

        • Tesfabirhan WR

          Dear haile TG,

          Great as you are, recently I can see you fallig in the traps of saay7’s objective politics. Kindly, do not go into that pool. saay7 is good in labeling and let him be like that.

          Your greatness just made me to comment though I am busy with other staffs. This unique sentence is an expression of your highness and thank you for putting it as such:

          “We either focus on the objectives of the struggle or the subjects involved in it. When one goes for the latter, that is where the ability to “boost opposition” is lost.”

          Let’s boost the opposition haile TG. It is wise not to follow saay7’s politics. It will never be helpful for our solution. ኣብ’ቲ ዝተዋደደ መጳወድያ ከምዘይትኣቱ’ኮ ይፈልጥ እንተኾንኩ፡ ካብ ቅጽላት ሳይ ግና ክንደናይ ከይትድሕን። ከም’ቲ ናይ ህግደፋውያን፡ ሳይ’ውን ንፖለቲካዊ ስነ-ሞገቱ እንክብል ቅጽል ኣብ ምሃብ ብዙሕ ከምዘይጠራጠር ርዱእ ውሰዶ ኢኻ።

          hawka
          tes

          • Guest

            Hi Tess,

            Perhaps you are poorly positioned to criticize anybody in this forum. So please Atsfarka Akeb, lots of people are enjoging the debate.

            Huka

          • Tesfabirhan WR

            Dear Guess,

            Yah, including higdef are happy for this debate and I can sense it. And you know why? becuase it corresponds their “Divide and Rule Policy”. If you follow saay7’s recent possible possible combinations, we have 50, which are almost equal to the existing political parties. If that is so, have we tried to “Cluster” them based on their common objective dimension or we are creating another possible combination that will hatch other party? This is my concern.

            Let’s try to find the converging goals rather than diverging goals. If you are happy with the later, that is ok but remember that it will not help us in the fighet against the tyranny.

            ኣብ ዓይነይ በሰር እንተሎ ዘናዲ ዘይኮነስ፣ በሰር ዚኣሊየ ዚደሊ ዘለኹ። ምኽንያቱ፡ “ሓባል በልያ ከይትቕድመኪ” ስለዝኸውን መፈጸምትኡ።

            But thanks HTG knows exactly how to deal with. We are blessed for having him.

            Huka
            tes

        • Mahmud Saleh

          Kbur wo Hfoor At HTG
          Now, that was epic, although purposely made helter skelter to evade the point, huh! And you think I will go for it.
          To be frank, Rodab is the one to blame. Rodab tsaEda, as you know is measured and sneaky, he introduces something and then watches it played out. I like that guy.
          Your honor the call for focusing on the real job is heeded, and part of it should be this: We have to encourage criticism, but without personifying them. I admire Haw Amauel Hidrat for showing magnanimity. From your answer, I conclude we have no MAC, and hence, I consider it as a counter-punch measure from your side. But again, Rodab needs to be called into your court and made to explain why he included you in that list.

          • Rodab

            Hahaha MaHmuday,
            I did offer some explanations. You must have missed it. 3-4 days into it, why are we still on this anyway?
            May I suggest fresh topics on each day? For example, as AT calls on Europe to disengage from our regime, have you noticed the relation of the two sides is actually improving? That is injustice to justice but recently there have been plenty high-level engagements. We, the Eritrean people, will be the losers as both sides benefit – the regime lengthens its span with ornamental changes while Europe hopes to get reduction in refugees. Just this week, the regime marked human rights day (may be for the first time). On the occassion, a senior foreign ministry official, Wedi Gerahtu, told Euro deplomats that his regime will continue to engage on human rights issues. He told them other good stuff too. What say you?

          • Mahmud Saleh

            Ahlan Rodab;
            Actually, I read your reasoning on time, but it wasn’t enough for My Bad Friend or MBF Semere- SAAY style (I hope you don’t say ደድሕሪ ሳልሕ ኸደ ኣሳይማ/ኣወላልዳ ለመደ)
            I will repeat my long standing belief, and you won’t like it. But as usual if you want to watch another grizzly situation, perhaps it explains why I could not make a good politician, here you go.
            I support any re-engagement targeting community development with strong strings attached to it including creating favorable conditions of demobilization of our long serving members of national service. It’s been long overdue, they need to be rehabilitated. If those engagement target those purposes, believe me it will increase the potential of domestic pressure. It will reduce the number of our youth fleeing the country. It will increase the level of accountability and transparency (most of those grants and other assistance come with agreements where the GOE is made more vulnerable by taking away its total control,more engagements means less control for the government. At least those who are concerned (all of us) about the plight of our youth and the ongoing depopulation of the land will need to see this not in terms of its immediate political ramification but in terms of its potential immediate humanitarian effects. We need to discourage this madness of flooding to the north, and in order to make that effective, we need to support engagements strictly tailored to community and youth rehabilitation. This is the puzzle: those who supported a sanction that “specifically targeted” PFDJ should also support engagements that specifically target projects which could alleviate the push factors on our youth. You should support engagements specifically tailored to the rehabilitation of our communities, engagements which could give our youth a bit of hope.
            We know we have a terrible government and it may appear counter intuitive, but that’s what we have at this moment; I really care more about giving real and immediate hope to those kids than the project of dismantling PFDJ as that project is born from a situation where there is relative freedom of youth and their mobility (to do business, study, raise family..). I am convinced that the change you and me are calling for could only come by those youth who could be freed to do their own living. If diaspora activities could be attuned to that rhythm then the synergy is even greater.
            Another point: If those engagements are attached on conditions which could affect other human issues such as freeing political prisoners and opening up the space for elementary steps of rule of law, they could play positive role in changing the behavior of the government. I am old enough to witness changes coming from unsuspected corners. At the end, my criteria for supporting any political body is dependent on its will to ensure the reign of rule of law and its will and capability to deliver services which could alleviate the miserable living conditions. I don’t really care who brings those, because I am not a politician.
            On its practicality: which way is more effective, calling on EU stop engaging PFDJ Eritrea or calling it to make its support and engagement a vehicle for affecting human rights issues positively? I think the latter is within our limit and we can do it.
            Just to finish my thought: sanctions never solve a political problem, they complicate them. They didn’t work before and they won’t work, particularly in situations where those sanctions are viewed as unjust. It’s unbelievable, if not for the uniformly and linearly stupid ignorance of PFDJ, Eritrea would never have been sanctioned based on fair assessments of facts. The part that should have been sanctioned is occupying our land. So EU should even go further and break away from that enabler, the UN, and unilaterally lift those sanctions. Just because we have got an ignorant tyrant we as a nation should not be unfairly punished.
            That’s just my opinion.

          • Rodab

            MaHmuday TG,
            Well said. Matter fact, there isn’t much in your post I do not agree with. Of course engagement for a positive outcome to our people is something any reasonable person would applaud – even if it benefits the regime in the process. The problem being the tendency of the regime to use initiatives to its own survival only. We had good relations with Europe to begin with but PIA broke it off after 2001 to avoid scrutiny and nagging on prisoners’ and other human right issues. We don’t know now if he agreed to what he rejected before, or if Europe is way too much concerned about refugee flooding that it shelved the human rights issue for the time being. One of the worrying sings of the government for me is that on world stages and when talking with dignitaries, it time and time tells them that it is working on implementing UPR’s human rights recommendations, yet it has said absolutely nothing about it to the Eritrean people. No news of the regime’s UPR attendance was provide let alone to publicly publish and enlighten what the recommendations were. It tells the SEMG that the President declared the revival of the constitution, but again it wont’ say a word about the constitution where it matters the most – to our people. Such indigenous and self-serving behaviors are what make me think that we are being played on for the sole purpose of the regime’s benefits.
            But I do understand your reasonable concerns. You are the great MaHmuday. Keep it up!

          • Mahmud Saleh

            Dear Rodab
            I do share your concerns too, and that’s why I believe what’s doable by justice seekers is pressuring EU law makers to tie their engagements with those concerns, if we do that we hit two birds by a stone: we contribute to the well-being of our nation and our youth and at the same time coerce the government to let up some space for our citizens which could mature to domestic force for justice. EU will do it anyway for its interest. But, again, a unity of action is needed here. I think it’s productive if we focus on what’s doable without lowering our guards. Sadly, voices of reason find themselves between rock and hard place. Thanks for the nice words.
            Regards.

          • haileTG

            መርሓባ ሮዳብ (ኣስቸጋሪ ሰውየ፡)

            መቸም ወዲ-ገራህቱ ዝብሎ ካብ ምሓዝ፡ ቆቢዕካ ንፋስ ከይማልኣልካ፡ ቀጠው ምባል ይምረጽ። ኮይኑ ግዳ፡ ከይዱ ከይዱ፡ ምስ ኣውሮጳ ዝኽፈት ዝምድና እንታይ ዝዓለመ’ዩ? ሳልሳን፡ ፓስታን ንሰደድ ምቕራብ ድዩ፡ ወይስ ዙርያን ነጸላን ክሻየጡዎ እዮም? ሽርክነትን፡ ረብሓን እኮ ምስ ከባቢኻ’ዩ። እቲ ማዕቀብ እውን ብቐንዱ ናይ ጉራደ ጥራይ ስለ ዝኾነ፡ ሕጂ እንካ ጉራደ ዕጸዶም ጥዑይ ገይርካ ዝብልዎ ኣይመስለንን። ብድጎማ ዝወሃብ ሓገዝ እንተኾይኑ እውን፡ ሎሚ ተዓራሪቡ ዘሎ ህግደፍ፡ እሽንኳይ’ዶ ዶጒምካ፡ ሓጕምካዮ’ውን ንጋዶ እዩ ዘሎ። ካብ ኣገልግሎት ፈቲሑ፡ ናበይ እዩ ከስፍሮም? ቁጠባዊ ንጥፈታት ኣደስኪልካ፡ ሕጊ ዘይብሉ ሃዋሁ ቀሪብካ፡ ብስውር ዕዳጋ አናተሻረፍካ፡ ያኢ ዝንጸፍ ባይታ ምዕባለ ኣሎ’ዩ? ምቕናይ ጥራይ በለት ሰበይቲ…እምበር ህግደፍ ደኣ’ሞ ቀባሮ ደንጉዮሞ፡ ኣብ ኣፍ ጉድጓዱ ኮይኑ ዝፋጺ’ዮ ዘሎ እምበር’ዩ እዚ፡ እቶም ኣውሮጳ’ኸ ባዕሎም ዘይምዘርግሕሉ እቲ መናፍሕ ዝጠቅም እንተዝህልዎ። መቸም ወዲ ገራህቱ ክዝክር ከለኹ ዝዝክራ ነገር፡ “ህግደፍ ዲፕሎማሲና ምስ ህዝብና እዩ” ክብል ኣብ ሎንዶን ዝመደራ እዩ። ዓጀብ! ካን፡ ቆንስል ተባሂልካ ኣብ ደገ ሰፊርካ’ስ፡ ዲፕሎማሲ ምስ ህዝብና!! እንታይ ደ’ኣ ንወጻኢ ሰደዶ? ዶስ ህግደፍ ኣብ ኣስመራ ዝተደኮነት ቫቲካን ኮይና፡ ቆንስል ምስ ሃገረ ኤርትራ ክትከፍት ደልያ!! መቸም ህዝብና ነዚ በዓለገ ስርዓት፡ ጥዑይ ገይሩ ኣለሊዎ ስለዘሎ፡ አቲ ዓመታዊ በዓል ሰብኣዊ መሰላት፡ ኣብ ዔላ ዒሮ ምስ ጽምበሎ ምናልባሽ የድህበሉ ይኸውን። እንተ’ቲ ህግደፍ ሓገዝ ረኺቡ፡ ባይታ ተቋውሞ ክሰፍሕ ይኽእል’ዩ ዝበሃል ግን፡ ከይሰምዓና ሕሹኽ ጥራይ ንሕጂ ሮዳብ ዓርከይ ፡-)

          • Rodab

            ኣሎራ ሃይላት ቲጂ
            ወዲ ገራህቱ ደኣ እንታይከ ዘይብሎ ኣለዎ። ንሰብ ዙሪክ ደለይቲ ፍትሒ ልክዕ ከም ናደው ተሳዒርክን ኢኽን ዝብል ሰብዶ ኣይኮነን
            ንሙኻኑ፣ መዓልቲ ህጻናት፣ መዓልቲ ደቀንስትዮ፣ መዓልቲ ሰራሕተኛታት ወዘተረፈ በቲ ነቶም በዓላት ዘንጸባርቑ ኣገባባት ክኽበሩ ከለው፣ መዓልቲ መሰል ኣዳምከ ብኸመይ ይኽበር፧ ንሎሚ ማህረምትን መስቀይትን ደው ኣብሉ፣ ደሓን ዚኾነ ቅያር መግቢ ኣዳሊኹም ከኣ ብዝተኻእለ መጠን ንእሱራት ዝሓሸት ዕለት ጌርኩም ኣብዕልዋ ዝብል ትእዛዝ ይመሓላለፍ ድዩ ዋላስ እታ ዕለት ሰብ ኣብ ፈቐዶ ኣብያተ ማሕዩስ እንዳቐጥቀጥካ ንዲፕሎማት ኤውሮፓ ዓዲምካ መደረ ምስማዕ ጥራይዩ፣ አዝጊ ዋንኦም።

          • Hope

            Hailat,
            I think your analogy is a bit ‘Metaphysical” and irrelevant..even irrational..
            Are you serious that the MidEast Threat is of more concern to you compared to the the TPLF one?
            Here is how I take it:
            The MidEast one is more predicatble and will give us some tim e to defend ourselves…and we can,most likely,avert it as long as the EPLF/PFDJ is around,based on HISTORY.
            Apples vs Oranges thing…..
            When I say history,I mean:
            It has been Ethiopia a serious Threat to our existence for the last 60 yrs.
            -On the contrary,despite the wind here and there from the MidEast, and despite the Religion and Region factor,the MidEast has never been a threat to our existence.
            Everything is relative…..and relatively speaking,Ethiopia is the everlasting THREAT to Eritrea…considering the historical facts and the current facts on the ground.
            You amaze me if at all what your are saying is from the depth of your heart but you are only aggravating my on-going suspicion.

          • Mahmud Saleh

            Ahlan half cousin Hope,
            I guess you’ve got a wrong address.

          • Hope

            My apology Mahmouday.
            I meant to address (to)Haile TG…
            Thanks for the correction.

          • Hope

            Edited:
            Hailat,
            I think your analogy is a bit ‘Metaphysical” and irrelevant..even irrational..
            Are you serious that the MidEast Threat is of more concern to you compared to the the TPLF one?
            Here is how I take it:
            The MidEast one is more predicatble and will give us some time to defend ourselves,and we can,most likely,avert it as long as the EPLF/PFDJ is around,based on HISTORY.
            Apples vs Oranges thing.??You are th expert but am justt hrowing away my gut feeling.
            When I say history,I mean:
            It has been Ethiopia a serious Threat to our existence for the last 60 yrs.
            -On the contrary,despite the wind here and there from the MidEast, and despite the Religion and Region factor,the MidEast has never been a threat to our existence.
            Everything is relative…..and relatively speaking,Ethiopia is the everlasting THREAT to Eritrea…considering the historical facts and the current facts on the ground.
            You amaze me if at all what your are saying is from the depth of your heart but you are only aggravating my on-going suspicion.

    • saay7

      Hailat:

      Your honor, the defense introduced a new exhibit, Maalesh Corner, without giving notice to the prosecution. I submit to you that this is a mockery of your court and you should hold counsel in attempt of court:)

      First, here is my slow clap for “Maalesh Corner”: that is some fine word-smithing.

      Second, we need a definition. For example, when I say “Amen Corner”, I mean Eritreans who agree with or voice no disagreement with anything the Ethiopian government does. Ever. Maybe their motivation is that they don’t want to accidentally agree with PFDJ, maybe they don’t think it is a good political strategy to do so, or maybe they genuinely agree with everything the Ethiopian government does. Of course, to me, it is absurd to agree with them when they hold two diametrically opposed positions like: “we have no intention of regime change in Eritrea” and “we have been wrong: now we are going to pursue regime change.”

      Now, could you give us an example of a Maalesh Corner from Awate forumers, commenters here? Somebody who agrees with everything that the Maalesh Countries (Arab countries? Muslim countries?) do or say as it relates to Eritrea?

      saay

      • Saleh Johar

        Saay, you are being unfair. You should have introduced the young Eritrean citizen from Asmara, Sheikh Tewfiq Al Saiq.

        You have to inform the Awate Forum that the Imam who was a bright and influential man, whose Friday sermons filled the Mosques and the congregation overflowed to the streets of Jeddah, is non other than the Eritrean Imam, Tewfiq AlSaiq. He was expelled from Saudi Arabia for openly criticizing its immigration policy.

        Here is a clip of one of his emotional prayers:
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tB62UXT80Z4

      • haileTG

        Haha saay,

        Objection overruled. Prosecution didn’t require a special permit to designate “Amen Corner”, defense is also entitled to the same privilege. 🙂

        OK, in terms of designating forumers, one needs the sensitivity of an engineer to do so. Mine is that of a politician:-) In any case, I will continue to be amazed to note why some people find the identification of some as Maalesh corner hard to live with:) A second identifier might also be that those who don’t wake up every morning to condemn the culprit countries, much like the the so called Amen corner is required to denounce the role of Ethiopia in the border issue.

        Speaking of the border issue, it is now past time to argue there is any credible organization (including PFDJ) that can move that forward. In fact, the PFDJ has compromised the integrity of the issue so much by utilizing it to decimate the nation and its youth that just before the border pillars are placed, we wish to see the regime buried under it first. Can you think of a non Amen corner opposition that has campaigned tirelessly for the border demarcation? Exactly. Your criteria may have been valid some years back, but at this stage of the game, PFDJ has blood on its hand that it shed under the guise of it and the issue is compromised so much. We need an elected government to deal with it and we will make our position clear when such is put in place. We refuse to sing the same hymn from the same song sheet as that of the PFDJ. If this categorize us to be Amen corner, well maalesh 🙂

        Even wed Ali didn’t have border demarcation as one of his calls that he was to read on ERiTV, the current refusal to arms by the population is also a stark rejection of such crooked manipulation of the border issue by the regime and the biggest spanner in the works for such argument is however the mass movement of people crossing to Ethiopia. What more would you like me to present to you to prove that the horse you’re trying to trade is a dead one:-)

        If you genuinely believe the status of the border issue is a determinant factor to the opposition cause, you will need to link it to the benefit to be gained by our people by its resolving one way or the other, in alleviating their current suffering. In other words, you need to present a persuasive argument that PFDJ has the capacity to effect changes if that condition is fulfilled or prove that the youth, who have long changed their mind about it and make up almost 80% the fleeing population, would somewhat turn their focus away from the border issue that they never focused on in the first place. You see, it is an unlikely case, whichever way you look at.

        Finally, we need to recognize that I am whiter than white is a PFDJ modes operand. Calling for border resolution can be done in responsible, uniting and inspiring way. Disparaging, litmus testing, and pointing accusatory fingers are something we all indulged upon but let’s move on. I have, will you sal maalesh and join me 🙂

        Regards

        • saay7

          Selamat Hailat:

          Your honor, since Ma’alesh is Arabic for “let it be”, and since the Amen Corner is all about “let it be” , I think here you have just given us the Arabic translation for the Amen Corner and, with your permission, your honor, I will use the two words interchangeably.

          What we have learned so far, of course, is that your court has not presented a single evidence of “Ma’alesh” corner for Eastern nations in this forum but that there is plenty Ma’alesh (lbi aEbi) for South of Mereb nation. And while, your honor, you were thinking you had created a silver bullet, an equalizer, all you have done is expanded the vocabulary of some of the commenters here:)

          We, sir, come for a nation whose liberation movement once chided Egypt for signing the Camp David agreement. That’s how we roll. Now we have become shufflers, passive people who take abuse from Party B because to complain about it would be to please Party A.

          Your wishful thinking is getting the best of you. Plenty of Eritreans have crossed to Ethiopia before they made it to the West. Many of them young Eritreans who had been bloodied in the endless offensives. Have you once heard anyone of them (I haven’t) say: “praise be to the Ethiopian government for sheltering me?” I haven’t. Why is that? Is that because we are a nation of ingrates. (Question not posed to Amen Corner because they will say, “yes!”) I don’t think so, Hailat.

          This article we are commenting on is about Eritreans getting together in Addis for a Majlis/bayto. Lets wait to hear the reportage from those who return:)

          saay

          • haileTG

            Merhaba saay,

            I was rather taking the back seat and observing the flow of debate here. And little time to compose a response. So, here goes, ኣይተስተዋሕዳ 🙂

            1) Maalesh and Amen: No saay, they are not interchangeable. Actually, from my little research before coining the word, I found out that Amen is Ameen in Arabic. Generally, it is said at the end of prayers to affirm agreement with God. My advance plane view model of your possible strategy to the debate must have been accurate! Because I intentionally avoided using any term that would have religious connotation to it. I also avoided mashallah, enshalah…for the same reason, beccause it would neither serve my true intention nor would it help deny you the ways to try to manipulate it, just as I have anticipated it. But you did any way. So, I went for maalesh to make i faith neutral, but you still fell for it. እዋእ፡ ኣንታ ገጊኻኒ ዲኻ። ሃይለ እኮ እየ፡ ይጠፍኣኒ’ዶ ኢልካ በየን ከም ዝጉየ 🙂

            2) As I said, there is no point labeling forums here, but let me ask you directly: do you believe the existential threat to Eritrea is currently being aided, abated and maintained by middle eastern regimes or the Ethiopian regime? A) Yes I do B) No I don’t Eyobay will pass you the pencil to circle one 🙂

            3) The nation’s liberation movement that chided Egypt for signing up to Camp David agreement has elevated to liberator murderers that can’t chide Egypt for shooting an Eritrean mother in front of her toddlers. Instead their big head kept ballooning to chiding the UN for not re-igniting cold war and congratulating Russia for doing what they spent their life long to fight against. Saay, keep playing the flattery, cheguar danga lives on it for stable food towards his certain demise 🙂

            4) I have three publicly made declarations that those who were in Ethiopia were only complaining of the time length in the camps and NEVER with the treatment accorded to them in terms of basic necessity. An Eritrean youth interviewee with assenaa speaking by phone from a remote damping ground where the Egyptians were holding a group of 150 Eritreans (including pregnant women) who were seeking passage through the country is one. Another, video evidence of a woman saying that from Shemelba while discussing with Amanuel Eyasu when he visited there. A third document that was sent from refugees that were let go from Djibouti, when the wrangle was going on between Elsa Chyrum and the other EY.

            Now, a much more stronger evidence is that many of those deported in 98/99 have gone back to claim their properties and are engaged in business there.

            5) Your last statement about bayto/Mejlis is confusing. Here you are saying Ethiopia must be forced to vacate territories (hmmmm…which would make it an active enemy state) and again you feign impartial anticipation of the result of a meeting conducted inside an “enemy state”. Shouldn’t you condemn it with patriotic zeal 🙂

            Concluding remarks:

            Dear saay, the religious divide in Eritrea is one that lends it self to a power struggle and not to a struggle against oppression per se. Eritrean Moslems don’t oppress Eritrean Christians, nor is the case vise versa. Both groups are in good proportion to need the other. And you will never find a dot that would blemish my integrity in that regard. I believe in facing hard truths, but face we must do with honor and integrity. If Eritrea finds itself into an intractable problem with the Sudan, I would feel disheartened for the way that would impact my people in the lowlands and their livelihoods. In the same vain, if Eritrea finds itself in an intractable problem with its southern neighbor, the same sense of loss is shared with my people in the highlands. I wouldn’t try to amplify the conflict in either direction, for it would hurt a part of me. I don’t do partisan or sectarian politicking. Many Eritrean villages are now reconstituted in Tents across Tigray’s no-man’s lands. While the Qatari Emir builds personal luxury villas in Dahlak, with blood and sweat of young Eritreans who are then slated to trek the Arab deserts dying horrible deaths and brutalized in ways sickening to imagine.

            Please take a minute and soften your heart a little bit.

            cheers

          • saay7

            Hailat:

            I will focus on one element since I, like Engineer Rodab, am thinking we have stretched this to its limit and we are beginning to repeat ourselves. And only because it’s a correction for the record:

            You said:

            “5) Your last statement about bayto/Mejlis is confusing. Here you are saying Ethiopia must be forced to vacate territories (hmmmm…which would make it an active enemy state) and again you feign impartial anticipation of the result of a meeting conducted inside an “enemy state”. Shouldn’t you condemn the very meeting with a patriotic zeal :-)”

            Forced to vacate? Where did you get that Hailat? Not only can (a) nobody “force” Ethiopia to vacate the land (those who can won’t and those who want can’t) but (b) even if it can be done I am against forcing. Forcing creates animosity, anger, humiliation. You know: the feeling we Eritreans are very familiar with these days.

            I am for a creative problem-solving: one that complies with EEBC And addresses Ethiopian concerns. What I was criticizing the Eritrean opposition is for not having the creativity to come up with one and for echoing the Ethiopian position and reinforcing Isaias message that the entire oppo are agents of Ethiopia. Yes you and I disagree about the “silent majority” but that has been a crippling position for us in the oppo.

            saay

          • haileTG

            Apology in order saay. You didn’t actually say “force” at any time in that way. I was trying to capture your desire to make the call for Ethiopian withdrawal as a litmus test for Amenites 🙂

          • saay7

            Hailat:

            In the immortal words of Chick Hearns, “no harm, no foul!” I too apologize for any distress caused to anyone about this subject, or any other for that matter.

            Play ball!

            saay

          • Gud

            Touchy! But, hey, no worries! It is the sickness a sabordinate suffers. All the acrobatics (and diving into trouble agitating the religion thing) and insult of other neighbours of Eritrea ( mostly Arab countries) is simply to whitewash the crimes of woyanie

            How low can one go!

            And the usual, ” 9, I mean 99, no no, I did that knowingky, I was actually saying 0.9…..

            Wodaje!

          • Amanuel Hidrat

            Hailat,

            You excel everybody and knock them down to everyone of them in the boxing circle of ideas. You did it with excellency, humility, rich resources of knowledge, and above all with cool head, even to those who tries to tag you and level you with all kinds of adjectives. Keep them colliding with their own views if they can learn eventually. You are a tough notch. Stand tall, to clear the muddy and the so called debate of ideas. At time you are better than the moderators (a) in shaping and framing the debate (b) in separating intrastate-politics from the interstate-politics where the moderators keep mixing to keep the forum in endless “kuda Sa-Esi-Eyt” (c) in separating the short term and long term engagement which the moderators tried to walk us back and forth with no ending to our argument (d) and at time when they burst with subliminal emotions you pull them to cool down. What a great job.

            Amanuel Hidrat

          • haileTG

            Selamat aman,

            Thanks for the words of encouragment, and the same goes to others too. Your distinction of intra-state and inter-state issues is a valid one. And let’s also keep the focus here that our objective is defend the very act of mounting “opposition” against the dictatorial and tyranical regime. We need to fend off the strategy of “kill the messenger, to kill the message”. The legitmacy of opposing the dictatorship emanates from the very repressive measures that it is taking against our people and the dire levels of destraction that such wanton state violence (and its external coaching ) are bringing upon our nation and its survival as we new it. Such is the reason for the fight, such is the cause for the fight and such is the fuel that would keep the fight going. Trying to discredit and decomission segments of the opposition by virtue of their organizational and tactical posturing, would distress the level of opposition and embolden the hedious dictatorship. The size and composition of the opposition forces must be left off target to achieve healthy dialog and critical evaluations of one another. Writing off one segment here and writing off another segment here, targets the opposition’s over all size and belittling and dismissing those that make up its composition saps the life out of it. Since the grand strategy of this plan appears to be to garner support to the failed reformist school of thought vis-a-vis the dictatorship by discrediting those opposed to it, it must be challenged by all means possible. We, as a nation, can’t afford to have extreme views against our natural neighbours. If such is being agitated, we need not be afraid to ask why and to what end.

            Eritrean opposition camp needs to clearly identify the different levels of challenge, some strategic and some tactical, that we face and be careful to identify on what we are dealing with before we launch into getting involved in ways that would amount to shooting on one’s own foot.

            Regards

          • Amanuel Hidrat

            Dear Hailat,

            I can’t agree more, and I am in line totally with your approach, especially with your cautious statement that says “…… to clearly identify the different levels of challenge some strategic and some tactical, that we face and be careful to identify on what we are dealing with…..” I hope those who act more Eritreans than the rest of us will cross their mind your message. In their mind if we don’t insult Ethiopia and Ethiopians we are not Eritreans. Can you imagine, even silence is supporting the policy of Ethiopia. Strange enough when you hear it from our erudite.

            Haile, the Eritrean politics is more reactive than acting carefully with sound judgement as to the consequence to our short term and long term of security of our people vis-a-vis our neighbors. At this particular juncture Ethiopia is not our enemy, but the PFDJ is. How difficult is to understand this? I don’t know. If we carry on our “policy and positions” of the ghedli era, then we have a problem. The ghedli era is over. We are independent sovereign people. And we have to understand what entails to the current struggle and current reality. Remember, how long it will take us to understand that the border issue won’t be resolved under the current regime in Eritrea. Something is real and that is, the verdict will not be changed but needs a regime that is ready to implement by give and take on its technical application on the ground. If we don’t come in to terms that the border issue will not be resolved under issayas’s regime, we can not advance our current struggle. So and in short, our current struggle is not hinged to the border issue. It is independent of itself and is against the regime and its system in Asmara. Keep your lights in segregating these two issues. Deleiti Fetih at this juncture, they don’t have any legitimacy to take the border issue into their hands. We have to know our limits.

            Amanuel Hidrat

          • Asmerom

            Hailè TG
            You said all it was a great learning experience thank you

          • Tesfabirhan WR

            Dear haile TG,

            Just thank you!

            hawka
            tes

    • Abraham Hanibal

      Whether we classify ourselves as “Amen Corner”, “Maelesh Corner”, or whatever else term we coin, we’ve failed as a People to stand up against a repressive regime run basically by a handfull of culprits. This is the great Eritrean shame and it would go down in our history as the most disgraceful period. And until the day comes that we, in unison, reject the PFDJ both in words and deeds, and put a meaningful opposition to the regime, we would find ourselves having to grapple with our predicament for the unforseeable future.

  • saay7

    Selamat iSemere:

    Welcome back! You disappeared since Berhe Y showed up: are you guys sharing an account/computer? 🙂

    That said, I am glad that Outrage Manufacturing, Inc (OMI) over which you preside is still in business. Let’s begin with the easiest: the VP of OMI (who has developed a strange fetish over misunderstanding me) made the same charge and it deals with “malleable toys.” I accused the TPLF/EPRDF of desiring malleable toys for Eritrean opposition; I didn’t accuse the Eritrean opposition of becoming one.

    Now, related to this is the “TPLF Amen Corner.” I think a year or two ago, SGJ and Amanuel were discussing Ethiopian government’s role in paralyzing the Addis-based opposition and SGJ asked Amanuel (I am paraphrasing): if there are two parties associated with the failure of the Eritrean opposition, what percentage of the failure do you attribute to Ethiopia and what percentage do you attribute to Eritrean oppo? Is it 10% – 90%? Is it 25% – 75%? Is it 1% – 99%?

    The “Amen Corner” is totally stunned by this question. I see it nodding its head, shuffling its feet and mumbling something about Ethiopian national security and let’s not externalize our failure. Really? So, if the late Prime Minister Meles Zenawi was pursuing Strategy A and then reverses himself and says, that was wrong, we are now going to pursue Stragey B, the Eritrean opposition has zero opinion on that? It agrees with Strategy A and Strategy B? It turns out: yes! So, the “outsourcing” and “externalizing” was done by the Amen Corner: strategy for bringing change in Eritrea is WHATEVER Ethiopia says it is. Nearly all the opposition is NOT in the Amen Corner which is why we have made little progress in the last 15 years and I, as an Eritrean, am telling Ethiopia to change instead of telling the Eritrean oppo to say amen. Clear as mud now?

    I don’t take a back seat to giving credit to TPLF (Remember my “Harbeyna Weyanai” is not ironic and it is perfectly authentic) for lifting the people of Tigray from a century-long subjugation and, indeed I have gone on record that it is the best government Ethiopia has had in its modern history. But that does not mean I am deaf and blind to its very destructive attitude towards Eritrea that has been expressed by the team I have called TPLF-II: the T-Kifles, the Merkebs Negashs (this guy: http://hornaffairs.com/en/author/merkebnegash/). They basically believe that at the core of the Eritrean political class is a diseased attitude that must be cured.

    This whole discussion started with what? An Ethiopian TV broadcast that described the expelled Eritreans as people who had abandoned their wealth and properties. The TPLF has been whitewashing its crimes against Eritreans since 1981 and it hasn’t changed. It is disrespectful to Eritreans and at the end of the day, that has to be a minimum requirement: respect me and my history and my choices. And if you can’t, just give up and let me discover my ingenuity.

    Finally, yes, as an Ethiopian awatista whose name escapes me now once wrote describing the absurdity of the 30 year Ethiopian war against Eritrea: “if they are Ethiopians like us, why are we killing them? If they are not Ethiopians, why do we want to keep them?” Similarly, if one says that Ethiopians and Eritreans have millennial long bonds (Sudan doesn’t), why must treating people with whom you have millennial bonds with MINIMUM neighborly grace be constantly and tastelessly displayed as bragging points?

    saay

    • Nitricc

      That was the best line ever used to discrib the whole Eritrea and Ethiopia.
      And of course it was said by the great Fanti Ghana. What ever happen to Fanti?

    • Amanuel Hidrat

      Aha! Abu Saleh,

      So you want to frame our debate between “Outrage Manufacturing Inc” (OMI) and “Escape goat Manufacturing Inc” (EGMI). Please that will not make us serious to the predicament of our people. No! No! Saay. At least myself, I will not venture to your project. I will give you deaf ears to such calls.

      One of your forte that none of us posses it, is the ability to divide issue (one issue into pieces) in to two opposite sides rather than a “compact one issue” to debate on it. You know such approach of debating will not bring us to a common understanding. Look yourself, all the debates we are doing is not even on the main issues concerning our internal political problem, which you always attributed it to foreign interference.

      Remember Abu Saleh, if there is any foreign interference, it could be the product of “our division” that gave the magnetic pull of foreigners into our internal affairs. The interference of TPLF in the civil war of 1980-1981 is a simple example that our division had given to “a switching alliance” with foreign forces – “the TPLF-EPLF allaince.” So Bitsay Saleh why don’t we look to ourselves, to seal the cracks within us to avoid the doors of interference rather outsourcing our problem to foreigners. Please! Please! I plead to you to look to our internal political house as the good Dr. Sarah Ogbay tried to remind us when she saw the personality clashes.

      One interesting thing that gave me early morning Sunday laugh, is when you try to quantify into percentage the possible Ethiopian interference. I don’t know, you may have some random unscientific data you opted to argue with. I am not a layman to tell you 10%, 25%…etc. What is the point of reference “the whole failure figuratively” to compare with the possible attribution of foreign interference. By the way let me revert the question back to you. What percentage is attributed to the Ethiopian interference in regard to the whole picture of the “opposition failure” who reside in Ethiopia? I am eager to hear from you the data you have. I hope you didn’t ask me without having you at hand.

      Regards,
      Amanuel Hidrat

      • saay7

        Selamat Emma:

        Against my better judgement, I will engage you. I said “against my better judgement” because you are now batting 100% in your lack of comprehension of anything I say. A lot of your debates with me are debates about a deformed understanding you have of what I say. But, hey, there is always a first.

        So, let’s break it down. If you don’t like 10%, 25%, etc, lets use words, simple English words. I want you to finish this sentence for me; I will even make it multiple choice:

        Since 1999, where the Alliance of Eritrean National Forces (AENF) was established in Ethiopia, the Eritrean organizations have not made the progress desired. Ethiopian government should take:

        a. none of the
        b. some of the
        c. most of the
        d. all of the

        responsibility for this failure.

        What is your answer?

        saay

        • Amanuel Hidrat

          Selam Saay,

          I will get back to you. I am a little pressed for time. But you are doing “the slippery slope of politics.” You asked questions that you couldn’t answer when they reversed to you.

          Amanuel Hidrat

  • Rodab

    Three examples of each of Sir Sal’s classification:
    1. Eritreans who support the Eri gov and oppose the Ethio gov. Example, Hope, Nitricc, dawit…
    2. Eritreans who oppose the Eri gov and support the Ethio gov. Example, Hailat, Hayat, Aman…
    3. Eritreans who oppose the Eri gov and oppose the Ethio gov. Example, Sal?? Semere A?? MaHmuday??
    4. Ethiopians who support the Ethio gov and oppose the Eri gov. Example, ALL Ethiopians.
    5. Ethiopians who oppose the Ethio gov and support the Eri gov. Example , NONE
    6. Ethiopians who oppose the Ethio gov and oppose the Eri gov. Example, NONE

    So we (Eritreans) have somewhat a diversified views, whereas the Ethiopians are united in this particular categorization.
    But If we were to be asked ‘out of all Ethiopian governments so far, who is the best for Eritrea?’, we would go nearly unanimous in voting up the Woyanes.

    • saay7

      Engineer Rodab:

      Thanks for adding color to the categories.

      A couple of corrections:

      If Hitler invaded hell I would make at least a favourable reference to the devil in the House of Commons.~~ Winston Churchill

      That’s Haile TG about Weyane. He is not in the Amen corner. He does occasionally try to play the Habesha/highlander card but it’s not from the heart. So I would put him in a slightly different basket.

      Semere A is not in our basket. I think he is a nihilist. 🙂

      The rest you are spot on. One of the biggest failures of awate is we haven’t attracted Ethiopians who are not supporters of the Ethiopian regime. We had a few (from the Somali region) but they got overwhelmed by the Weyane brigade.

      saay

      • welde

        Hi Saay.
        Are you there still attacking the weyane. Saay, you have been doing the same thing while you were the ardent supporter of Presidemnt Isayas Afewerki,You were the main actor among many that were fuling the border war . You should apologise to the Eritrean people for that debacle of the border war. After the demise of border war you jumped the IA ship and now you are doing the same thing allover again in the opposition ship. You see Saay , you seem to act like a tabloid writer, sensationalise and point scoring.
        Please change your way!
        kind regards,

      • Amde

        Saay,

        “nuance”…. “nuance”

        Dubya is out.. so you’re allowed.

        🙂

        Amde

        • saay7

          Selamat Amde:

          In this post-Dubya world where oceans have stopped rising and greenhouse effect lowered (according to the inaugural speech of Barrak:), nuance is the order of the day. You are right! And in honor of your nuance….

          Here is the Nuance Scale of awatistas for 2014 when it comes to the great diversity of opinion about the Eritrean and Ethiopian regimes, as expressed by Eritreans and Ethiopians.

          There are 50 possible outcomes…but…at the end of the day… Do you disagree, nuance master:) And does the listing of the 50 possible outcomes change my abbreviated categories?

          saay

          • Amde

            Hi Saay,

            Actually, when I say nuance, I mean in the sense of support and not supporting as defined by qualifiers such as “… about the border policy”, or “…. about the dam..” or “… about domestic political pluralism…” or “… about Ethiopian opposition in Eritrea…” or “… Eritrean refugees in Ethiopia…” etc… I might wanna ride up and down the combinatorial scale you so kindly provided depending on circumstances.

            I can for sure tell you I am an exception to your “100% weyanista” characterization.

            Don’t pigeonhole me bro –

            Amde

          • saay7

            Haha amde:

            Is the “don’t pigeonhole me, bro” a reference to “don’t choke me, bro” for an era long gone by?

            As you know, the issue-based approach to indicating support for a political organization is then aggregated into the standard “strongly agree” to “strongly disagree” continuum. It is fair to say, wouldn’t you agree, that the Ethiopians who frequent awate forum are very different from those who frequent ethiopian opposition websites? So, is it an overstatement to say that the Ethiopians who comment at awate range in their affection for the EPRDF from the rapturous and overzealous (“know your limits!”) to the run-of-the-mill supporter?

            Now, if you want to use an issue-based support, many of the Ethiopians at awate support the EPRDF/TPLF for its treatment of Eritreans: they are positively giddy when it “teaches us a lesson” and unhappy and feel exploited when it does the minimal requirements of a neighboring nation with millennial ties with us.

            saay

    • haileTG

      Dear Rodab,

      While we await for saay’s material evidences of things we need challenge the Ethiopian gov for (I mean we’ve all done the border and related stuff challenge more than the freaking regime could), let me request an elaboration.

      – What does it mean to be an Eritrean supporter of the Ethiopian government?

      – What form of “support” does and Ethiopian government require from an Eritrean national?

      – Is there a precedent (apart from ideological or religious regions) where a national of one country becomes a supporter of the government of another country?

      – What political value would such a mismatch be serving?

      – What were the demographic ramification of the no war no peace across Eritrea’s geographic divide? Would you say the impact was pretty the same or one segment (e.g. the highland regions/lowland regions) had been impacted heavily? i.e displacement, blockade in movement, exposure to mass outpouring of refugees?

      – In the same vain, what would be the demographic weighted ramification of renewed hostility? Which geographical regions of Eritrea are more pron to be destabilized further and civilians be affected more?

      – Can you also factor some of the reactionary articles we have been reading recently regarding how the reason census data is not collected in Eritrea is to hide a supposed “discrepancy” in the make up and composition of Eritrean society with what it is supposed to be?

      – Are Eritrean validated to be less hostile and more pro regional peace (especially Ethiopia) based on their unique geographical and population distribution?

      The “supporters of Ethiopia” is a mismatch and senseless to apply indiscriminately. It is as dangerous as it can get when hurled without obvious grounds to implicate individuals. The actions of other “known” countries are also to be blamed for direct assistance of the dictatorship that is murdering our people. Wouldn’t it be fair to look at all external actors without partisan and suspect positioning of one’s arguments?

      Regards

      • Rodab

        Haderka Hailat Arkey, ‘Hando Hadirka?
        You have taken what was a simple and fun category and expanded it into related yet complicated issues. Hailat and only Hailat can do that:-)
        First off, what’s written here in opposition or support of groups is negligible as far as its impact on the ground. This is so because comments written by individuals can hardly be translated into material, political or usable support of any sorts. So “support” or “supporter” in this case is nothing more than one’s perceived position. And this applies to any support – an Eritrean support of Eri gov, an Eritrean or Ethiopian support to Ethio gov….
        Having said that as an intro, now let’s take a brief look at some of the groups on the above classification*. Let’s start with the easily identifiable groups, groups 1 and 4. The impression one gets out of these two groups is that they are most likely to overlook misdeeds of the regime they support while at the same time going after the other regime mercilessly.
        What about group 2? I do agree with Sal that there are significant differences of positions of the members of this group, but was put in a broader classification. So how does one reach at the conclusion on this group that they oppose the Eri gov and support the Ethio gov? Obviously most of us are opposed to the Eri gov on its tyrannical rule inside the country. But it is the relation of the two countries that is trickier with lots of gray areas. As an example, we can itemize three topics to that end (three among many):
        (1) On the war: did Eritrea committed mistakes? Absolutely! But what about Ethiopia and its role, how should it be seen/taken?
        (2) On settlement of the dispute: has Eritrea played a role in the prevailing no war no peace situation? Absolutely! But is it the main culprit and Ethiopia’s role is smaller comparatively? Why doesn’t the rejection of the ruling itself make Ethiopia the bigger obstacle?
        (3) On moving forward: is Eritrea single-handedly spoiling the prospects of relationship and Ethiopia is the good guy and blameless?
        I would form SOME opinion on commenters based on my PERCEPTION (and who said perceptions are facts) of how one has been addressing these issues over the years (God forbid you will ask me to quote you:-)

        PS: Would you say more about the conspiracy theory on the census, as I haven’t read anything like that before and it has fascinated me?

        Regards.

        • Rodab

          Forgotten…
          * These classifications should be seen as unscientific research or poles (with sampling error) if you will. It is not in anyway my intention to use them to labeling or dividing people. Not at all.

        • haileTG

          Merhaba Rodab,

          The question is more about the motive of such classification at this late hour than the way the classifications are structured.

          – Is there any opposition group or Eritrean individual who is primarily advocating against the EEBC border delimitation and demarcation? Are there any inl. entities to your knowledge to have officially reversed their support of it either?

          – Since there are many Eritreans who were deported in 1998 but since have returned to Ethiopia to resume their business ( at least one such individual that I know who is in Asmara and collecting rent from rental of his building in Adiss that was returned to him – rental from NGOs and in USD), is it reasonable to use their issue as a pretext ahead of the dire situation of our youth being scattered all over the world (tragically in most cases)?

          – Most Eritreans, Eritrean opposition and Eritrean regime are outside of Ethiopia, unless the latter is influencing Eritreans outside of its territory, why is it that the oppositional politics required to re-focus towards Ethiopia?

          – If the purported aim is to encourage Ethiopia to not interfere or support the opposition in Ethiopia, how does confrontational approach be the vehicle to that? (This is assuming that one believes Ethiopia is geographically indispensable).

          – When one says Eritreans either need to vocally criticize Ethiopia or they are supporters of Ethiopian position, is this in reference to border and deportation or are there additional parameters?

          – Has any opposition group/individual opposed PFDJ from charging ahead and snatching the Badme territory from Ethiopia?

          – Has there any visible success of those who taunt Eritreans and Ethiopians in this regard, in their opposition efforts?

          – We all opposed YG when he called for Ethiopian intervention, but had he succeed, would the highland population he claims to care for fare better in the ensuing restart of hostilities?

          In my opinion, the politics of re-starting the current dialog in castigating individuals and groups hasn’t been explained well. Witch hunt and branding people is probably aimed at the opposition camp in general. And, unless saay would convince us the priority of his preposition, it may be yet another reform foray garbed in different fabric. PFDJ is incapable of maintaining normal state management, let alone to resolve the Ethio-Eritrea dispute or any other lofty issues. So, why is the Ethiopia issue required to take center stage?

          Regards

    • Hope

      Eng,
      I agree only with your last statement saying:
      “So we (Eritreans) have somewhat a diversified views, whereas the Ethiopians are united in this particular categorization”
      Yeah,we should learn from them.

    • Nitricc

      Rodab I am more in to supporting when i see good and opposing when i see not good things. so, i am more in to being fair. i don’t blanket everything the government does is wrong and bad. no, there are good things and i support it and there are things make me to throw up. regarding the Government of Ethiopia, i really don’t care. they are the dumbest form of government in the world though.
      Rodab, i am stunned you put Haile with Hayat? WOW! what are you saying, Rodab?

    • Amanuel Hidrat

      Eng. Rodab,

      What are the issues of reference for your Categorization? Forget what Saay is doing in blackmailing for those who oppose him. That is his forte. Saay’s categorization is for his own end and isn’t for bringing people together. You seem you are convinced by his categorization.Am I right Engineer Rodab?

      • Guest

        Dear Amanuel,

        Come on Emma! With all due respect, would you stop misusing “reference” to try and get your point across? You vigorously defended Meles and his policies in this very forum. If that does not make you supporter, then “reference” has no meaning.

        regards

        • Amanuel Hidrat

          Dear Guest,

          There are always “caveat for references” to make your argument. Otherwise your debate could be diverted and convoluted as it is common exercise in this forum. When you start to categorize, you must prescribe your references, their boundary and limits without resorting to generalization. Then the Responders will react and act accordingly. What is difficult to do that, other than the categorizer wanted doors and windows to enter and exit from issue to issue. General accusations are not factual until they are presented in specifics. Again yourself, you are making general accusation. My writings are in this website (most of them) and you could come to specifics and I will tell the reasons even though they are in the articles.

          Amanuel Hidrat

      • Elenta

        Selam Amanuel,
        There is no question about the diverse view of Ethiopians towards their government.But when it comes to AT forum you don’t find a single Ethiopian ,they have the same view.

        What give me a pause is when I see some of (but not all) Eritreans that Rodab put them in category #2 defend the position of Ethiopian government more than those Ethiopians .

        These Eritreans don’t even have a shame to criticize and express their sickness towards some Ethiopians like Elias Kifle and Abebe Gelaw because they express their objection to the Ethiopian government.

        • Amanuel Hidrat

          Selam Elenta,

          What I know from my writings and comments is, that I have never condone or condemn about the activities of the Ethiopian oppositions. It is not an Eritrean business to interfere to the Ethiopian internal issues. As simple as that. I could only comment on the relationships of the two countries b/c it is important to the stability and peace of the region.

    • Hayat Adem

      Rodab,
      I don’t if people can read my late reaction to your boxes. When I’ve lazy time, I consume almost all. When I am busy I usually skim for latest posts from my favorite awatistas. But I came late on this when commenters’ referred to your piece repeatedly, then I searched it from your disqus and found my name under box2. Well, I hate to be boxed and foxed. Or alternatively, I don’t mind being placed in any of those. But here is the thing:
      1) if one stands in the mid-way between Weyane and PFDJ, it doesn’t make her/him a balanced thinker. S/he are a victim of a stupid and very mechanical assumption in the sense she is saying all negative and positive scores are exactly equally shared by both parties.
      2) Eritreans should not be judged if they support or oppose the Ethiopian government via-avis the Eritrean government because there isn’t such a thing. Or else you will be a victim of a stupid and very mecahnical assumption that beleives both sides are parties competing for the office. We, Eritreans either support or oppose the Eritrean government. Our views toqards the Ethiopian government comes only in relation to this position. The same is true with Ethiopians. There is no curse of symmetry here at all.
      3) ….
      Hayat

      • Rodab

        Hello Memhr Hayat,
        Thanks for the feedback, and better late than never.
        If it helps, see my comment as follows:
        Let’s say I get bored with some of the topics and I come across a comment that relatively arouses my interest, and I say hmmm I like that and wouldn’t it be interesting to add some names to that. And I say why don’t I poll prominent Awatistas (mental poll, of course). And the polls were on how Eritreans and Ethiopians see their respective governments vis-a-vis the other government.
        Now, say for research purposes, if I were to ask those in group two their support (or favorability) of the two governments in general terms, would you say I would be wrong to think the way I put it up there?
        Now, kindly indicate if you did not want your name included on my future studies:-)

        • Hayat Adem

          Rodab, you are my cool guy.
          Thanks for upping me higher. It is a significant leap to graduate from “Gual Memhr” to a full blown Memhr in just a year plus.
          You should be fine doing whatever entertains your mind. And you can see, you are setting the discussion.
          Only that the originator of these boxes is pissing me and he is never honest about all these classifications. Some people are skillfully setting us up to make us busy rationing our love and hate between forces equitably. How still is it to think, if there are x number of Ethiopian awatistas opposing the Eritrean government; they say, how come there aren’t the same number of people opposing the ruling forces next to our south-end? If x and y Eritrean awatistas oppose PFDJ, how come these same people are not despising Weyane, too.
          Of course, whatever Eritreans say centers Eritrean interest. so is true about Ethiopians. Myself is of the view the best way to safeguard Eritrea’s future and interest is through cooperating with Ethiopia. Eritrea’s inherent gaps (smallness, market) can be asnwered by Ethiopia. Ethiopia can also help in easing Eritrea’s politics-borne pressures (isolation and demographic collapse). Some of your friends thought matrix freaks me out: they say, we have to equally partition our/hate between Sudan and Ethiopia, between Habesha and Arab, between PFDJ and Weyane, if Ethiopians ask for recognition o helping our refugees, the Sudanese must ask for it too, or both must not demand it..here the undercurrent psyche is “we can never let any tendency of rapprochement that recognizes Ethiopia as more natural partner of Eritrea,; any thing that drags Eritrea to its Habeshaness must be tainted taboo” Remove all the smoke and dust. that is what you get Rodab and that really sucks.
          Hayat

  • Hope

    For those of you,who would like to have a little Tea-Break:Read the Article in full at madote.com
    Enjoy:
    “Eritrea belongs to its own people.
    I have worked in 150 countries of the world, and I never encountered a nation like this.
    My first three days there were confusing. I tried to place Eritrea in a box, somewhere. Later, I just let go and smiled… And enjoyed the ride, so to speak.
    What a beauty she is! And what strength, courage, and resilience she radiates!
    As my plane was taking off, for Cairo, at 4 in the morning, I was humming some tune, happily. I was leaving behind a country that I truly could admire.
    Inside, in my heart, I felt much richer than when I arrived.
    If this was, for Western capitalism and imperialism, a virus – political and economic, social Ebola – then I was ready to be infected by it, gladly over and over again.”
    Read more: http://www.madote.com/2014/12/eritrea-is-ideological-ebola-for.html#ixzz3Ljx8XnTr
    Courtesy of Andrei Vitcheck,from Madote ertra.com

    • haileTG

      Hi Hope, you kidding us, right? Who would want to waste their Tea-Break reading a mouth piece of a GARBAGE regime? The whole world knows the Eritrean regime is a garbage. Eritrea, under the garbage regime, is the only African country to be placed under UN sanctions with full blessing of the AU. The latter never did that in its history except against the African garbage regime. And over half a decade on, the garbage regime has no sympathy from anyone, even the Russians quietly let it get suffocated to death inside its garbage can. Come on Hope, browse through this great website in between your busy schedule. IA and all he has to say can never mean anything other than garbage. Why carry garbage here and there. you’re better than that. You deserve to live life without having to endure reading garbage spewed by a garbage regime. 🙂

      • Hope

        Hailat:
        I brought up that Article,which should have not been deleted,at least a sa Courtesy,thinking that it has represented the Real Eritrea and Eritreans,NOT the PFDJ…
        You see how you guys are intoxicated with “Hate and Bias”.???
        I love it and I enjoyed it… as it reflects Eritrea,Eritreans and their “Resilience Against All ODDS”.
        AT:
        It was unfair to delete it,otherwise it might sound that you are against ” Freedom of Information/Speech”.
        I followed the Copy Right and I only quoted two statements and I posted the ref..
        Unless you deleted it to appease Haile TG???
        That would be “Nepotism and Discrimination”.–Just kidding..

        • Hope

          BTW,Abi,I have paid more to the GCMS over the last 20yrs as a GCMS/AAU Alumini than I have paid 2% to the GoE…..that also speaks Volumes,doesn’t it??

    • Abinet

      If things are like that why don’t you go to eritrea instead of ethiopia? Action speaks volumes. You are so exited to go from Bahir Dar to awasa, addis, Nazreth, sodore…. Long list of places in ethiopia.

      • Hope

        Abi nefsi,
        I am glad that you you confirmed that I lOVE Ethiopia and Ethiopians and the ONLY person I have loved after my Mom,has been/is an Ethiopian Beauty(Ye Gonder Kimante).
        and I am proud of it…
        The ONLY few people I “hate”,rather better said,I “DON”T like,as a human being, are few jealous,hassadat and evill minded Ethios on the top.and few of their followers…and I even do’nt hate them I hate their evil motivations,actions,etc…

      • Hope

        Abi,I visit Eritrea every other year except the last 2 yrs….and I have enjoyed:
        -The beautiful Asmera
        -Massawa through the best nature I have ever visited–the Semenawi Bahri—
        -Dahlak Islands
        -Deki-Mahre,Adi keih and the College of Social Sciences,etc–
        -Sawa
        -The unformidable Nacfa Trenches
        -Elaber’id,Keren,Hagaz we Aderde,Akordat,Tessenei,Barentu,Haikota,—

  • Hope

    Guhui or Dehul?
    There are only two reasons as to why you are crying faulty:
    1)Not only the Ethiopian Intellectuals and the Debaters,Dagmawi included,,but also the PFDJ and its supporters,including all the Deki-Hidirtina under the Sun,know well that SAAY that you are demonizing,has the best track record of being the Intellectual of the Intelectuals and the Star Debaters of the star debaters and you know as well better than all that he is so.But why are you crying then?
    2)Coz you know that he is the Threat to your Gurra and bluff ,who does NOT believe in Surrender but inTruth and Facts!!!
    FYI: He only kneels down when he prays to God and when he shoots at the enemy–like he is doing now at you…
    Moreover,he is a human being and what he said during the tempting times of 1998-2000,it is simply coz he is a human being pressed and intimidated by the signs of the time…..Compare what he said to those ,who said what they said–the other party, during that period of time…..
    As to Nittric,he might NOT be ” soft and diplomatic”,but what he says is to the point and he will be SAAY,Jr…soon.
    My point:
    -Challenge what he says and engage him properly.
    Character assasination and name calling are but signs of wickedness and lack of “Self -Confidence.

  • Mahmud Saleh

    Salam Guhui
    Here is a challenge for you: I can produce many examples where Nitrickay criticized PFDJ, you get me one example where this TPLF Amen corner has criticized TPLF. BTW, as a writer, SAAY has used a vivid comparing and contrasting example. You can not get and can’t make any better example than this in delivering the intended message. Again, saay is not talking about Ethiopians but about Eritreans. That being the case, if you tell me Ethiopians have no reason to criticize their government, that’s fine; I have many other Ethiopians who complain about it.

    • saay7

      Thanks Mahmuday:

      By the way, I borrowed “amen corner” from Pat Buchanan who used it decades ago to describe Americans who support Israel, no matter what Israel does. (It was a career threat for him: he was labeled anti Semite). Similarly now, we have an Ethiopian amen corner that sees wisdom in everything Ethiopian gov does. And they think if they say “you are anti ethiopia! Anti peace!” we are supposed to join their amen corner 🙂

      SAAY

  • Fetima Dechasa

    Akkam bultee Abinet?

    Isin attam?

    አይ፦ እግዜር ያውጣ ነው የሚባለው። Some still manage to belittle Ethiopia to make themselves feel good. Delusion is a helluva a drug.

  • Fetima Dechasa

    Guest,

    See the difference between you and me is that I was raised right and it’s against my culture to behave like a rogue gypsy. I will never stoop to your level and give you the satisfaction of uttering such venom, I’m better than that. For that reason alone, I suggest you stop replying to me with your endless provocation. In case you haven’t notices, I don’t engage in mud slinging and useless back and force with those who are unstable.

    Good luck to you and your rich nation Eritrea.

  • Rahwa T

    To Guest (also to Hope),

    Now to the solution. Had I been in your position, I would have never set my foot to the poor man’s house. So please advise your rich compatriots not to go see south of Mereb. Reasons: after all it is not the culture of Eritreans to beg from a poor man; they have a long history of self-sufficiency; above the Tigrians are taking their share of scholarship and migration to Western countries; Sudan are sheltering them in a much better condition.

    • Hope

      Ms Mekele,
      But you might lose the benefit if we stop them though…,and apparently,the reason your leaders are enforcing the “No Peace,NO War” Policy and looking for new more sanctions is to keep the benefit at the expense of of the Eri Refugees,I guess.

  • Amanuel Hidrat

    Dear Guest,
    Good to start from that basic understanding. Let us build that basic understanding and extend it with the rest, to build a consensus in our struggle. Setting a tone doesn’t mean censuring a debate. In order the website to be an educational and fruitful on what we attempt to do, the team has a great role in shaping the debate. That is my demand. But if the team becomes controversial in themselves, there is no body to guide the debate to come to a conclusive mutual agreement. Yes the public shapes the debate but “Awdi Kelassay Yedliyo Eyu.” Don’t read me wrong, the team has done a great job at least to stop the insults and keep the decency of the debate (etiquette of a debate). But that is not enough, because the goal is to help the public to understand each other and work together for the success of the current struggle.

    Amanuel Hidrat

  • Amanuel Hidrat

    Hope,

    “Tolerance” and “setting tone for common understanding” are to different issues. You don’t understand what is written. Read it again , my comment talks about their “skepticism” not about their “tolerance”. Please understand what is written before you comment to help yourself.
    Amanuel Hidrat

  • Amanuel Hidrat

    Dear Guest,

    The debate should be to converge ideas to a common understanding and not to diverge ideas. If there is no good will for “common understanding” from both sides of the argument, there will be no pragmatic move to overcome our challenges. If the debate is set to forge winners and losers we will be on a perpetual fighting. Think about it. Everything we are doing is not to come to a common understanding. We are always on a dog fight. “bezea’Do Tihalfya Adi Ayegabren Iyu.” Eritrea lacks a leader who can administrate our differences and it seems we will continue shouting each other until we find one.
    Amanuel Hidrat

    • Hameed Al-Arabi

      Dear Amanuel Hidrat,

      We will continue shouting until we know how we set up strong democratic establishments. I am very sorry to know you are searching for a person who guide you.

      • Amanuel Hidrat

        Dear Hameed,

        I hope you will be one who guide us if you have the knack and wisdom. But from the debate I saw you, I don’t see on you those qualities to administer our differences. Don’t be sorry on me, one has to know his limits, and I know my limits.

        Amanuel Hidrat

        • Hameed Al-Arabi

          Dear Amanuel Hidrat,

          I am speaking about strong democratic establishments not about persons. As individuals we fail in the past to nominate leaders, and all the present indicators tell we will repeat the same grave mistakes again and again in the future if we follow the mentality of my qualities and your limits. Mr. Hidrat, think about building democratic establishments and forget about persons.

          I know, dear Emma, you may think at some point of time you have found the leader you were searching for and sing and dance for him for decades, and at the end of the day you will inform us you were dancing and jumping for Lucifer. You fail to appoint a leader in past and you will fail again in the future if you don’t change your mind-set. It is better to format your mind-sets and install new soft-wares, otherwise you will continue rotating in the vicious circle without full-stop.

          • Amanuel Hidrat

            Dear Hameed,

            Leaving your insult aside, Hameed, you are part of the leadeship as “Hamid Izaz” in the leadership of the council. If I fail to elect a leader as you have said, you were successful to elect a leader you want. We have seen your choice and kept us in a deadlock for three years without any move whatsoever. Just accept as a member of the failed leadership. That is all you need. The rest is history my friend.

            Amanuel Hidrat

          • Hameed Al-Arabi

            Dear Amanuel,

            Though I expressed to you my opinion, but still you insist to stick for the quest of a leader. Drop, Mr. Amman, your hanging to the idea of leadership and help yourself by shifting for the search of constructing strong democratic institutions. This kind of shift will assist you in overstepping the barriers. The most important thing is not the leaders who are failed but the institution that is built. Mr. Amman change the instruments you have used last time and the institution will function properly.
            Mr. Amman, build institution and defend it from collapsing. It a shame to defend the whole of your life persons.

          • Tesfabirhan WR

            Dear Hameed Al-Arabi,

            I don’t know if you have changed your tones now. You look more decent. Are you ready for an effective communication or discussion? We need a constructive way of engagement rather than jugding one by his racial identity. I am in doubt with you actually to have a constructive opinion exchange.

            This is not to interfer in between but I am responding because I read some humanistic tone here coming from you.

            Wish you a good discussion tome with brother Amanuel Hidrat.

            Huka
            tes

          • Hameed Al-Arabi

            Dear Tesfabirhan,

            I think you forgot how you changed your tone 180 degrees in previous discussion. Mr. Tes, we are still very far from having a constructive opinion exchange until we depart the mentality of (zi berqet tsehaina zi neqese Negusna) and searching of a leader that we don’t have the skill to select.

          • Amanuel Hidrat

            Dear Hamid,
            Thanks god, I haven’t any “position of responsibility” that makes me accountable to the public throughout my life. Rest assured that I have nothing to to defend. I am a free man from any accountability. Have a good one till then. Case closed.

          • Hameed Al-Arabi

            Dear Hidrat,

            You feign to be free of any disease that hit the majority; but I hope you not to be the store of all the ailments. The case will not be closed as far as you bear diseases that ruins the life of our people. When you begin to think about building strong democratic institution then only the case will be closed. It is a grave mistake to leave a sick person with a contagious disease among healthy people. Did you find the leader you are looking for?

  • Hope

    Abreham:
    These are hard-core FACTS…..Read them again…and they answer every bit of your doubts…

  • Nitricc

    I don’t know who is more stupid the Weyane or the American government. The US air force took 17 years to develop and 660 billion dollars for F- 35 and F-22. it never worked. After all that expense, now the jet can’t fly if the fuel is warm, so all tankers they are painted whit reflective colors so to diffract any light in on to the tanker. Talk about a joke and insulting the tax payers. Sooner or latter they have to scrap the program.
    And here is the Weyane, never get it. Why waste their begged resource on something it will never work? Why? The so called Eritrean opposition are a joke but the Weyane never get it. the weyane dream to defeat PIA is making them stupid things to do. Change will never come by the toothless oppositions or by the gutless Weyane. Change will come when PIA allows it or PIA dies. Take your pick!

    • Asmerom

      Nitric Nefsie
      Why are you wasting your time in this forum
      You better lead the “stupid” USA and the Eritrean opposition with your self declared brilliant brain …
      I wish it sinks to your mind how stupid you are when you call others stupid
      Thanks

      • Nitricc

        Hahaha Asmerom, why do you always show up when I say something about Weyane? You are right, I have never doubted my stupidity and I am the first one to admit to you, however; when I see something more stupid than I am, I get excited. So, as stupid as I am I can not be as stupid as your Weyane. Last time your Weyane paid in full to host Eritreans in Hawasa, one must stop and ask what was gained out of that failed conference
        Before doing it again. The sad part is while the stupid Weyane were paying everything for the Eritrean’s vacation in Addis, they let their best musicians to take a bus to Sudan and most of the Musicians lost their lives, yep, drop dead! Imagine this happens while the weyane were dining and wining the toothless Eritrean oppositions. One thing the Weyane must understand is this, the so called Eritrean opposition is using you for vacations, getaways and entertainment purposes. NO true Eritrean will accept any kind of opposition that comes from your side. Get that to your head Weyane!
        And next time, save your money and take care your own musicians rather than wasting your money on Eritreans. Now, Asmerom, don’t you agree with me that Weyane are more stupid than me? Come on say it.

        • Asmerom

          Nitricc
          From where ever you are whatever you say has no substance at all it’s empty , nil zero just a hollow bluff.
          Don’t take me wrong you can say what ever you want to say about Woyanee till your lung dries out and your finger stops functioning I don’t give a damn at all .
          Day in day out instead of learning or at least taking advantage and listening to the advice of our great writers with great ideas in this forum , you just spit your unwarned contradictory ideas with foul language which is typical the trade mark of PFDJ .
          No body ever suggested to you to like the opposition and it is really great that you don’t like the opposition , cause mind like you would do no good at all .
          When have you contributed anything for the good of the Eritrean People ? When did you have a progressive idea to discuss it with all concerned country men ? You are the first to blame others what have you done anything better than others ?? Do you have any thing to say . If you have any ” Brite idea” ( no body knows what that is ) why don’t you bring it forward so people can judged it
          Dear Nitricc let me tell you , you can’t even get along with two of your friends let alone to be part of the opposition . If needs be I can tell you where you belong with your small destructive mind
          Don’t try to make yourself big and important you are nobody and no better than anybody except for your foul language, please don’t make go that destructive road. It’s better for you to focus on the issue at hand if you do have the brain, capability and gut to face the reality .
          Your lies your twisting of ideas and your arrogance and seeing yourself as know all and better than others is going to bounce back and hit you before you know it .
          We all learn and improve from oneanother let’s be advocates for the well being of our nation and our people lets stop finger pointing and come together to make the future of our people brite and prosperous .
          Happy holidays

  • guest

    Lies, lies and lies won’t solve your problem.
    You are distorting what Sebhat said to serve your purpose, which is to confuse and scare Eritreans. He has always and still remain an ardent supporter of the independence of Eritrea. What he said was that the question of wether Ethiopia was a colonizer need to be reexamined since with out the necessary requisites/economic and military / to become a colonizing force, a country can not become a colonizer. This doesn’t mean that Eritrea didn’t deserve to be free or cede from Ethiopia as there are ample reasons for cessation besides the colony or not colony explanation. From a progressive Ethiopian point of view the most important reason or compelling reason for Eritrea’s independence or secession would be the wishes of the people of Eritrea. The current Ethiopian constitution guarantees Nations with in Ethiopia to decide for them selves or determine their right up to independence and it would be untenable to try to reverse this cardinal principle.
    Trust me there is no Ethiopian who would like union with Eritrea including myself but we wish the situation in Eritrea to change for the better and hope to have good neighbourly relationship based on international law and norms. We don’t want this attitude of Eritrea for Eritreans and Ethiopia for all exploitative relationship.
    Of course Sebhat and TPLF have been hurting Ethiopia not by accepting/ supporting Eritrean independence but by allowing Eritreans to benefit at the cost of Ethiopia. Examples are TPLF allowed Eritreans unhindered and preferential access to Ethiopia from 1991 until 1998 while Eritrea was no go for Ethiopians. And now many Eritreans are going to Ethiopia for business, education and to live free in Ethiopia, which is by it self inappropriate and should be illegal because Eritreans should not be treated differently than our other African brothers and sisters and they should be only allowed to stay 1-3 months as visitors and should not be given the right to stay and work as they are aliens. The TPLF will have to pay a price for favouring Eritreans.
    The TPLF should not involve it self in the affairs of Eritrea but rather should protect the interest of Ethiopia at all times but unfortunately we don’t see that and because of that it faces the wrath of the people of Ethiopia and the denigration from Eritreans like your self and it deserves it.

    • Alemayehu

      well said….infact TPLF never faced the kind of challenge it expected to face in Ethiopia, instead it’s near-miss disintegration came due to it’s flirtation with Eritreans and it is most likely to come once again given the way favour Eritreans more than their own citizens ..Just notice the recent trend in Tigray online, a once die hard supporter of TPLF in everything they do, they have become a staunch advocate of Ethiopia for Ethiopians…which they are actually right….better late than never i guess…

    • Fetima Dechasa

      Hello Guest & Alemayehu,

      “And now many Eritreans are going to Ethiopia for business, education and to live free in Ethiopia, which is by it self inappropriate and should be illegal because Eritreans should not be treated differently than our other African brothers and sisters and they should be only allowed to stay 1-3 months as visitors and should not be given the right to stay and work as they are aliens.”

      This is precisely the problem we are dealing with currently. If an Ugandan, Moroccan, Nigerian, Kenyan, or any other African isn’t allow to roam freely and reap the benefits of Ethiopia, then no Eritrean shouldn’t be allowed to do so either. This sorts of preferential treatment of Eritreans in Ethiopia needs to be outlawed immediately. Ethiopia for Ethiopians only! It’s time to focus on what’s important to us; our people and our country, not foreigners. Perhaps we can extend the olive branch once we have sorted out our own short comings. Even then, these branches should be extended only to those who reciprocate with mutual respect, not to the opportunistic vultures.

      • Hope

        Welcome back Ms Dechisa:
        Here are the FACTS that we know about Eritrean refugees currently:
        -Except the 3000 or so “Selected Refugees”,that more than 90,000 are being treated like detainees and PoW while Ethiopia is getting Millions of USD in their name
        -Most or half of the ones repatriated from Ethiopia to the well selected Third Party Nations are Tigreyans
        -That it it has been Ethiopia and her “NO War,No Peace Policy”,more than any thing else,that has contributed to the status of the Eritrean Refugees.
        -That it has been Ethiopia,which has been working hard to tighten and create new sanctions with the help of its masters so as to put the Refugees in that situation….
        So,your bluff and declaration like the Nazis and the Jews is NOT new….it has been already in effect since long time..
        The only reason Ethiopia is allowing or keeping the Eri refugees is to keep the money coming in besides trying to encourgae the Youth to leave Eritrea as a long term Policy of subjugatiing Eritrea.
        But,resta ssured that if your Gov can help us to stay away from Eri Business, it will help us to deal with our own regime.

        • Fetima Dechasa

          Dearest hope,

          Don’t you get tired of the same redundant response to every question? I honestly cannot comprehend the incoherent statement above, sorry.

          • Hope

            Dearest Ms Dechisa,
            Coz truth hurts and you do not wnat to hear the Truth,huh??

      • Amanuel Hidrat

        Dear Fatima D.

        In my opinion, the scenario you tried to relate – the Eritrean situation and the other African countries you mentioned in your comment aren’t the same. Eritreans are fleeing from “an abnormal state” and “repressive authoritarian regime” seeking for refugee in Ethiopia and elsewhere beyond. Other African people from Nigeria, Kenya, Uganda..etc you mentioned (if there are) haven’t faced such abnormality, fear of persecution, and perpetual intimidation. There are no reasons for them to ask for refugee like that of our people. So there is a stark difference between the two. I commend and appreciate for the Ethiopian government for what they are offering to the Eritrean people on humanitarian ground.

        Amanuel Hidrat

        • Fetima Dechasa

          Dear Amanuel,

          Of course the refugees should be welcomed and accommodated as best we can.

          However, I’m just now returning from Ethiopia, last Saturday actually and I’m speaking of the Eritreans that are not refugees but those who are from the diaspora or moved back to do business within Ethiopia. I have encountered many business owners that are Eritreans in Addis, Awassa, etc even in my recent visit. This is not to the benefit of Ethiopia and does not serve the interest of the Ethiopian people.

          • hope

            Ms Fetima,
            –and worse,your inconsistency is that you first said that they have been acting like parasites and being treated “preferentially”,when in fact, they are doing business per the law of the Land like any other Foreigners. …for the best interest of Ethiopia…
            And yet,unless you are a “new born”,knowing well about the positive contribution Eritreans have made over the years to/ for Ethiopia and Ethiopians but only to lose a centuary old and worth of their hard work simply coz of the Nazist attitude and evil deeds like yours…..
            Eat it up your hatred to yourself as Eritreans have never been parasites or hators(except me) at all and will never be—other than being the victims of all evil things Under the Sun
            The “worst” you could it is to learn from Eritreans,if not,appreciate them or thei.r hard work.

          • Hope

            Gosh,
            Pls read as :…”the worst you could DO is…

          • Abinet

            Hope
            Entitlement, entitlement , entitlement . Keep crying.
            How dare you put nazi and ethiopia in the same sentence ? The most hospitable people on earth.
            Maferia !

          • Hope

            Abi—
            If you have gone thruogh what my family had gone through,you would call your Ethiopian leaders nd some Ethiopians as the WorstNazis.
            Yegodda biressa,yetegodaa airesam…
            It is beyond Traumad and PTSD—

          • Berhe Y

            Selam Fetima, Abinet and all,

            I understand you may feel resentment if you think “Eritreans” are benefiting more than the rest of Ethiopians. This if you think short term may sound disadvantage to Ethiopia but if you think long term, it’s to the benefit of Ethiopia, Eritrea and the region as a whole. PMZ in one his interview, I think he said, ONE failed state Somalia is enough, let alone want to add another (Eritrea).

            First I think it’s important to look at the difference between the Eritrean Government/ PFDJ and the Eritrean people. In all our existence as people, I don’t think we have been (Eritreans) being humiliated as we find out selves. So there is a big difference between Hard working Eritrean people and the blood sucking Isayas regime.

            Second, in the last conflict those Eritrean deported (majoring of them, may be even 100%) have nothing to do with the PFDJ regime. They were just hard working Eritreans who accumulated the wealth they had through hard work. PMZ, also said when I asked about the deportation, “it was not our fine hour”, and I think his government did to restore some of the wrong, albiet a LONG way to go. They are not compensating people for wrong doing, they are not giving them preferential treatment or given special loan to build their assets, nothing, except they were told, they can come and claim their properties. After so many years, good luck if there is anything left (paper work and other evidence) to help them restore their lost properties. Nevertheless I think it’s the right decision. They have added a caveat to this “generosity” if they get their property back, they are allowed to sell or change but they will NOT be allowed to TAKE away the money out of the country. Because according to the government, this wealth they got is in Ethiopia and it can NOT leave Ethiopia.

            I don’t know the current policy towards Eritreans is, but I think it’s probably along those lines, in other words, they made sure the interest of the country is protected. Now this is normal practice with a lot of developing countries, example, India had similar policy for a long time (close to 40 years) before they opened in the 90s (even for their own citizens).

            What’s important to remember though, the actions taken against those innocent Eritreans, have proved to be wrong in an open and independent court.

            Lets look at the other facts, at least how Eritrea has played and paid dearly in helping Ethiopia get rid of the most brutal regime. If it wasn’t for Eritreans and Tigrayians, Mengistu would still probably rule just like his best friend Mugabe and continue to create havoc to the Ethiopian/Eritrean people.

            Also please do remember and how much hardware he got from Soviet Union, and all the bombs and heavy arms, including cluster bombs were spread on Eritreans, Tigrayans and destruction of properties. As much as I despise the Eritrean regime and the leader, when it comes to treatment of the PoW, and it’s conduct of war was as civilized as any ordinary government could be, even if it was a movement.

            Off course I am not suggesting, EPLF did for the benefit of Ethiopia but they created an important allay, at the expense of Eritreans (ELF) and Eritreans paid dearly to get rid of this brutal regime. I hope you remember the indiscriminate civilian bombing of Massawa where many women and children were victims.

            I wish the Isayas government made formal claim and ask for compensation rather than engage in illegal mafia activities inside Ethiopia. For example, there were thousands of Civil servants who worked under successive Ethiopian administration who were pensioners, basically the mafia government told them they will NOT pay them anything because they don’t have money. Did the rest of Ethiopian people pensioners told the same thing by the new TPLF government? NO. Did the new Ethiopian government stopped paying it’s debt obligation to the countries like Russia for all the military hardware the DERG acquired, NO. I am not saying this to take advantage of Ethiopia but at least it makes sense from legal point of view.

            Now this is the past and we can put that to rest as this is what I think the facts are, and let’s look at the other new development. Why do Eritreans have “special treatment” and the ability to “invest” in Ethiopia more than others. First I don’t know all the facts, but I am taking this to be true at a face value. Before we look at the Eritrean case, let’s look at an example.

            During WWII, Japan and the US were at war. The US, using the marshal law helped rebuild Japan. The same thing happened to Germany, by American and others money to rebuild the country. Now both countries allay of the US and are probably their best trading partners. Now ask your self, would the US have benefited if it left Japan and Germany to die and disintegrate. Naturally they would have allied with Russia and they would have brought a great threat to the US economy and existence.

            To be continues

          • Hope

            Dear Berhe Y.,or Haile TG II
            Thanks for the Excellent,objective ,factual and to the point analysis,Haile TG style.
            No.it is NOT yet the past.
            They owe us more than a Trillion USD.
            Abi,Fetima,et al…
            Read the above comment and learn the ABC of—–and swallow the bitter Truth but Truth…and come back to your senses…
            BTW,that is how the Eritreans say and do it.

          • Abinet

            What is there to learn from this comment? The ABC of one sidedness ? He just repeated something that has been said since 1998 by 6 million people over 6 billion times .
            And you mr hope don’t jump up and down every time SAAY breaths. It is embarrassing . You are acting like a well trained pet . Shame.

          • Hope

            Abi,
            kediros,min kumenegher aleh’enna?
            The pet of my SAAY’s pets….
            FYI,
            I said it many times that I am Proud Student of SAAY

          • Hope

            You learn lots of new things so that you can learn beyond some few oldy Amharic Proverbs

          • saay7

            Epic, Berhe Y:

            Several weeks ago, one of my all-time favorite Ethiopians sent me a link to an Ethiopian TV broadcast. It was news about some event that was organized at Ghion Hotel for those “privileged Eritreans” who were dispossessed of everything they own, everything they had built over generations, because in a fit of insanity the Ethiopian regime stole their property.

            Here’s what I remember: the news announcer described them as “Qedem sil: habtachew: nbretachew Tlew yehedu Ertrawian”. My amharic is rusty but that translates to “Eritreans who, earlier, had abandoned their wealthy and property.” That’s how they were described: as people who just woke up one and day and said, nah, I think I am just going to voluntarily abandon my wealth and property and leave…

            This is the link. I can’t open it, because they are probably embarrassed by what they said:

            http://www.ethiopian.tv/ethiopian-news-thursday-november-13-2014/

            So, yeah, it is this kind of double-talk that makes those of us who are skeptics about the Ethiopian regime very skeptical, no matter all the kumbaya songs and whitewashing we hear from the permanently clueless.

            saay

          • Hope

            —oohh tefa’kum/Teffachu–belu ene hayat,Abi et al….You better dig your under-ground bankers.The sooner the better..as the S-500 Missile is on its way….

          • Dear Saay,

            “ሀብት ንብረታቸውን ጥለው የሄዱ ኤርትራውያን፣ ……ንብረታቸውን እየተረከቡ በአገሪቷ ሰርተው እንዲኖሩ…” are some of the words of the journalist. This could mean forced or willingly abandoning, and one should take it according to the facts on the ground.

            The most important point is that Ethiopia is correcting the mistake by returning the property of Eritreans, and on top of that, by allowing them to live and work in
            the country. On the contrary, shabia is not saying a word about the things that happened to Ethiopians in Eritrea.

            In these difficult times, few countries are doing what Ethiopia is doing for Eritreans; and politics aside, Eritreans should accept this fact. Some people will surely bring cause and effect as an explanation. Nevertheless, for the predicaments of Eritrea, Eritreans should know that they are much more responsible than Ethiopians for what has become of Eritrea and Eritreans.

          • Hayat Adem

            Actually, the spirit and messages of the forum are totally to the contrary. it is all about curing the fractures and rifts that came with the war that Ethiopians were not responsible to ignite. Such initiatives from Addis residents, victims of a war imposed on them by Isaias group, are to be commended. If reciprocating is a problem, appreciating should not be. If one wants to remain skeptical, it is in spite of such magnanimous efforts and not because of them. The forum is meant to help us clear skepticism not to add new ones. I wonder how one gets into the business of hairsplitting positive start ups in bridging up the two fraternal societies. I consider it as a humanitarian and sacred effort when any one tries to do something along that direction. And it is too important subject for me, personally, to overlook spoilers on such issues. If one’s Amharic is too rusty to understand the message this language carries, then one is expected to ask for context or explanation and refrain from any temptation to criticize something one is not sure s/he fully conquered. A reasonable amount of perspective is needed and such efforts need to be cherished. Horizon is right.
            Hayat

          • Amanuel Hidrat

            Dear Hayat

            You have said “the forum is meant to help us clear skepticism.” Yes indeed one of the purpose of this forum should have been to remove skepticism (and I may add also to remove mistrust). Unfortunately if the team are skeptic and distrustful to the good will of Ethiopian government, in correcting their mistakes, returning the properties of our people, and allowing our young to higher education on humanitarian ground, I don’t think others in this forum will do otherwise. Why? Because the tone is set by the team and are moderators. One expect the team to be top diplomatic within this forum.

            Amanuel Hidrat

          • Guest

            Hayat,

            The skepticism and mistrust among Eritreans is far more worse than that with Ethiopians. Now, please stop pretending as an honest broker whenever Ethiopia and Ethiopians get criticized. People here in the very forum don not seem trust you as Eritrean who is seeking solution for the problem our people desperately need. By the way when did you realize the forum is about curing, it must be after you picked a nick name.

            cheers

          • abrham
          • Rahwa T

            Hi Abraham,
            Don’t expect a change in his stand. He will not have time for such stories, he just don’t care how much the native citizens are damaged.

          • Abinet

            Selam Ato Berhe
            When you continue your narration , please say a word or two about those ethiopians who you inhumanly kicked out from your country in that cold winter. Just mentioning them is enough since you didn’t say any thing about them . If you think they are ” children of the lesser God ” just forget about them as always.
            Haile Menkorios , as your ambassador , instead of becoming chief of money laundering and tell us you didn’t fight for ” BARINET ” but ” netsanet” , he should have advised you the consequences of being a foreign citizen. You see once you deny your ethiopian citizenship , there are a lot of things you lose with it including pension . How do you , Ato Berhe, ask a pension from another country?
            If PMMZ talked about compensation , he was just using “diplomats” language .
            When a diplomats says “yes” he means perhaps , when he says ” perhaps” he means NO, if he says No , he is not a diplomat . In short he becomes IA.
            Thanks

          • Hope

            Abi,Where you bron after 1998?
            here the Fact:
            That the Ethiopians were sent to Ethiopia in the most Humane way through the Red Cross’ Luxuriosu Red Cross Buses ,not bare-feet through the deserts of Denkalia.
            But my point here is: What brought these obsolete issues?

          • Abinet

            Hope
            I’m glad we are making progress . For the time being , let’s forget about the Red Cross buses and tell us WHY you kicked them out. While at it tell us also the eritreans ‘ reaction to what happened to their neighbors. I tell you those eritreans in Addis were dancing as has been the case always.

          • Hope

            Abi,
            I REFUSE to think and to go backwards like “Shinti Ghemel”(Consult Rahwit the Princess)

          • Rahwa T

            Hope,
            I am learning to leave commenting at Awate step by step. I will never react to whatever you regurgitate. Most of what you are writing are rubbish. Sorry to that. You should learn to act and speak in accordance to your age.

          • Rahwa T

            Hi Abinet,

            That is what surprise me whenever I read comments and articles related to the issue of Eritreans who were forced to leave Ethiopia. Most comments are to “selfish” that never see left or right. It is as if Eritreans were God’s special creatures.

          • Tzigereda

            Dear Berhe,
            Thank you for your differentiate, balanced and very reasonable thoughts. It reflects the idea of basic human rights, humanity beyond borders within the historical context, and the inevitable need of respecting it.
            “Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need” Khalil Gibran, I dont see that this is what has yet been “offered” to Eritreans living in Ethiopia.

          • Rahwa T

            Dear Tsigereda,

            Could you tell us your understanding of helping refugees in a bit more elaborated way? Like how the Sudanese government has been assisting Eritreans refuges since the 1970s, how the other neighboring countries are treating Eritreans refugees currently? I guess such experiences would be good lesson both for the government and the hosting people.

          • Hope

            Ms Tigray,
            It is upto your crooked government as to how to learn about treating Refugees as Refugees,NOT as “Detainees or POW”..
            Did you say the Sudan?It is the second home for Eri Refugees since 1970,NOT just a Refugee for US.

          • Hope

            Refugee–should read as:” Not just like a Shimelbla Camp”

          • Hope

            My apology:
            The above response is to Rahwa Ze Mekele,NOT for the Tsighereda,kemshima,the Princess of Eritrea

          • Kaddis

            Berhe – ( Saay included )

            I kind of agree on most of your takes – your points can at least serve as a base for more dialogue/ negotiations. While going through the facts …can you shed some light on the properties Eritrea confiscated in Assab while in transit to Ethiopia when the Sheraro war broke out? What is the explanation from the gov and the position of the opposition on this issue.

          • saay7

            Selamat Kaddis and Horizon:

            Kaddis, the issue of Ethiopian properties at Asab was already litigated by very able lawyers and judges (Eritrea Ethiopia Claims Commission) who gave their ruling in 2005 and I don’t know why we have to re-litigate it here. Just google “Final Award – Ports – Ethiopia’s Claim 6.”

            If you are bottoms line kinda guy, here it is: “For the foregoing reasons, Ethiopia’s Claim 6 is dismissed.”

            Horizon:

            Come on, I quoted the reporter verbatim and you confirmed it (glad my amharic is still holding up.) The reporter was trying to give the impression that Eritreans just voluntarily left their properties and now they are coming back to get it. I provided the link and people can listen for themselves. As Berhe Y explained this, too, was taken up by the Claims commission and there wasn’t a lot of volunteerism in that.

            People to people outreach is awesome but when you have the party that did the eviction is now brokering (and conditioning) the return of property AND reporting on it, that is not people to people but government to people. Not all Eritreans are the kind you see here, weak and willing to take any crumb and so, not surprisingly, the Ghion Hotel “Government to People” meeting, like all Weyane-Eritrean meeting, was a bust.

            saay

          • Dear Saay,

            If we put out all flicker of light because it is not a glowing fire right from the start, and if we oppose all sorts of Ethio-Eritrean reconciliation, because it is not within the criteria we have set, then, the stalemate is going to be there forever. Ethio-Eritrean rapprochement should start somewhere, however small and unbalanced that starting point might be, and the one that took place at Ghion Hotel is not bad for a beginning.

            People to people discussion would have been much better. If that is not possible, and if the Ethiopian government cannot sit and discuss Ethio-Eritrean problem with the PFDJ, then it is not a bad idea to speak to the Eritrean people, and the Ethiopian
            government is doing exactly that.

            I do not understand why you would say, not all Eritreans are weak and willing to take any crumb, as these people, because I think that they are respectable people, who know what they are doing.

          • saay7

            Selamat Horizon:

            I am not opposed to Ethio-Eritrean reconciliation, I am all for it. Yes, we can’t have a government-to-government reconciliation now. What I am saying is that the Ethio government-to-Eritrean-people reconciliation has been an unmitigated disaster because the Ethio government is not interested in reconciliation but in propaganda and creating malleable Eritrean toys.

            We have had since effort since 1999 (Ethio government to Eri people) and it has been an unmitigated disaster. There are two ways forward:

            1. For the Ethio government to give the Ethio people the space to have a real people-to-people rapprochement with the Eritrean people;

            2. For the Ethio government to have a meeting of equals with the Eritrean people.

            It is unable and incapable of doing this. There is a 15 year track record of that.

            I will make it very clear what I mean by “not all Eritreans are weak and willing to take any crumb.” There are Eritreans who take ANY Ethiopian precondition, any at all, and in the entire 15 year (1999 to present) dysfunctional relationship between the Ethio government and Eritrean people they don’t attribute 1% of the fault to Ethiopia. Instead, they pretend to be all politically sophisticated and lecture about “ethiopia’s national interest” and they would never, ever stand up to Ethiopian government and say, “on this, you are wrong.” Here’s one example: the late Prime Minister Meles Zenawi apologized for the deportation of Eritreans and this weaklings I am thinking of NEVER once criticized Ethiopia for it. In fact, they were doing their mock-sophisticated, “well, Ethiopian national security…we started it first…” They are Blame Eritrea First on every single issue.

            Hope that clarifies things.

            saay

          • Amanuel Hidrat

            Kubur Saay

            “malleable Eritrean toys”!!!!!! Wow, we keep undermining each other. Very sad. It has to stop this disparaging each other. I hope you peak your diplomatic samsonite (briefcase) to lead the diplomatic core, strictly chosen by you, to exercise your diplomatic acumen to save us from the unmitigated disaster to use your characterization. You are welcome to fill the vacancy that we all have failed so far to exhibit and translate in to tangible action.

            Hawka,
            Amanuel Hidrat

          • Nitricc

            Aman everything what SAAY said I share 100% with it. it is an absolute honest assessments. Let’s start with you Aman, I know the care and concern you have for your country and people but did you once call out the Ethiopians to their miss deeds, sabotage and their filthy games. Aman, when was the last you said anything defending Eritrea against the TPLF and the Ethiopians? When, just show me one? And I believe you and people like you have embolden the TPLF to widen its grip and extend the suffering of the Eritrean people. The easiest way to get rid of PIA is to take away his reasoning. Demarcate the border and you shall see if PIA made it to one more night in power. My point is you couldn’t even master enough courage to call out on the weyane to vacte our land and to up hold what they have signed and agreed for. So, what SAAY saying the absolute truth! Nothing but the Truth!

          • Amanuel Hidrat

            Nitrikay,
            Let me put my answers in a way understandable and absorbable to you:-

            (a) Barking and insulting is not a substitute to diplomatic maneuver to settle intrastate and interstate disputes to bring peace. What saay is insulting his colleagues as “toys”, and you insulting to Ethiopians all that comes to your mouth, will not bring peace “among us” and with “our neighbors.” The easiest task is what you are doing behind nickname. But that is not political-diplomacy that brings people together. (Strike one)

            (b) Border issues are solved by legitimate governments. Not by “you” or “Saay” or “me or anyone” individual citizens who has not mandate whatsoever. What you, myself, saay, or others could do is people-to-people diplomacy to create favorable situations, for cultivable relationships, if we are serious enough. We are repeatedly failing to learn and help our people. In fact we are undermining the goodwill and the help our people getting. We become irresponsible to the fate of our people who are in Ethiopia and anywhere else. (strike two).

            (c) Sitting on a table with your argument is not a sin at all, if you are confident or if leaders don’t want to use it for holding hostage to their people. You could negotiate on the technical issues (not on the term of agreement) to break through the decade and half stalemate of border issues. I believe issayas and his government are using this border issue for holding hostage to our youth (strike-three).

            (d) Issayas has already said the border issue is resolved accepting the “virtual demarcation” what he likes to call it. There is no concern for him even if the pillars of demarcation are not put on the ground. That will tell you, demarcation will not happen as far as he is at the helm of power. He is comfortable with “no peace and no war” with issue hanging in the air. So what you and your likes are doing a layman politics “wayne move out from our land”. That is not how the international relationship works, it has its own modus operande. We have to act accordingly. (strike-four).

            (e) In order to work diplomatically, we have to clean our house and resolve our differences. Otherwise we are using the “border issue” as ball game to fight ourselves each other. Clearly our debate unambiguously shows that. Unfortunately we are resorting in to name calling such as toys, neo-andnet from many unsuspected individuals who should be an exemplary. (strike five).

            (f) Debate needs decency, humility, respect, tactics, strategy, farsightedness, and magnanimity. These vocabularies are not in our political store. If we don’t posses them we can’t understand each other and our engagement will be rough as it gets to its climax. What else can you describe our current status other than “rough and unproductive.” (strike-six).

            So Nitrikay, do not ask me to act like you, or someone who enjoys insulting his colleagues and his neighbors. I am for peace and good neighborhood, and your strategy contradicts with my beliefs. I hope you will take some notes from my argument.

            Amanuel Hidrat

          • Nitricc

            AMAN!
            Aman: I don’t think you get it? I don’t want peace, I want justice!!!
            There was a time for diplomacy.
            There was a time for dialogue.
            There was a time for give and take.
            There was a time for reasoning.
            There was a time for debate.
            There was a time for modus and operands.
            There was a time for mutual respect.
            There was a time for everything you are suggesting.
            There was a time, time, time and that time was elapsed with the all out war that TPLF ignited. The reason there was war was because dialogue, diplomacy, you name it, failed.
            In the war; 20 K + lives of Eritreans lost, villages destroyed and the wanton destructions that followed by the TPLF gangs can not erase your diplomacy bull crap.
            Once the issues is gone to the courts of law and once the court has rendered its verdicts what in the hell do you want talk about anything? Justice has spoken and let the justice be implemented. How hard is this for you to understand? Once the court decision is implemented then the dialogue, the diplomacy whatever go a head. Justice comes before peace. You may think you are a man of peace but sadly you are encouraging the opposite of peace. I have asked you a question you never answered me. If TPLF can deny what they signed in front of the world what makes you they can hold a dialogue some where in Adi-grat? For future generation and peace sake, implement the verdict. Bedsides;
            You can’t be a man of peace while you are rejecting justice. So, my friend, demand justice and you don’t have to worry a thing about peace. Now, join the Eritrean people and demand the rule of law to be implemented and demand the TPLF gangs to vacate the Eritrean land. if not, you are simply prolonging the suffering of the Eritrean people by appeasing the TPLF gangs. Understood; you are not shay to display your passion to TPLF and its dead leader. You didn’t even care the contradiction you encountered between opposing dictatorship and adoring one; Melles! By the way you never explained it, worst; you labeled a brutal dictator “a moral leader” so, when I call you out, is not with out reason. I have followed you and your passion to TPLF gangs is not healthy. If you need lasting peace between the two people, then let the border verdicts be implemented. The END!
            “Peace is not the absence of conflict (or war), rather the presence of justice” (strike 10)

          • Semere Andom

            Nitricc:

            Let me add to your Ecclesiastes timelines:

            There is time to grow brain cells

            There is a time to transform from an opposition website to a PFDJ and Ethiopian website

            There is a time to perfect a PFDJ style labelling of the opposition

            There is time a time for every versions and iterations of PFDJ, PFDJ-3 is in the pipes lines

            And there was a time when the opposition was hunted down like dogs in the streets of Addis

          • Nitricc

            Semere, You are not that bright are you? Forget your revenge mentality and think what is good for the country and people; that is all matters to me. You are very well known to sympathize with weyane and to side with ELF and hold grudge against EPLF. So, I can not take you as honest broker. Regarding oppositions being hunt in Addis, well this is all you need to know and that will tell you everything there is to know. When a government throws its best pilot in a prison in the middle of war, in a war means everything, then, there is nothing to say.
            But thanks to the likes of you and Aman; you are helping PIA to stay in power and hindering for any change to come. You don’t get it.

          • Rahwa T

            Hi Horizen,

            I am dismayed to see you’re up vote under this comment. I don’t think the like of Saay will ever contribute for the
            reconciliation of the two people. I have followed him for about five years and have never sensed peace in him. Had I been a leader, I would rather go for the no war a peace situation for unlimited period of time than attempting to
            sitting for a deal with him. I wonder how he would interpret the words diplomacy, politeness and humbleness in his dictionary. None of them are in his nature.

          • Dear Rahwa T,

            I come to Awate.com to state my opinion and to read other people’s opinion. I have no purpose to always influence/change or adopt other people’s opinion. Right or wrong (my personal view), I have the obligation to respect an opinion, because each one of us is entitled to his or hers.

            If I upvote a comment it does not always mean that I uphold it hundred percent, and if I do not upvote it, it does not mean either that I reject it completely. Nobody has the whole truth on his/her side; and partial truth sometimes opens the way forward. I hate to say my way or the highway. Therefore, I have no problem to
            upvote a comment, even if I accept only part of it.

            If all opinions were to coincide fully, then there is no reason for any discussion. If Saay’s stand is right or wrong, time will prove or disprove him. Until that day,
            we should continue communicating, even if we do not support an idea. Nobody is always right or always wrong, and upvoting a comment does not mean everything. Opinions do change depending on
            situations that might manifest themselves in the future. Let us have the door always open.

          • Rahwa T

            Dear Horizen,
            I see your point. Thank you. On my side, I have never up-voted at ideas that are never agreeable to me.

          • Hope

            huhuhh Ms Tigray,
            Truth hurts,huh?
            Plus:
            Surrender is NOT an option,NOT an Eritrean Culture,for that matter.
            Truth will set us FREE…..from the YOKE you imposed on us,Threats,No War ,NO Peace Status,etc– besides from your evil tactics…dreams,motivation,etc..
            It is a well documented history and it will repeat itself.

          • Yoty Topy

            “Surrender is NOT an option,NOT an Eritrean Culture,for that matter”

            Beyond the hubris, there is something that can be said about your statement,which I believe is at the heart of all the conflicts that have plagued this region for centuries i.e. the role of religion. I think that statement is not limited to the “Eritrean culture” but rather speaks volume to the rigidity of the Orthodox Church.In the Orthodox teaching, the truth is defined in stark contrast of black or white.
            You either are “hakegna” (defender of the truth) or “hashawi” (Master of deceit) with no room for “in between” which leads to uncompromising positions on issues. I remember growing up in the region that the best compliment one can bestow on me was telling me I was “hakegna!” and of course now I know that my truth isn’t necessarily the case of another person’s.

          • Hope

            Meaning that you are the only hakegna?
            Others are Hashewti?
            Btw, is “Hasawi” the Mekele equivalent to Asmarino way of saying ” Hasawi”?
            Yirda’aka Ato Hakegna”

          • haileTG

            Hi Hope,

            Here is quick lie detector test 🙂

            Q) Are you a lair?

            a – Yes

            b – No

            Answer;______

          • Hope

            Hailat:
            What the heck has “lying” to do in this forum or debate?
            Lying about what and in what sense?
            Is it coz I said “Surrender” is NOT an option?
            But that is the historical fact though .
            The guy or the lady felt unhappy and he or she seems to Tigreyan based on the dialect he or she used.
            And if so, do you expect any thing good to get out from his or her mouth about Eritreans?
            If you believe so,,show me the money.
            Plus:
            Lie Detectors and their procedures have remained Un-Scientific.
            On a serious note,which I mean serious,list down my “lies”,then it will be easier for me to answer your “Lie Detection” questions.
            Kab Behali’us Deghami’u ”

          • haileTG

            hey Yoty Topy,

            You sound rather truthful person to me 🙂 [I did a linguistic lie detecting profiling in your expression there and am satisfied that you are relating your experience truthfully. Look on the video included for brief technique used in my assessment. However, I may not be fully expert on the job hence I don’t want to lie to you that my finding is set on concrete:-)]

            As a side note, save the few brave fathers in the Orthodox church, I don’t think the official orthodox church in Eritrea gives a flying hoot about truth. But I think it is much to do with the level of backwardness because Orthodox is a very old institution so to speak. My personal feeling is that post independence Eritreanism has adopted deceit (including self) as a central character trait. In fact, such is the reason as to why our people trust each other the least, suspect each other the most and never bring themselves to agree with one another. Subconsciously we consider each other deceitful and find it risky to collaborate in any meaningful way. The proof is in the pudding my friend:-)

            Now to the exciting part, how to tell truth from lie 🙂

            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGLhW0aQ3j0

          • Rahwa T

            Yoty Topy,

            This is one
            of the most stupid comments I ever read in this forum! Are you a new convert? What if you know that the man you are dealing with is a catholic. Do you change your opinion? If you grew up as a lair, blame it on your parents. Why are you insulting an old religion of more than 50,000 million? Please refrain from insulting my religion. Live you,
            taking voraciously whatever leftover your new preachers offer you. You are still the same “Hashawi”.

          • Amde

            Yoty,

            There is a school of thought that says that Monotheism and monotheistic religions foster conflict precisely because they by definition divide the world into a dualistic view of those who are in and those who are out. (One proponent of this view is Ali Mazrui, an intellectual from Mombasa.) A difference of opinion therefore has larger secular and spiritual implications.

            I have often felt the dogmatism of the revolutionary generation was a perfect mirror of this – “oppressor” vs “oppressed” class, “revolutionary” vs “reactionary” etc., with policies that naturally ended up being equally dogmatic.

            But we can’t just indict our Orthodox faith in this – it looks like it is a universal human urge. Catholic vs Protestant, Muslim vs Crusader, Catholic vs Orthodox etc…. In this day and age, the great Shia-Sunni civil war we are daily witness to is being played out along these very lines.

            Amde

          • saay7

            Hey Amde:

            Does that mean you agree with this guy?:)

            3 minute video and happy Saturday. Warning: adult language.

            saay

            http://youtu.be/55h1FO8V_3w

          • Amde

            Hey Saay,

            That was funny. Thanks for the link. Not necessarily a Patton Oswalt fan, and I am not a Atheist. (And I really dislike the tone of the current crop of Atheists… but that is a topic for another day..) But the Sky Cake theory has its strength.

            I heard this from one person who was famous in the Ethiopian student movement and inter-left civil war of the qey shibbir era. He currently lives in exile, but is still very much an avowed Atheist and Communist. I don’t remember the context, but he was relating how he warns his daughter not to be bad – because “Egziabher yayishal”. We were like – “WTF …. are you religious now all of a sudden?” He just laughed and said that he wanted his daughter to stay on good behaviour even when he wasn’t there. When she gets older she gets to decide if there is a God, but until then, the fear of God has been inducted into the co-parenting business.

            Amde

          • saay7

            Hey amde,

            That’s funny. An american expression is “there are no atheists in foxholes”….

            If Patton is not your cup of tea, maybe monty python is? Here’s “The Shoe Is The Sign”, their take on how religions get divided up into sects. A 2 minute video: it is Saturday and Eyob is boycotting awate because Jebena is broken:

            saay

            http://youtu.be/Ka9mfZbTFbk

          • Amde

            Hey Saay,

            I have to confess I consider “The Life of Brian” one of the best movies ever made. I am very much a fan of Monty Python. About a decade ago, the 25th year anniversary midnight showing of “Life of Brain” was conducted in one of the midwestern towns I used to live in, and I’ll be damned if I didn’t find myself saying almost the entire dialogue at the same time.

            I see your theological dissimilitude, and raise you with dogma… from the Life of Brain

            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MIaORknS1Dk

            Amde

          • saay7

            Selamat Amde:

            We should host a “Life of Brian” party. I see your stoning and I raise you with “What Have The Romans Ever Done For Us?”. I am almost reminded of this whenever you know who misses Haile Selasse-ruled Eritrea:)

            saay

            http://youtu.be/9foi342LXQE

          • Amde

            Haha…

            Come on…. You know the number of Eritrans who say the best of times was during Haile Sellasie is not small… so kudos on this fine choice…

            So in light of that, to remind you of thegood old days when we imposed impaccable Amharic on you, here is Latin Grammar

            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IIAdHEwiAy8

            Amde

          • Yoty Topy

            Pleasure talking to you Amde and thank you for rescuing me by expounding eloquently on the role of religion in shaping one’s world view, which judging from the feedback I received-I seem to have failed utterly. I tripped HOPE by my accent(which, BTW was intentional) and rushed away RAHWA into digging trenches deeper than those of WWI to defend Orthodox Christianity(for auditing purpose: I was raised Orthodox but like most of us good old materialism gotten the better of me. Translation: too “hangovered” to go to Sunday Mass

          • Amde

            Hi Yoty,

            Anytime my friend. I love sister Rahwa and – though I disagreed with it – I loved her reaction to your post as well. I feel she embodies the strength of our mothers and sisters who defend and truly keep the faith going forward. Men dominate the religious bureaucracy but it is truly the women who keep it strong and going through the thousand and one things they do to maintain the community and the church, and by ensuring their children are properly raised in the faith whatever it is. Sometimes I wonder if women are created with a different ability that allows them to sense the spiritual, because theologically and dogmatically, our religions give second place to women.

            I actually do not know much of Ali Mazrui’s writings – so on this score you will have to be my teacher. I first heard about him in the early 90s when I believe he had a TV series on Africa. I don’t remember the circumstances but at about that same time, someone mentioned his position on this very issue we are talking about (Monotheism and intolerance), and it stuck with me. I think at the time I was still under the general impression that polytheism was a sign of backwardness to be inevitably replaced by the modernity of Monotheism, so his view was quite an eye opener for me. I have not thought about religion or spirituality the same way since.

            It is a shame he passed away. But at least he has left an intellectual legacy, which is something precious little of our African brethren have accomplished.

            Amde

          • Habte

            Mr Saay
            Sometimes you really amaze me !!! what more entitlement do you want to demand from Ethiopia ?
            as respected as you are please know your limits
            Habte

          • Hope

            Sir,
            My apology for my known interjection here and there but since an open forum allows it,hence,let me interject…
            As articulate as you seem to be,would you be so kind to clarify what you meant by your comment and what SAAY might be missing?
            Isn’t is a Crystal Clear Truth,at least per my understanding/Or you are expressing the bitterness of Truth?

          • saay7

            Selamat Habte:

            I am not asking for any entitlement from “Ethiopia.” To help us all see the right perspective, in this forum of Eritreans and Ethiopians, it is possible to have:

            1. Eritreans who support the Eri gov and oppose the Ethio gov
            2. Eritreans who oppose the Eri gov and support the Ethio gov
            3. Eritreans who oppose the Eri gov and oppose the Ethio gov
            4. Ethiopians who support the Ethio gov and oppose the Eri gov
            5. Ethiopians who oppose the Ethio gov and support the Eri gov
            6. Ethiopians who oppose the Ethio gov and oppose the Eri gov

            Group 2 and group 4 who essentially dominate this forum (I don’t think there is a single Ethiopian in this forum who doesn’t support the Ethio government) are trying to make it sound that any other viewpoint by an Eritrean or Ethiopian is anti-peace, belligerent, chavinist etc. It is not even possible sometimes to have a debate as any criticism of the Ethiopian government makes them irrational. (Please refer to Amanuel’s response: I accused the Ethiopian government of wanting malleable toys and he somehow made it sound that I am accusing Eritreans I disagree with are malleable toys.) Refer also to those who cite third party sources without mentioning the sources because it would undermine their weak argument. Here’s one third-party authority on the subject of expulsions:

            http://www.refworld.org/docid/3de25c7f4.html

            I think I am within my limits to question the qualification of the present Ethiopian government as an advocate for peace and fair play. I think it is within my limits to suggest that the Eritrean opposition has been severely handicapped by its over-reliance on the Ethiopian government. It is the preponderance of the gullible and weak Eritreans that may make my statement sound like I am transgressing my limits when I ask that my people be treated with respect.

            saay

          • haileTG

            Selamat saay,

            Brace for lengthy interrogation 🙂

            -On your combinatorics above, can we find a space for those who Oppose the Eri gov and strive for cordial and dignified relationship with external parties?

            -You seem to lay the blame on ” the preponderance of the gullible and weak Eritreans…”, are these Eritreans of unflattering attribute behaving “gullible and weak” towards Ethiopia alone, or are there those who are also “gullible and weak” towards other quarters? I mean are you attacking those “gullible and weak” for being such type or blaming Ethiopia for illiciting such tendency that wouldn’t have been there otherwise?

            – I know you tend to put the blame on Ethiopia for the failure of the opposition (especially those in Ethiopia):

            1) could you give us concrete and verifiable examples where Ethiopia has placed duress or otherwise to effect the currenent division among the opposition groups.

            2) Can you point to a successful opposition undertaking that is conducted outside of Ethiopia and hence try (if possible) how the success can be attributed to the fact that the opposition activity was conducted outside Ethiopia (or its percieved interference thereof). There has been the “Eritrean problems, Eritrean solutions” project, and it has been going on its third year now, can we point to successes in that drive? If it had failed, how is that failure different to the failure of other organizations in Ethiopia or outside of it?

            Dear saay, we have a regime that lives off parasitically off of Ethiopian hostility on a full time bases. Truth be told, Ethiopia isn’t and can’t be the only regional entity vying for influence on Eritrea or other regional countries. Ethiopia’s influence would however be dependent on its ability to project significant economic and security strength than street politiking. Looking at the Eritrean political landscape, including PFDJ, many are beholden to external interests. It isn’t Ethiopia doesn’t mean there is nobody. The point is though, interests matter, i.e. social, economic and historical. And vilifying certain segment of our society my be a dangerouse game around the nation’s major tactonic plates. After all, hundreds of thousands of Eritreans are living and working in Ethiopia, I think that counts to something.

            Regards

          • saay7

            Selamat Haile The Great:

            Your honor, may I approach the bench?

            – why, yes, of course, we can create any kind of combination. Mine, out of necessity, is very stark but you are welcome to create a more nuanced matrix
            – There are gullible and weak Eritreans of every ideological denomination. It simply means someone who is very selective about data and/or someone who knows right from wrong but is hesitant to say it because s/he doesn’t want to raise the ire of someone more powerful. I am sorry that it is unflattering and I should probably have used more neutral words like “optimistic diplomat.”
            – As the great Serray once observed (where is he, by the way), Ethiopia is the country where Eritrean opposition go to die. One can see the trajectory since 1999. Some organization starts with great fanfare then goes to Addis and comes back all crippled. A gentleman by the name of Frezghi Mesmer wrote a compelling piece on FB as to why this is so; rather than making a new argument, I will post his after I find it.
            — I can point to several opposition initiatives that are very successful that occur completely outside the Ethiopian orbit. “Arbi Harnet/Freedom Friday” is one. The proliferation of independent Eritrean media (awate, assenna, Erena, etc) is another. The campaign behind CoI is another. The US-based, Europe-based cvil society that has been degrading the PFDJ since 2001 is another.

            Ethiopia is not the only regional entity vying for influence on Eritrea, true. But it is the only country where mainstream opinion is that Eritrea is born deformed, an artificial country, suffering from some fascict-inflicted damage. Hundreds of thousands of Eritreans live, work and GO TO SCHOOL in Sudan and I have not once heard, in 30 years, a single Sudanese bragging about it or demanding gratitude for it.

            saay

          • Dear Saay,

            What Sudan is doing for Eritreans is what a friend does for another friend. On the contrary, what Ethiopia is doing for Eritreans is coming from a supposed Enemy directed
            towards another supposed Enemy; something completely unexpected.

            How many Eritreans on this site refer to Ethiopia as “the enemy”? Many. How many refer to Sudan as the enemy? None. Normally, nobody runs to the country of his/her enemy, and no country accepts an enemy and gives them not only security, but also the chance for higher education.

            There lies the big difference between Ethiopia and Sudan.

          • Mahmud Saleh

            Dear Horizon;
            Please separate Ethiopian and Ethiopian rulers/governments. I may be a harsh critic of Ethiopian government but that doesn’t mean I hate Ethiopia. Apart from your Asab gaff, you seem to be a person I like engaging. I want you to see the following:
            1. Ethiopia is doing what’s required of it; it also resonates with the majority of Ethiopians. I tend to remind folks of this story: when the Ethiopian government was on its madness of rounding Eritreans, Ethiopians showed a more praise worthy attitude by helping out Eritreans who were told to leave everything behind. I have an Eritrean friend who has been going back. During those days, his neighbor “bought his business” and saved it from being confiscated. There are many similar stories of giving shelter, food, drinks and general empathy along the route to the border. Here in the diaspora, everything is normal, I just attended a wedding last month of an Ethiopian friends’. I tried some of your shoulder and neck breaking dances, I was told I did well, except I had to get up the next morning with a terrible aches all over by joints. Any help Eritreans are getting are because of the good will of the Ethiopian people. If Ethiopian government really likes the Eritrean people it could do one doable thing and that’s abide by the border ruling and deprive PFDJ a source of its existence. So, we need to be clear not to mix the peoples and the governments. I have come to know Ethiopia through what was extended to me while coming to the USA in the mid 90s, and through its people here; and I can tell you I love it. Whatever grievance I may have has to do with politics of its government and not with Ethiopia and its people.
            2. As a well read person and more reasonable than the folks who join us here, you may want to reconsider that the fruits you enjoy today in Ethiopia are the products of sacrifices both peoples had paid. If you are happy with the downfall of Mengistu’s regime, I hope you don’t downplay Eritrean’s role in that finality. As much as I won’t forget Ethiopians’ role in securing the independence of my country, as a citizen it’s important to remind yourself of this binding factor; that’s in addition to the cultural and historical ties. So, why would Ethiopian assistance to Eritreans be considered as an assistance coming from an “enemy”?
            3. Let’s not exaggerate that assistance. Again, Ethiopia is doing nothing more than its international obligation. You can revisit international laws regarding refugees, UNHCR own data on assisting Eritreans in Ethiopia. As a citizen, I would expect you to push your government to do more. Particularly, in ensuring Eritrean refugees safety; in disrupting human traficking networks which originate from Tigray,etc. You see, sometimes it’s confusing. There are Ethiopians (not you) who blame Eritreans for wanting to separate, and then when Eritreans somehow become in need of their assistance, they don’t hesitate to remind them they are “enemies.”

          • Dear Mahmud Saleh,

            My comment was meant to show that it is not right to underestimate, when a poor nation like Ethiopia tries to share out of the little she has. I had no reason whatsoever to underline the animosity of the two countries, which in fact is the animosity of the two governments and their supporters, and not that of the two peoples. Nevertheless, many Eritreans do not refrain from mentioning Ethiopia as the enemy.

            On humanitarian grounds, Ethiopia has the obligation to help Eritrean refugees as she is helping Somali and S. Sudanese refugees; but Ethiopians see the case of Eritrean refugees from a completely different perspective, and that is what is being underrated. The
            government can facilitate, but it the Ethiopian society that is going to give life and meaning to their everyday existence. Nobody is bragging about this, but it does not mean that it should not be appreciated.

            Nobody is exaggerating the assistance either. We are forced to mention it when some Eritreans simply belittle poor Ethiopia’s efforts. Some Eritreans say that Ethiopia is economically being compensated by the UN for what she is doing for Eritreans (I do not know how much true it is?), nevertheless, there is one thing money
            cannot buy, and that is the Ethiopian heart and good will to accept Eritreans in the Ethiopian society as brothers and sisters, which is not the case for Somali
            and S. Sudanese refugees.

            The downfall of the Derge was brought about by the combined effort of Eritrean and Ethiopian forces, as the independence of Eritreans was also facilitated with the help of Ethiopian forces. This shows that the fate of the two peoples are tied together, and that is what we all have to have in mind.

            Finally, I find it difficult to understand when you say that “human trafficking networks which originate from Tigray”, because from what I read, the network started from Sudan and even from within Eritrea and went all the way to the Sinai, and refugee camps in Tigray were the safest places for Eritreans.

            P.S. About Eskista, I am not good at either.

          • Mahmud Saleh

            Salam Horizon;
            Well said, and I understand that there will always be pushes and pulls depending on the tone of debaters. When we feel offended it’s only human that we tend to push back. You stated the core issue well and I feel my comment has been received positively. Usually, few vocal commenters deviate the discussion off target. If we, as citizens, don’t behave like politicians, I think we can contribute to the wellness of the relationship of both peoples. So, I agree with you, the rest like the traffickers networks is an issue of complimenting each other’s information; I know many of the Eritreans caught in these networks depart from the Tigray region, well, then it’s the duty of the Ethiopian government to ensure the safety of all residents of its territory. These criminals are operating allover the region, I mentioned it because I was talking about Eritreans in Ethiopia.

          • saay7

            Selamat Horizon:

            I must challenge you, sir, when you say that the number of Eritreans on this site who refer to Ethiopia as the enemy are “many.” Not so. I would say a few or nearly none. They are far fewer than those who are effectively the PR department of the Ethiopian government.

            Beyond that the “enemy” language (“Tselae”) is a remanent from the 30-year revolution and the 2-year border. As you know, objective of all military leaders is dehumanize those they are shooting at and the way they do it is by referring to it as “enemy.” I suspect there are also more Ethiopians who call Eritrean enemy than those who call Sudan “enemy”: it is a left-over from the war.

            So, since your promise is wrong (that we consider Ethiopia an enemy state), you conclusions are wrong. Even the pro-PFDJ websites don’t call Ethiopia an enemy state. They call it an enemy-occupied friendly state.

            Saay

          • haileTG

            Hi saay,

            Stay where you are sir, cross examination continues…

            1) Serray hasn’t been seen for a long while, he must have gone to Ethiopia 🙂

            2) By virtue of language, culture and proximity, Eritreans in the highland regions of Eritrea traversed the Ethio-Eritrea border for centuries. The same with the Sudanese border for the lowland. There is an opinion that says highland Eritreans who are particularly agains Arab and middlestern influence or lowland Eritreans against Ethiopian influence, shouldn’t see red with every normal interaction and consider it sabotage of the other.

            A typical highland Eritrean would find way better option to run to Ethiopia than to Sudan (as they do) because of the language and other liniage factors. The same may be true for those heading east for the Sudan. Ethiopia’s treatment of Eritreans, compared to the brutality and Savagery of Rashaida, Boudini, Libyans, Egyptians and Sudanese is much better. It is Ethiopia that assisted the work of Dr Alganesh in issuing Laissez-Passer to those Eritreans rescued from Boudini. The wife of the late Wedi Ali was also facilitated by Ethi embassy in the Sudan. Refugee documentation and enroute assistance is better in Ethiopia than other middle eastern countries that consider th habesha as animals.

            The political failure in Eritreans capacity can’t be outsourced. Even COI and other initiatives are greatly assisted by cooperation of Ethiopia. An Ethiopia hostile factional politics is within the pererogative of each faction and the level of its aspiration to facilitate its factional interest on the back of others. However, when dealing with such deep historic links as Ethiopia and Sudan, I would urge care because the nation would be quickly fall into segrigated interest groups.

            Regards

          • saay7

            Selamat Haile TG:

            1) I think Serray told us he goes to Eritrea often… or maybe he just decided this forum is too hostile towards YG and he is showing solidarity by staying away. (Mentioning YG simply to get Serray back as that has always been a sure-fire invite.)

            2. Nah, nah, nah, nah: you are doing it: you are conflating Ethiopia with the Ethiopian government. But nice try. I can say “the fraternal people of Sudan” and still say that the Sudanese government is odious–and I don’t think that endangers the lowland Eritrea – Sudan relationship. So me having a skeptical attitude towards the Ethiopian government has nothing to do with my attitude towards Ethiopia and Ethiopians. Otherwise, using your definition, the Ethiopian opposition must have some animus towards Ethiopia?

            Why is the political failure of Eritrean opposition an all-or-nothing? Can one look objectively at Ethiopian government’s role and say they are pursuing it all wrong OR must we all wait until some future Ethiopian government official says it?

            saay

          • abrham

            ‘Like the gov of Sudan the Ethiopian gov with all its ill wishes allow your country men go to school and unlike the Sudanese the Ethiopians are bragging too much.’ SAAy

          • Estifanos

            Saay,
            Looking objectively at Ethiopian
            government’s role to the
            political failure of Eritrean opposition is what we need. But, making blanket
            statements without supporting evidence is irresponsible. I was expecting some thoughtful
            answers to those great questions from Haile The Great. Not FB reference.

          • Fetima Dechasa

            Hello Estifanos,

            You said, “Looking objectively at Ethiopian government’s role to the
            political failure of Eritrean opposition is what we need.”

            Can you please explain to me as to how and why the burden of Eritrea’s opposition party success fall on Ethiopia in the first place? What role has Ethiopia played in Eritrea’s opposition? Are your other neighboring countries such as Sudan and Djibouti responsible also?

            Thanks in advance.

          • Estifanos

            Fetima,

            your first questions assumes that I believe ‘the burden of Eritrea’s opposition party success fall on Ethiopia’ … NO I don’t believe that..

            What role has Ethiopia played in Eritrea’s opposition? I don’t know. I’m hoping to get some answers from Saay.

            Are your other neighboring countries such as Sudan and Djibouti responsible also? I don’t know

            now, my turn to ask the question :
            what motivates your participation at this forum?

          • Fetima Dechasa

            Estifanos,

            No particular motive other than defending my beloved country and people when in fact they are brought up. Other than that, I have no say in Eritrean affairs as I have limited knowledge of it.

          • saay7

            Selamat Estifanos:

            That’s fair criticism. So let me try a longer answer:

            1. The ideologues behind the EPRDF are the TPLF. And the TPLF has a “vanguard organization” view towards the “Eritrean question.” So, when it comes to Eritrea, right now, the Ethiopian position is the TPLF position.

            2. The TPLF ideologues have made their position well known throughout. You can go and read the late Prime Minister’s interview with Paul Henze in 1990 down to Merkeb Negash in 2014.

            3. This results in them proscribing medicine that is supposed to heal our alleged superiority complex, our artificiality and our chauvinism. Their idea is to configure Eritrea on ethnic federations. Consequently:

            (a) they have emboldened and legitimized every fringe group
            (b) they regularly sabotage and interfere in the alliance by picking sides, by convening, canceling meetings, and by pressuring them to elect X over Y.

            Anybody who says this is not going on hasn’t read the many whistle-blower reports that come out from disgruntled Eritreans. (Of course, always from OUTSIDE Ethiopia.)

            All of these, of course, advance Ethiopia’s interest because all the Ethiopian government is interested in is networking with any future post-Isaias Eritrean politician so that they remain within its sphere of influence. But, in the mean time, the groups are hobbled because they don’t have to do much to earn the support of the Eritrean people and their livelihood doesn’t depend on the support of the Eritrean people. They are not exactly, with some exceptions, member-supported groups.

            This takes me to Frezghi Mesmer’s point: an Eritrean opposition that had to depend for its sustenance on the Eritrean people would have lived or died on the basis of the Eritrean people’s support. When you have groups who are simply on life support from the Ethiopian government, they are neither alive, nor dead.

            saay

          • Sarah

            Greetings Saay and Estifanos,

            One this that is never missing when discussing issues of opposition is ‘Ethiopia’. I think it makes us look self-righteous.

            The opposition-naturally they need some support, logistic,moral, political etc. Did we, the people,
            stand behind them to support and supply them with things so that they thrive and get stronger and do their jobs? NO we did not! In fact, we turned our backs on them. We kept picking on their weaknesses and mistakes. So how do we expect them to survive?

            As for Ethiopia, whether we like it or not it is our neighbor; and it will always be. We have to learn to deal with it without letting our guards down. Ethiopians, EPRDF, TPLF or otherwise will always put their personal (Party-wise) and/or national interest first. So should we! We cannot
            label anyone who goes there or consults with or gets support from Ethiopians as ‘weak or tractor’. I am sure you will say ‘We did not say that.’ but you always insinuate it. We need wisdom in dealing with Ethiopia. We cannot deny that naturally Ethiopians are better politicians than us, as they have been engaging in ‘proper’ or mainstream politics longer than us. But we are smart; we can always
            be one step ahead.

            All we need is first to put our mirror in the right place and position –right in front of us!

            Saay, I would expect you to engage in the mainstream Eritrean politics. I am sure your contribution would make a difference. Our opposition camp is struggling and is in a slippery slope kind of situation. Your experience and wisdom on the ground would mean a lot to all Eritreans. Right now, wise and experienced Eritreans like you should work full-time to make things right.

            Finally, if we cannot be its life line, opposition camp will not only be in a comma, it will definitely die.

          • Amanuel Hidrat

            Dear Sara,
            I made similar call to him few years ago. But he turned it down by saying I know my limits. Since your approach is more persuasive than mine, we shall see how Saay responds to you. I would like him to start a diplomatic tour to understand the Eritrean politics on the ground where our political organizations are located. Criticism without engaging is not productive at all.
            Hawki,
            Amanuel Hidrat

          • Sarah Ogbay

            Selam Amanuel hawey,
            I hope Saay has changed his mind since you asked him. But I am not going to spare you, Amanuel hawey. Although I don’t write much, I do am an avid reader of Awate.com starting from when I was in Asmara. I always know awate team along with the great commentators with great ideas can do a lot to change the tide and lead us by example. The ideas, I read always give me hope; the kind of hope that at this desperate times encourages one to keep fighting.
            Along with my other half , I love what you write and the way you present idea and argue. I am sure many, many other find your writings sound. Why don’t you drop everything for a few months and arm in arm with Saay and some others like you go around and do something?

          • Amanuel Hidrat

            Dear Dr. Sara,

            I appreciate the trust you put on us – saay, myself, and others who are active in this website. Currently I am actively working with the EFND, an Ad hoc committee, working to facilitate a platform for dialogue to the political organizations, civic organizations, independent academicians, religious leaders, in search of a broad common strategy against the Issayas regime. I will get your phone to call you to discuss on the subject in detail. I have tried to reach you indirectly. Your input for the current struggle is indispensable. I will talk to you.

            regards,
            Amanuel Hidrat

          • Hope

            I wish ,Dr Sara , that every Eritrean Intellectial has the clean attitude,perception and approach that you have and all our problems could have been a history.
            There are lots of corrupted politics that you might not be aware of.
            You would be shocked if you found out about the animosity those people have among themselves /each other and even worse,towards and against the only sensible Party,the EPDP.

          • Sarah Ogbay

            Dear Hope,
            I just am a person desperate for peace for my people and an opportunity to grow old in my own land.
            I might not have the whole picture of what the opposition politics is (if we decide to call it politics), but I do have some understanding of what is going on and what is not.
            One thing though, against which scale of ‘sensibility’ did you weigh EPDP? Please do not get me started on EPDP, as at the moment I would like to focus on and hope for things that can be righted.

          • Amanuel Hidrat

            Dear Dr. Sarah,

            I appreciate the trust you put on us – saay, myself, and others who are active in this website. Currently I am actively working with the EFND, an Ad hoc committee, working to facilitate a platform for dialogue to the political organizations, civic organizations, independent academicians, religious leaders, in search of a broad common strategy against the Issayas regime. I will get your phone to call you to discuss on the subject in detail. I have tried to reach you indirectly. Your input for the current struggle is indispensable. I will talk to you.

            regards,
            Amanuel Hidrat

          • saay7

            Selamat Dotoressa Sarah:

            First, I can’t tell you how much I appreciate your presence here at awate. And it is always brings me joy to get confirmation that awate is read in Eritrea. Having said that, I do not think you will like what I will say next:)

            One of our bigger failings (all Eritreans, not just we in the opposition) is that we forget to learn from the lessons of other countries and/or refer to best practices. As a result, we are always re-re-re inventing the wheel. I don’t know, it might be the We Are Special subliminal message that seeped through? Here’s what I mean by that:

            1. When all is said and done, we are Diaspora Eritreans. We are people who, some of us, live very far (physically) from our people. So, at the very least, don’t we need to reference what other Diaspora communities were able to do and not do? And/or what other African governments have done to leverage the Diaspora communities?

            2. There is a piece entitled “African diasporas, development and the politics of context” which appear in Third World Quarterly in 2012. It talks about many models and relevant to us:

            a. The Eritrean government basically followed the Chinese model. That is to say it told the people we will look the other way when you want to hold a different passport, but you are our citizen. China is the largest recipient of Diaspora remittances and they were instrumental in its transformation to a knowledge-based economy. What the Eritrean government offers the Eritrean Diaspora is enfranchisement-without-votes: pay taxes, come home, buy a villa, pay local rates. In exchange shut the hell up about civil liberties and human rights. That’s the Chinese model.

            b. The Zimbabwe government essentially exiled 1/3 of its working age people. No matter how much they hate Mugabe, they will send remittances back home. And, ironically, it is that which has allowed Mugabe to stay in power after everyone predicted his government will fall.

            c. There is the rare Rwanda model where the Diaspora waged a revolution, overthrew the government, and is in power now.

            d. Then there is the rest-of-Africa model, like that of Kenya, where the Diaspora (largely from one ethnic group) has a destructive role in national elections, as happened in 2007.

            So, my dear Dr. Sarah, where do we fit in all of this? Where are our strategists who have thought any of this through? All we have had is build-demolish-rebuild in the hope that somehow, someway, we will stumble into the right strategy. How will Amanuel Hidrat and I traveling around and holding seminars make any difference, to anyone?

            Finally, Dottoressa, when I say I know my limits and I should stick to what I am good it, it is also my very polite way of saying that many of those aiming to be our politicians have no business in it, they are no good at it. The problem with politics, unlike other professions (say, a doctor) is that there are no barriers to entry. Here’s what makes for a great politician:

            a. Great networking/organizational skills;
            b. Great empathy and affection for all our people (not just contempt for the regime);
            c. Great communication skills, preferably in at least 3 of Eritrea’s languages;
            d. Very well informed about everything that affects Eritrea and Eritreans (in 2015, not 1972)
            e. Stamina and dedication: doesn’t abandon the post at the first discouraging sign
            f. Willing to admit and learn from mistakes.
            g. Great leadership/shepherding skills

            Close your eyes and tell me that if Isaias was resigning tomorrow and you were asked to nominate a name, whom would you? If the PFDJ were to implode and you were nominating an organization, which one would you?

            Exactly.

            saay

          • Sarah Ogbay

            Selam Saay7 hawey,

            Rest assured that Awate.com is read by many back home.

            I do understand where you are coming from and what you exactly mean. My response to your response is the following.

            1. You are right we have been told time and again that we Eritreans
            are related to the ‘superman’. This has led to us being frustrated especially
            when we learn more about the Ghedi era and the mistakes that were made and the crimes that were committed. We seem to be confused not knowing which way is the right way. Our youth have been deliberately weakened in every sense of what makes a brave person. We have been robbed of so much.
            Now we look like a society that has lost its compass. Most Eritreans are
            disillusioned. Many do not understand what exactly ‘natsnet’ means. A friend in
            Asmara recently sadly said, ‘ezi entedea koynu natsnet, megzaeti ayneberen
            malet’yu’.

            Where does the diaspora fit in the present reality or what does is expected from it? Well for one thing, those who left Eritrea before and few years after 1991, are still stronger with strong national feeling. I don’t mean the love of ‘EPLF or PFDJ’ but Eritrea as a country and Eritreans. So I believe
            it is up to ‘us’ to right what PFDJ messed up when it comes to our social
            values.

            The diaspora cannot say it is not up to us because we are not living it. To me diaspora is morally obliged to make the first move to protect what is rightfully ours –our people! Yes as you said we can learn from other diaspora communities our situation is also unique in the sense that the country
            is being emptied in all sense of the word. Zimbabwe and Rwanda had race and
            ethnic issues. They both had countries that supported them.

            Therefore, we should sit, talk and decide what is good for us. As the title of this article indicated, we need an umbrella that is strong, one that is not porous. If we have that, most of those who are referred to as ‘silent majority’ or the ‘supporters’ will have a shelter they can trust and will join forces with the rest in quest of change.

            You, Amanuel and others with your caliber can contribute by influencing
            and reminding the different groups of the risk of being arrogant, of not having
            priorities right, of not making the Eritrean people at the heart of the cause,
            of allowing this stalemate go on with no end in sight, of eroding the hope of
            our people. You can DEMAND unity of cause and priorities.

            Everyone has limits but we also have capacities; we can do what we can, can’t we? I think we should focus and depend on what we can do.

            All the qualities of a good politician you have listed, you fulfill most of them as far as I know you from this website.

            I would not choose any of the present organisations because they are ones that were created by arrogant and selfish leaders who would do anything to spite each other. I have not seen a vibrant and active organisation so far. But when things look right they will come forward to be counted.

          • Sarah Ogbay

            To wrap up.

            It is up to us, the diaspora, to challenge these organisations
            (after all they were created by diaspora)- their survival should depend on us. Theyshould be in or out in this fight for democracy and peace. I feel like we cannot run away from this responsibility.

          • Eyob Medhane

            Sal,

            Well, I was shutting up, and listening to you laying on my couch confessing. How could I resist that? 🙂 You said “… One of our bigger failings (all Eritreans, not just we in the opposition) is that we forget to learn from the lessons of other countries and/or refer to best practices. As a result, we are always re-re-re inventing the wheel. I don’t know, it might be the “We Are Special” subliminal message that sipped through? (Shut up, Eyob:)…”

            Well the first stage of solving a problem is admitting that there is one. After a long, long, long sessions, I guess we are in a break through. As Sienfield would have said, “…I think we have some thing here… 🙂

          • saay7

            Eyobai:

            But the exceptionalism was not cause by Ghedli but by years of Abesha programming of “we are the only country which has not been colonized!” 🙂

            saay

          • Eyob Medhane

            Sal,

            Ha! See the Habesha pride is actually grounded based on ACTUAL events…Never been colonized, (check) (If you count the five years stay of Italy in Ethiopia, then you’ll be forced to declare France a former colony of Germany, because Germany also stayed in France, actually more than five years, during WWII) ‘Really are not black’, never been said 🙂 Our African brothers, who decided to headquarter their Unity office in a country of Real black people 🙂 Not to mention many of them adopting the colors of Ethiopian flag, as their own (check) … Ha! Take that…… 🙂

          • saay7

            Well played, Eyob and welcome back.

            See, you forced my hand and I had to find this “enegnih tiQuroch abed” 🙂

            Or

            “I am Abesha: you are Negro. I don’t want my daughter dating Negro like you.”

            Zing!

            saay

            http://youtu.be/VRb1MagZRZA

          • haileTG

            Dear saay,

            1) If after all these provocations, Serray still doesn’t come back, well y’ftahala ember nay tiEna aymeslenen:-)

            2) All things that are being said to have been done or not done by “Ethiopia” are really about Ethiopian gov. Isn’t it? It is the standing testimony of ALL refugees that the ONLY problem that they have in Ethiopia is the length of life in the camps. I have material evidence by way of audio, video and written documents of such statements from the refugees themselves. Sudan has been the scene of the worst forms of treatment of refugees. Mothers hide their kids without education to avoid kidnap. The security and welfare provisions in Ethiopia couldn’t have been materialized without the active leadership of the Ethiopian gov. Criticizing the Ethiopian gov for not sitting down with a bunch of disorganized opposition who can’t even sit with one another is really an over kill dear saay. The reason they can’t sit together being their retarted politiking of religion, region, jebha/shaebia and every other BS. Common saay, didn’t you hear the others out of Ethio influence calling for regional separation in paltalks and other such sewer politics? Ethiopia is extending more support in HR and business (Eri regional traders use Ethiopian banking services’ preferential treatment) and less political support. The opposition have been (let me be blunt) useless of their own accord. If you are calling Ethio gov into question, please be factual and objective. Yes, everything being done has thr Ethio gov,s support and the people-people initiative is mostly promoted with its support and facilitation.

            I really wish that you make a well-founded case on this Ethio gov role, because when you want to run the Ethio-hostile arguments, people would find it hard to differentiate from the tired and defeated argument by the regime (not that I think so). It is defeated because facts on the ground are attesting to it.

            cheers

          • saay7

            Selamat TG:

            I hear you loud and clear when you say “I really wish that you make a well-founded case on this Ethio gov role, because when you want to run the Ethio-hostile arguments [you mean ethic-gov-skeptical arguments], people would find it hard to differentiate from the tired and defeated argument by the regime…”

            Time permitting, I will and it will be well-founded and even persuasive. No, no, not to the Eritrean amen corner, but to the TPLF itself 🙂 If you want to know how absurd the TPLF Amen Corner are, consider this: Nitricc criticizes the PFDJ more often than they criticize the TPLF.

            saay

          • Hope

            Here I am,the Mr Tobloklok:
            SAAY:
            Why are you afraid to add the simple Fact that it has been Ethiopia that has created confusion,division,polarization,etc-of Eritreans and their Oppositions-based on Ethnic,Religion and Region based politics?
            Isn’t it the Official Policy of Ethiopia to creak a weak Eritrea,weak and divided Eritreans,weak economy,weak military,weak Security?
            I do NOT believe that Haile TG is naive or unaware of all these but there should be a reason for his deliberate naivity and shyness.

          • Mahmud Saleh

            Ato HTG
            ብዙሕ ኣይክርብሽን/ጠብሎቕሎቕ ኣይከብዝሕን፡ It’s a great discussion of the two greats. Just a small correction:
            During the war of liberation Eritreans sought refuge in the Sudan and other Middle Eastern countries simply because going to Ethiopia would not be a solution. They would probably be forced to fight their brothers through the Durg bhierawi wtdrna, and also the world was totally different; globalization and fast movements of world population across international borders and time zones was not that much practiced. Today, it’s a fact that most young people are going to Ethiopia to make it a transit point. Remember, these are mostly highland Eritreans who could easily diffuse to the culture across the border just as residents of Sahel or Barka would have diffused in Kassala, Sudan. So, here I agree with you.
            What I want to correct is the fact that those savage outlaws you mentioned don’t represent the governments and the peoples of those countries. Just ask your self, when have those tribes become savage? When Eritrean and Ethiopian criminals started selling their own people to them. Once that network is in place, all manifestation of humanity give way to cruel mindset of profiting at the expense of the young, women and children. These peoples and countries are entities which gave WeleWel and Ib.SulTan, and what have you, home and shelter, they supported our cause, they gave our young people scholarship; many families have come to the west through them, and some have made these countries their home, both Muslims and Christians. So, it’s essential to separate the countries and those outlaws, and some racists among them. The phenomena of Rashaida and Bedouin are at the end of the food chain; the feeders are always local criminals selling out their own people. They depart from cities like Asmara and keren, and from Ethiopian cities playing with the life of our people.
            PS: read it with the understanding that PFDJ does shoulder the responsibility of ensuring Eritreans’ lives; that it remains the root cause of the outpouring of our young people. There is no question that the overall driving reason is the hopelessness caused by devastating policies.

          • haileTG

            Hey Mahmuday,

            Please intervene, our cases wouldn’t be complete without your thoughts on it 🙂

            On the pre-independence migration route, I look at it from where I was located, Asmara and you also done from your side behind the EPLF side. There had indeed been mass migration to Sudan, as well as the mainland Ethiopia. The people deported and properties confiscated were actually Eritreans who moved to mainland Ethiopia (at the time). The number of Eritreans in Ethiopia was thus large. In my own account, after Massawa was taken by the EPLF, the Ethiopian Airlines ticket office in Asmara was overwhelmed and lines were as far as around Cathedral area (some lining up from small hours in the morning).

            The mass migration to Sudan was also considerably from lowland (not exclusively) and the point of repartriation that SJG raised in connection to such refugees in the Sudan also underlines the factual bases I am coming from. So, I think we both agree thre exist historical trends and reasons that give rise to such pattern of population movements.

            The role of gov in Africa has alot to do with policies and actions, dear Mahmuday. Top separate the people from the gov would assumes that the society in question has reached a level of citizen participation and leadership on par with the oldest democracies. Without the will of the Ethiopian gov, the situation could easily get worse for many of our country men and women, along their children seeking refuge there. I agree that the leaderships in those countries have a hand in turning blind eye or even getting involved in the inhumane treatment. But, let’s remember the people shot dead by Egyptian security, the Eritrean mother shot dead infront of her 8 and 4 year old children by Egyptian troops, the 155 Eritreans locked in containers in no man’s land by Egypt security forces (interviewed by assenna), the rapes, kidnap and torture in the Sudan, the maltreatment in Libya. Would you say that is to do with the people or the gov of those places. And the fact that Eritreans are accorded personal safety in Ethiopia until they decide to leave to the Sudan where the use smugglers to cross the desert, has indeed has the role of the Ethio gov in it.

            Eritrean opposition has deep and intractable problems, PFDJ ensured the population (and mostly the youth) would be stripped of education and development opportunities. Every year about 22,000 join Sawa and about 4500 end up graduating from higher ed. What happens to the other 18000 or just about? Saay is, in my view, expressing distaste of Ethiopian aspects and roles, but my point is that, in the interest of the hundreds of thousands of Eritrean who are in Ethiopia and in the interest of the interests of Eritrea as a nation, it may be important to underline that his views are representative of a small faction in the opposition and could confuse more those hgdefites who are hoplessly reduced to nut cases by the regime and its medonqor propoganda.

            Regards

          • Hope

            Haile,
            Nice try.
            No objection to wat you said…from “Common Sense” point of view and I do not believe SAAY will deny those “facts”….and eventhough it is mainly for PR and Diplomatic Gimmick,we appreciate it…as I am NOT that much “Hypocrit” NOT to appreciate it,or at least NOT to acknowledge it.
            If Ethiopia has that kind of “Serious Humanity”,it should work for a lasting peace….and abide by International Norms,Judgements and Rules
            Setting up for the worst situation,then taking advantage of that situation is the issue of concern.,…..the Classic Western Intelleigence Style Business.
            “They create conflicts,confusion and hegemony,but then they try to act like peace makers but ONLY to take advantage of the same Conflict and hegemony they create”.
            Courtesy of President Isias Aferwerki .
            N.B./Disclaimer:
            I understand that the same PIA has contributed partly to that ‘ hegemony”.
            Finally,here is my final but a centuary old new question to you that deserves your attention:
            Why can’t you address the dangerous Policy of “No War,No Peace” and continous nonstop effort to tighten Sanctions and to create new ones with its deadly consequences to Eritrea and Eritreans by the same Ethiopain Government you are “adoring”…??

          • Amanuel Hidrat

            Selam Hailat

            “The political failure in Eritreans capacity can’t be outsourced”. Hailat, how very true it is!! Half of our oppositions are functioning outside of Ethiopia. Nothing is different to their political ailment from those who are in Ethiopia. The problem is always ourselves, not external forces. But it is true, that we always seek a refugee in “scapegoating to our failure”. Until we accept our failures, we will not get any possible cure to our political ailment. I wish Saay could participate in their conferences ( to get first hand experience than judgement from second hand) to extract himself from his skepticism and make factual argument about our opposition camp. I tell you, that your argument is consistent and factual. Keep it please, eventually reality is reality and we will come to term at one point no matter how we drag ourselves from recognizing our incompetency and our failures.

            Amanuel Hidrat

          • haileTG

            Selamat Berhe Y,

            It is fair to say that the Ethio-Eritrea r/ship issue has been going on ad nauseam, garbed in all sorts of theories and generalizations. The point is however, little was discussed regarding the driving political and strategic calculations of such debates. I see the the PFDJ (IA) stance against Ethiopia is one based on politico-military considerations (in relation to the EPRDF specifically). But, IA’s group isn’t the only faction in the Eritrean political landscape that draws into “Ethiopia-hostile” political gambit. The question is rather “who else is there?” and “under what theoretical objectives and assumptions are doing so?”.

            If you flip the coin and consider the situation from the other side (Ethiopia), the driver political calculations (and how they are presented) are as diverse as it is on our side. Therefore, in my opinion, the solution of this riddle doesn’t lie in its utilitarian aspect (i.e. econonomic, trade and transport…) harmonization. Rather, we need to look and (have the caurage to) ask what the driving politico-historic and social objectives are in advancing a particular point of argumentation from whomsoever and yes, on both sides.

            We know that Ethiopians who disregard Eritrean sovereignty and have stated goals to challenge it are being supported by IA’s faction. We also know that the EPRDF has no claim on such and other Assab related conspiracy theories because it did actually agreed and gave the green light during the EEBC proceedings, for the eastern sector (Assab side) to be finalized and demarcated. IA was the one who refused for, Assab included, eastern flank demarcation.

            Since Eritrea’s situation is beyond return now and naturally, many are counting their chickens, I think the utilitarian component of this argument can’t be engaged in good faith.

            Finally, the writing is on the wall, to internal and external saboteurs, Eritrea and Eritreans may be down for now, BUT no one will get their agenda facilitated on ill premised agenda, and with out bitter consequences.

            Regards

          • Berhe Y.

            I commented earlier, but it appears that it is not posted.

            I think I need to dig dipper in our collective history to actually show that we have a lot in common than our differences. And actually show that if Eritreans objective was only to take advantage of Ethiopia.

            I am pressed for time so I will respond briefly to some of the comments made, Ethiopians deported from Eritrea, Ethiopians properties confiscated by Eritrea and Issue of compensation.

            Ethiopians Deported from Eritrea
            ——————————————

            First I was not in Eritrea when Eritrea got it’s indendence or during the war. So whatever information that I have is heresy, if it’s in correct please by all means provide correction.

            So I think it’s important to classify the events in two time period

            Right after the fall of the Derg (1991)

            I think there are two types of Ethiopians in Eritrea at the time. Civilians and Military

            Civilian population

            As far as I know, I don’t think any Civilian Ethiopians were deported from Eritrea. I know firsthand quite a few who use to live there and they continue to live even after the independence. If some civilians that left out of their own free will or they were deported, I do NOT know. But as far as I know, deportation of civilians didn’t happen, in 1991.

            Military Personnel (1991)

            If you are not familiar, let me give you a brief description. I don’t know the exact numbers but the number of military personel were quite a lot. There were close to 20,000 PoW only before the fall of the Derg, if I can guess, the number is close to 100 K or even more. Those military lives in the military camps and they were part of the Ethiopian Airforce, Ethiopian Marine, Ethiopian Ground forces, basically I think they were called Ethiopian 4th division. Now when they Derg fall happened, I think most of them if NOT all went to Ethiopia and where they come from.

            To my knowledge, there was NO revenge, no mass killing, no torture, but I think they were given even water and food along the way. And they left without harming the civilians, or holding them hostage. Basically the WAR was over and they went to their countries.

            There are some Eritrean women who wed and have children from them. If I heard is correct, I think most of them decided to go back with their husbands, were they deported I don’t think so. In my opinion this made perfect sense, because since the Ethiopian military establishment was NO longer existed, I do NOT think they had any business in Eritrea.

            If for example, some asked asylum and wanted to stay and lead civilian lives, I don’t know. But if that happened, in my opinion the Eritrean government should have granted them, unless there was some sort of security risk.

            Deportation after the 1998 war (civilians)

            I know there are a lot of Ethiopians deported after 1991, I don’t know the exact number but the Red Cross have the account. Even in 2001 when the war was over, there were some that got deported. I know this because I know personally some who got deported, and some were leaving in their own because they do NOT feel it was safe for them to stay. In one of the seminars given Yemane Ghebreab that I attended during 1999 ( I think), he was asked why are the “Ethiopians” continue to live/work in Eritrea whereas a lot of our people are being deported. His answer was (call it political) and he said something like “we do not have war with the Ethiopian people, and we do NOT want to leave bitterness and animosity for the next generation etc..etc”. I can tell you for sure though, there was a pressure from the public to retaliate.

            What’s to happen in the future, I think the future Eritrean government would apologize and compensate those that got harmed due to this decision.

            Ethiopian Properties Confiscated at Assab

            I think this issue is addressed as Saay said in the court and I agree with the outcome.

            If you want a political answer

            1) Ethiopia abandoned the port, Eritrea never asked Ethiopia to leave

            2) If it was up to me, I would have done the following.

            a. Ask Ethiopia to come and collect their properties

            b. Ask those shippers (if outside entities) to come and collect, with reasonable time frame

            c. Charge rental/storage Fee for daily use (extended use) and give them deadline where they can make the claim.

            3) I don’t know what actions the Eritrean government took.

            There is an ironic story that really happened. When the derg fell, there were Ethiopian military and other hardware at the port of Assab. The president of Eritrea IA ordered that the goods be send to Ethiopia. Now think about it, the EPRDF government have no knowledge of these goods, they can’t really “claim” that it belongs to them. Assab is an Eritrean territory and as long as it’s in Eritrea, I think the Eritrean government have claims like all other that in inherited from the Derg when it left. This caused misunderstanding and rebellion by the general who was in charge of Assab and liberation, General Bitweded Abreha, and he was detained by IA and he is still detained today.

            Eritrean Pension Payments and other compensations
            —————————————————————-
            Abinet, let me give you this example. I hope this is not going to use against those Eritreans. There were a number of Eritreans who resided in Ethiopian and worked in Ethiopia and retired. They were collecting their pensions like any other Ethiopian citizen. Now like all other Eritreans they probably voted during the referendum. Some stayed in Ethiopia and some left the country (say before the war) they continue to receive their pension. Let’s make something clear here, a pension is an entitlement to the service one gives and to the contribution one makes. For example, there are a lot of Ethiopians/Eritreans who give service to many countries and when they retire they are entitled to their payments. Some even facilitate and transfer the money on their choice. This I think is normal practice and it needs to be honored. Some governments and institutions use this as an incentive to attract people and retain very able and qualified people.

            Those people who worked under successive Ethiopian administration, they did server to the Ethiopian government. The did not work in the condition that Eritrea will become independent and forfeit their rights. And please do remember that, the Ethiopian government were collecting TAX and using Eritrean facilities such as ports for FREE. Now, just compare how much it is costing the Ethiopian government for using the port of Djibouti and give it a consideration for this use (40 years for FREE). And how much money did the Ethiopian government collected on the lease of the Kagnew station? Not to mention all the destruction properties and human lives that were caused during the WAR.

            Now I bring this as an example and by no means the whole story, but I Eritrea/Ethiopia for that matter would have better chance of solving any differences legitimately.

          • Berhe Y.

            Small correction

            “I know there are a lot of Ethiopians deported after 1991” I want to say after 1999.

          • Hope

            Well balanced and the Truth but the TRUTH!
            But you seem to be too nice and soft.
            Btw, you agreed with me that they owe us more than $1000,000,0000,000.
            PMMZ head difficulty quantifying the damages and the compensation and said that it will take Ethiopia and the Ethiopians more than a Centuary to compensate Eritra and Ertrawiyan!
            The Juniors like Abi have no clue ,hence, do not waste your time to clarify people with deaf ears and eyes.

          • Hope

            Read as ” PMMZ had difficulty….
            Read as: Blind eyes….

          • Rodab

            iCousin Hope,
            You are a serial ‘mis-speller’. You probably use mobile devices. Those devices tend to write on our behalf. And then there is the auto correct feature which is a real blood boiler. It got lots people in trouble:-)

          • Hope

            Eng,
            I agree,and that has been my problem besides hitting the “submit” button before I review or edit my comments,besides my “Broken English”…ohh,do NOT tel Haile Berhe though…as he won’t understand your” Positive sarcasm”.

          • Abinet

            Send us the invoice with the breakdown. Make sure to include
            – 40 years of port fee
            – modernize ethiopia
            – use of Kagnew station
            – pension
            – teaching us the art of eating
            Pasta
            -other
            Send one copy to God . Since we are unable to pay you , you will get it from him.
            ” kesemay tagegnewaleh”

          • Hope

            Hodihin yalmolah deghmo “Loan” litikefil?Empty Gurra alone is NOT enough.
            Try to get back the $12 Billion that the TPLF Gangs stolen from the Ethiopian people,first.

          • Hope

            Damn it: Pls read “stolen” as “stole”..
            Eng,help here.
            Abi,
            Why don’t you some “Kumnegher” in teaching me to improve my”Spelling and Grammar”,rather than abusing your Articulate brain,please?

          • Amde

            Hope,

            One of these days you’re gonna run out of zeros.

            I would hate to be your patient and rely on your ability to differentiate between milli, micro, centi, deci… etc when prescribing dosage.

            Reminds me of a joke about George W Bush,

            Staffer: Mr. President, we just received news that 3 Brazilian soldiers were killed in an ambush.
            Bush: Oh that’s terrible.
            Bush (whispers to staffer); uhh….How many… is a Brazillion?

            Amde

          • Hope

            huhuh Mr Amde—welcome back,Bro.
            U used to be a bit sensible.But Hakki/Truth is bitter to be swallowed.Yeah,it is true that you/Ethiopia owe us more than a $trillion (if you cannot read the 12-figure amount)” of $1000,000,000,000.00(added point zero,zero–if you coud understand it better as I thought that a Third Grader could undertsnad it)).
            The good thing is that since you cannot afford it to pay us back for the next centuary as your Boss,PMMZ,RIP,said it,we will get it ” Bitsifrina”,thanks to God,Who,provided us with more than a $trillion worth of Resources,provided that the hassadat and kenna’at(jealous) and the evil people stay away from our business.

            No,no, I am not,and cannot afford it to be, a President or a Doctor,btw.GCMS has plenty of Faculties,not just Medicine,FYI!
            Plus,you do not act like a Doctor or President in such kind of an infested forum,where you have no clue as to /with whom you are dealing and that is why epople prefer to use Nicks….
            Plus: Mis mesatukha debate ghiber yenie “bad gorebet”..
            Check it out with people like Haile TG,SAAY,Ustaz/Ghadi Saleh Johar,Vet Mahmouday….,unless you don’t want to “pee” under your pants.

          • Abinet

            Hope
            I believe Saay has expertise in many fields. But he failed big time in spay/ neuter you.

          • Hope

            Shush shush,Zim Bel.
            Saiterut abiet sailikut wediet.
            Curiosity has killed the cat!

          • Abinet

            Selam Ato Berhe
            The ethiopians you didn’t see deported, I saw them in Addis. They were , young, old, men, women, including babies. They were in plastic shelters all over Addis. From Jan meda to black lion hospital . From around giorgis area to legehar. Everywhere . They were estimated to be over 100,000 .
            They were deported when ethiopia and Eritrea were at their best R/P.
            When elephants make love, the grass suffers. They were not from the army . They might be army families.

            Pension
            Pension is paid for only government employees who worked for 10 years. You can claim pension when you reach age 50 for women, 55 for men . If you don’t want to wait you can always get back your contribution which is 4% of your salary. You see pension is country specific . What is applicable in US or Kenya, doesn’t always apply in ethiopia .
            In ethiopia, if you are not a citizens , you don’t claim or contribute for pension.
            BTW , why do you claim pension if you don’t want to be an ethiopian? What is more important to you ?
            Now to the jokes
            You really want payment for 40 years of port usage? It was OURS .
            What is next? Payment for liberating us from derg? Or for civilizing us?
            Even his excellency IA the lion of Nakfa didn’t say what you said. May be we are better off with him as your president.
            Long live Isaias Afeworki !
            “YereTebew lay shenachibet” ale yagere sew.

          • Fetima Dechasa

            Dear Berhe,

            You have already stated that you are not ‘certain’ about things that occurred since you were not present during this time, however, you somehow still managed to sound conveniently biased and filled with endless entitlement.

            So far as I’m concerned, Ethiopia doesn’t owe Eritrea jack and Eritrea doesn’t owe Ethiopia jack at this moment other than resolving the boarder issues, which we all hope could be resolve soon. Moving forward, we are citizens of two sovereign nations, therefore, we need to think and act accordingly. The endless entitlement, victim mentality, and አካኪ ዘራፍ ተጋዳይ isn’t helping anyone. The truth of the matter is that you will never see the pension you are advocating for. As a matter of fact its laughable for you to even suggest this nonsense considering your government did just that to our people first. Oh I forgot, it only matter when Eritrea(ns) are at the receiving end of the short stick. Oh good old, ageless hypocrisy. Alas, common sense isn’t common to ever one. Keep dream for those pensions, perhaps one day they will fall down from the heavens above.

          • Hope

            Ms Fetima,
            You should first respond to what Berhe Yeman and PMMZ,RIP, estimated about the Material and Human damages incurred upon Eritrea amd Eritreans,during the 40-50yrs of subjugation and oppression.
            Your subjective/ reckless,inhumane,deliberate ignorance and blindness should be differentiated from FACTS…..and we neither care about your ….. akaki zerafinet…and eat it to yourself.
            As to the Economic and Political Independence of Eritrea and Eritreans,no worries about it, as the temporary hiccups are but temporary,which could have been gone by now had it not been your Govt’s reckless interference;and that is the only thing we need from you,i.e.,to stay away from Eri Business.Nothing more,NOTHING less!!!

          • Hayat Adem

            Dear Berhe Y,
            I think you are very balanced and fair, at least in intention. That is what matters, I think. The rest depends on whether you have all, or enough or nearly enough information and facts, and the right tools to process them. Of all, the intent of balancedness and fairness matter most. The rest is improvable. On the latest deportation (1998-2000), I can provide you with the following accurate facts by neutral bodies:
            —————————————
            Both Ethiopia and Eritrea used mass deportations as a weapon of war, 1998-2002.
            Ethiopia deported an estimated 75,000 people of Eritrean origin to Eritrea from June 1998- August 2000.
            Eritrea deported an estimated 70,000 people of Ethiopian origin back to Ethiopia during same period.
            The Ethiopian government is known to have forcibly expelled an estimated 75,000 people of Eritrean origin during the war. The Eritrean government forcibly expelled or took part in the voluntary repatriation of an estimated
            70,000 Ethiopians; notwithstanding persistent Eritrean government claims that
            it had no expulsion policy comparable to Ethiopia’s.

            —————————————
            Ethiopian leaders expressed their regrets and are trying to redress regardless of its pace and level of inclusiveness. PFDJ leaders never uttered a word of regret about their actions during the war, none of it, not any of it, including the unwarranted aggression they committed. People who are prominent commentators in this forum were fueling the war and you never hear them regretting it even long after it has become clear who did what and the price of those deeds. And when some some individuals try to bring the relationship of the two peoples to its normal track, they invoke non-existent worries in the name of “double-talk”. It is unstomachable for me when double-talkers accuse sensible efforts.
            ————————————
            Abi, can you please be sensitive and careful with your words not offend reasonable and innocent Eritreans who have nothing to do with whatever crime was done by the PFDJ and its supporters. This is kind of request as you seem to be easily provoked by few vulgar and brown tongued Isaiasist folks. Please keep your composure and lets use this amazing forum for positive and unifying ideas.
            Hayat

          • Berhe Y

            Dear Hayat,

            Thank you for your positive engagement and encouragement to bridge the gap. And I hope we find lasting peace where our people can live and grow together.

            On a personal note, I think the efforts of Ethiopian government in assisting Eritreans be it humanitarian and other assistance is much appreciated and duly noted.

            Not that I wanted to quote my self but below is what I posed over a month ago in AT forum discussion.

            Berhe Yeman

            P.S. Dear Ato Abay, I am sorry I didn’t replay and I only saw your message yesterday. I am glad you feel that way.

            ————–
            Eyob Medhane • a month ago

            Eyob,

            I couldn’t agree more. This looks like a “fabricated frenji” trying to divert the attention of the good people. One thing I want to say to you is, I meant to say for some time, at the moment, the Eritrean people, especially those of us Christians and habesha people are in the greatest threat of our existence. Never in our history have we faced such systematic oppression to make us extinct from our existence. In this tiring times of our need, not Egypt, no Israel, not Italy, not Lybia, not S. Arabia, not Yemen have cared and hosted us the same way at our Ethiopian brothers and sisters are doing today.

            No matter how much we think are told to believe, that Ethiopians are our enemies, it’s a true testament that “deeds speak louder than words” and their deeds speaks volume. I can say that Sudan deeds were/are the same during our armed struggle, especially for Eritrean Muslims, but today the leadership is black mailed by the dictator and it’s not doing enough to protect our people from the misery they are in. I can’t say for sure and I don’t have the statistics or numbers to prove it, but I think we have done “a little help that we can” during the great famine of 1984 when many Ethiopians /Tigray people come to Eritrea.

            My suggestion is do, what you are doing and try to avoid at all cost any intention of getting into armed conflict with the regime. It will be a matter of time, but the regime will fall and Ethiopia needs not create anything to provide the monster the excuse he needs to grip the power. I can say, there isn’t any Eritrean who buys the excuse, we are in this situation because of “boarder war” anymore. One guy gave me this excuse and I asked him, let’s assume and you are correct Ethiopia doesn’t want to boarder demarcated. So you are telling me, if Ethiopia did this for another 50 years, you expect our people to live in this “misery” for another 50 years, your only hope is the good will of your “supposed enemy”?

            Why do you let the “enemy” dictate your future and that of your people? I personally wish to see Ethiopia triumph and continue to excel and the path of progress that’s started. In the end, their success will equally influence us and help us prosper in the future. And I hope in the future, Ethiopians come and enjoy and share the wealth that we have, the same way enjoying what they have.

            Ethiopian and Eritrean Music Stars Minyeshu and Kahsay Berhe share the Stage for Peace

            http://www.ethiotube.net/video

            Berhe Yeman

            Thank you Berhe. Me reading this in Addis Ababa, it gave me a feeling that after all there are some sensible people who appreciate what we are doing for our brothers and sisters who are in this time of their greatest needs. Your appreciation is grease to a better relation that even encourages us Ethiopians to do even more to help. Rest assured, our heart goes to you and we pray for you all. Reading comments full of hate some have to Ethiopia on this site, some of us Ethiopians sometime wonder if what we deserve is insults and hate after we do what we are doing. Your comments and the comments of your likes encourage us to do even more. We also pray for the increase in number of your likes. By the way, the end of the tragedy is at the end of the corner and the light at the end of the tunnel is getting brighter by the day. You will start living the life you deserve pretty soon.

            Abay

          • Rahwa T

            Hi Berhe,

            I read many interesting statements in your comments. But you never end any of them without scratching the scares of our wounds. Here is one of them “…but I think we have done “a little help that we can” during the great famine of 1984 when many Ethiopians /Tigray people come to Eritrea.”. Tell us more about this what your organization did to the malnourished, hunger stricken people of Tigray. Who told you that denying access to Sudan via Barentu and Teseney was a little help? Please, check your facts before you send them for the public.

          • Berhe Y

            Dear Rahwa,

            Please if it appears that my comments as “scratching your wounds” please accept my sincere appology.

            There is a difference of the organization, EPLF and the Eritrean people. Even if you assume the biggest number the EPLF organization had, when it entered in Asmara (90,000 ) at best, and it’s a LOT more compared to the Eritrean populations, which was at least (3 million people).

            Even 99% of the EPLF members have nothing to do with the decision of the EPLF let alone the entire Eritrean people, but for some reason, some people here think, all the crimes attributed to the mafia regime equates to that of the Eritrean people.
            This is the reason that I wanted to write and explain so that people make the difference but it appears that I am NOT doing good job.

            I can’t tell you which organization or what government did and how much or how little. I don’t know where you were during those times, but I lived in Asmara. And I don’t know if it’s the same in other parts of Eritrea. There were many, may be in thousands people from Tigray made the long walk to Eritrea and settled where ever they can to get refuge. I don’t know what they got in return but it was common knowledge that people give / shared what they little they had.

            I can only speak and know and what my parents, neighbors, church and others did and it’s not that’s worth bragging or reminding but I mentioned it, because it reminded my what the poor souls the Eritrean people must be going through today.

      • Nitricc

        Fetima:
        I couldn’t agree more with you. Absolutely Eritreans have no business involving in Ethiopia. The Eritreans have fought for thirty years to get rid of Ethiopia and Ethiopians.
        I guess the Eritreans weren’t joking when they say Ethiopia for all and Eritrea for Eritreans. Why do the Ethiopians let Eritreans involve in their country? For one, could it mean that the Ethiopians are so incapable for doing thing on their own they needed Eritreans even in the freaking government posts. How else can you explain it?
        If I were an Ethiopian I will deport every Eritrean who is in Ethiopia and I will definitely clean up Eritrean post in the government. It is not good for the two countries. Especially for Eritreans, you want your country, you fought for country and then stick to it and work what ever your problem is in your country. You can just run to Ethiopia, you can’t have it both ways. So, what is the reason Eritreans are all over Ethiopia? I don’t want any Ethiopian in my country but why are the Ethiopians letting this happen? I guess the Ethiopians NEED Eritreans. Only explanation!

      • Guest

        Fatima,

        The problem is you guys do not have the capacity to run the country: you are good at marathon 10k and 5k, and of course singing including azmaris.

        You are talking about a 3000 years old country, and yet still cant survive without foreign aid from the Whitman. Do you know thats a huge embarrassment for many Africans including Eritreans? You should be thankfull to Eritreans whom showed you atleast you can use your hands when you eat, let alone in feilds of engineering, Banking, agriculture, health, energy, and other major sectors.

        Cheers

        • Abinet

          While your fathers were learning how to eat a leftover pasta from the Italian masters , our fathers mastered how to shoot the Italian sorry Azz without wasting a bullet.
          We are always proud of what our fathers did to our country. Eating pasta is not an achievement or something to be proud of. However, if that is all you have to show, go ahead do it.
          Tell me just one achievement in the last 23 years that you are proud of exept bringing back slavery in the 21st century.

          • Fetima Dechasa

            Selam Kim Hanna & Abinet,

            Please don’t waste your time responding to such ostentatious comments. We all know who we are therefore we must rise above the fray. These sort of comment speak highly on those who spew them than us as a people.

            Thank you both!

            PS my response to Berhe said waiting for Awate’s moderator approval then disappeared. Perhaps it will appear again tomorrow.

          • Guest95

            And you ignore all your Eritrean highland brothers did to support your effort? What about the fabled Zerai Deres’ actions against the Italians which cost his life, all in the name of honour which he shared for both Eritreans and Ethiopians. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zerai_Deres

            Why are so many, both on the Eritrean and Ethiopian side, so deluded and caught up in their national pride that they allow themselves to become blinded. My father tells me even in the first war Eritreans on the side of the Italians did a lot to help Ethiopian’s keep their freedom, there were sacrifices on Eritrean soil too.

            I don’t know what ethnic group you are from, but open your bloody eyes goddamnit.

            And let me add. Just because you kept your independence that act like every single Ethiopian was better off. You should know better than I do that the ruling Amhara class elite looked down on everyone else and kept Tigray poor, so much so though they were looking for work in Eritrea. Meanwhile, despite the occupation, the new Eritrean’s new rulers did not keep Eritrean’s quite as poor as those such as Tigray were kept. I’m just making the point that just because ‘Ethiopians’ kept their independence, not everybody was equal or even better off. So this is not a good reason to further the Eritrean Ethiopian hate, since you are kin, only divided by political affairs.

        • Kim Hanna

          Selam Guest,
          .
          Wow Mr./Ms Guest, you can’t accept good will hospitality without insults? This is the type of demented mentality very few display that is maintaining some of the hard feelings.
          .
          Imagine, you are invited for dinner. You share whatever humble food that was prepared at the dinner table. Even before you are done eating you proceed to denigrate the host.
          .
          Don’t you feel a little ashamed of yourself?
          .
          K.H

  • Abraham Hanibal

    Can you document your claim that Sebhat Nega “publicly indicated that TPLF gangs are not ready to accept independent democratic Eritrea….”?

    • Hope

      Abreham,
      You have the obligation as well to do a research and to refute whay peopl say and bring up what exactly Sebhat Nega et al- including the what Siye and gruppo along with the New “Historian” or fiction expert,Mr Ghebru Asrat have said.
      Claimng one thing but doing and cooking up something behind the scene are two different issues.
      Let me help you with your research:
      Rewind what PMMZ and Co. said and did:
      -Tigray will, and should have, a Sea Outlet by any means possible”
      -Review his Speech in the Afar State few yrs before he died-for GOOD,RIP
      -Read his book entilted:” Kalsi Ertra: Kabey Nabey”
      -Review his interview with Paul Henze in 1990/1
      -Review the AbayTigray Map and its implications…and the incorporation of the large Eritrean chunk of Eri Land,including Bada area
      -Review the implication of open aggression and occupation of Adi Murug in 1997
      -Review what exactly Dr Alemu Tekeda ,the Ethiopian UN Ambassador declared to the UN in 2000 about Aseb.
      -Review also what Mr HiruyTedla Bairu said to PIA through a personal letter in 2000 based on the classified info he got from Europe/Sweden…
      -Review the implication of the “Hectic Chinese Assistaed Rail Way/Road Consturction attempt to Aseb in 2000
      -Review the implication of the 7-day-Humiliating War at Aseb Front by Ethiopia while the delegation of both Caountires were in a meeting in Algiers but suspended by Mr Seyoum Mesfin ,who was recalled back to his Country with the believe that Aseb was in the verge of collapse/being caputred by Ethiopians…
      do you need more?
      Consult the TPLF Gang itself and they will tell you—-if you are one of their “Confidentes”.

      • Hope

        Kindly please read:
        “Whay peopl”as ” what people …say”
        ” believe as” belief “

  • Abraham Hanibal

    እንሆ ሜዳ፥ እንሆ ፈረስ!!
    A meaningful change is loooong overdue in Eritrea. Eritreans in the diaspora have been waiting, for decades, for an effective and robust umbrella organization through which they could channel their contribution for democratic change. Whereas Eritreans inside the country have been waiting long decades to be emboldened and organized to stand up against PFDJ-terror. I express my best wishes for this comming meeting of ENCDC, and hope that they come out with tangible course of action on how to wage the stuggle against the dictators.
    The burden of bringing democracy and rule of law in Eritrea should not be left to a few Eritreans. All of us have to join hands and contribute by whatever is appropriate for us to strengthen, and ultimately win the struggle against the PFDJ and their collaborators.

    • Hope

      Are you a “New Born”?

      • Abraham Hanibal

        Who knows may be I’ve seen the sun before you; but anyway I’m old enough to have seen a country and People full of enthusiasm and hope be turned into slaves in their own country, live in desperation, and fleeying their promised land. All these by the fatal policies of your masters dictators Isayas and his PFDJ cronies and, of course, your likes. You are going to go down in history as the worst enemies of the Eritrean People. One can fight in unison to counter external powers; however, it is much difficult if the problem is from within, creating discord, and dismantling the People from within like a cancer. That is more difficult to root out. But never miscalculate, there is time for every thing. In the same spirit the Eritreans rid themselves of Haile Selasie and the Dergue, they will also one day free themselves out of their internal menace.

  • Dear Hailemariam,

    Thank you for the comment.

    The editorial skipped mentioning the damaging squabbles because there is nothing new anyone can learn from it. The last two or three years were wasted on that. Therefore, valuable time should not be wasted discussing the same tired issues at the expense of meaningful planning and discussions. Repeating the dramas will only poison the atmosphere. But we urge you all to refrain from going into byzantine arguments about it.

    As you indicated, we mentioned the crippled nature of the ENCDC’s beginning and the subsequent polarization since we did not see value in detailing what was repeated ad-nauseum in public forums. But it doesn’t mean we do not know it, we just did not see the benefit of going through it all to finally arrive at a conclusion that we all failed.

    Have a nice trip and we wish you luck.

  • Tesfabirhan WR

    Dear AT,

    Thank you for your timely and enforcing editorial. I wish success for such meetings.

    I have few words though,

    1.Ok, let the meeting be on emergency but let not their outcome be in hurry. Wisdom is needed in today’s Eritrean politics. I hope nagging is no more in existence right from now and then after.

    2. What we need is not un umbrella but a BOAT, a foundation, that carries all political paradox and still able to carry on. Designing the ship that carries all political arenas is a must for a successful discourses.

    Again, wishing a succesful conference to ENDC.

    hawkum
    tes

  • T..T.

    I received private discreet emails questioning whether the proposed change (amendment) suggests near-elimination of the two offices in that if the leadership of the subcommittees took over everything that action will drive the two top offices out of leading roles.

    Well, once the amendment is given full effect, the two offices, namely, the executive office and the presidency of the council, can busy themselves with carrying out the long awaited projects, like overthrowing Isayas government in one hour at EGAD and OAU as well as another project overthrowing Isayas government in one month in Europe leading into UN.

    For example, the ENCDC as the representative of the Eritrean people can represent Eritrea in EGAD. The push can be spearheaded by the Ethiopian government. What the leadership has to do is just submit it strongly worded and well-explained position to represent Eritrea in EGAD. This project can lead into OAU’s action to see Isayas’s government replaced by the representative of the people.

    Another project entitled “Dawit Isaak Project on save the Eritrean babies from drowning” can be sponsored by the Swedish government to displace Isayas’s embassies in Europe by ENCDC as the true representative of the Eritrean people. Just the two offices have to initiate their communication to build grounds for the project immediate and the overthrow in Europe will take no more than one month squeezing Isayas’s embassies out with the help of the Eritrean communities there.

    Thus, the two offices’ projects, unlike the Arab Spring, will be from outside to inside revolution of takeover to remove Isayas by getting recognition of a declared govt. in exile.

    • Hope

      T.T(aka Truth Teller–as babtized by Ethios).
      —–which is a De Facto way of changing a Regime by external Powers…..and the legitimacy issue pops up again.
      So IGAD,the AU and Ethiopia will change the Regime in Eritea..at least by Proxy….an AU and UN Member State.
      —-Council,Commission,Assembly,Representation—Gov in exile—the Somalia Style.etc—-back to square ONE.
      Nice dream and wish….
      And do you know who is changing or keeping those Officiers?
      Here is my question:
      is this a follow up Conference after the EFND or separate one?
      What I am afraid of,is that this could be another Winter or Summer Project so as to counter attack the EPDP,The Medrekh,the Crusadors,etc–unless all of the above are included with out preconditions and special criteria…
      I hope these entities are NOT “Unknown Entities”.
      Or is this a way of resucitating the hibernating NC/ENDC?
      Too many meetings,conferences,too many Groups,etc—-
      The way things are being done is a very “polariizng :One and this is contributing to the polarization of the Silent Majority.

      • T..T.

        Thanks Hope (of the People) for the insightful remark. FYI, the
        fragmentation of the opposition was caused by inaction as needed. When there was a possibility of overthrowing the one man government of Isayas is ten minutes, why take so long? Is the question of time by each group. Right move in
        the right direction will unite all the fragmented opposition groups and accordingly, EPDP and Medrekh will for
        surely join hands in the grand Eritrean projects of save Eritrea and the Eritrean people.

        • Hope

          Thanks T.T.

      • Saleh Johar

        Dear HOPE,

        Your comments are tempting.

        Don’t you think it is necessary to least learn the the basics of the topic before even considering commenting on it? I couldn’t resist replying to your question: “is this a follow up Conference after the EFND or separate one?”

        I urge you to google it and have a basic understanding about topics you need to criticize, comment on, etc. For now, let me volunteer, the ENCDC is a culmination of years of struggle which is as old as the Tyranny of the PFDJ and its boss.

        Have a nice trip to Ethiopia; but be careful! I have seen many people who are anti-Ethiopia hardliners mellow down after visiting there 🙂

        • Hope

          Selam We-Senay ,Mr. Saleh G Johar.
          Thanks for your advice and tips,Sir!
          -I was responding to T.T mainly.
          The few hiccups I expressed are a long standing concerns and I have no choice but “Tempt” you or provoke you to clarify issues.
          Here is my blunt stand:
          -We have had enough of this and that Group for the last ,what now?20 yrs you said ?But none is working and is functional.Why??
          Well,I should be optimistic for the effort ,but,hey,we have to be serious and realistic as “Enough is Enough”.
          Let us pull together ourselves and work hard and Practice what we preach.
          Having Conferences here and there is NOT our problem but stickting to our Principles and leaving aside our personal issues,interests,grudges,egos,etc— and walk the talk..
          I am sure you know where I am coming from.
          -Forgive in order to be forgiven!
          -Reconciliation and Raprochement NOW.
          NO worries about my Trip to Ethiopia…..I have plenty of time in the future when the right time comes…But thx for your honest advice,which I never expected that I colud “mellow down” simply for expressing my frustration…BTW,why would I trust the Tigreyans any way?

          • Rodab

            Everybody’s cousin Hope,
            With such a unique and sophisticated writing style, you have exhausted just about evey body. You’ve dominated mieda Awate.
            Folks,
            Let it be known that anyone who dares to challenge Hope will have a lot coming

          • Hope

            Thx Eng Rodab for the advice an dI stand corrected.
            I am a human being and I am only expressing my human being’s side.
            My apology to the Tigreyans here and every where in the world.
            Peace be unto you…

          • Haile Berhe

            Sophisticated writing? I don’t think so. Too many “I”s, not concise, lacks assertiveness, unduly long mostly grouping of words. The man is full of himself.

          • Hope

            Thanks Haile Berhe for your feedback and I will thrive to improve accordingly.
            But:
            I am not here to be a “sophisticated” commentor or debator but to express my opinion–be in an organized or disorganized manner.
            But guess what?
            If I have to,rest assured that,I can debate you and challenge you,any body for that matter,to death in any form,if we have to do it in a proper way,not in a random or hidden way–and NOT with my nick but with my full and real name, and with my appropriate Professionalism,etc—any where,any time and under any condition…!!!

          • Amanuel Hidrat

            Hope,
            You also promised to meet me face to face and you couldn’t avail. I don’t think you could unveil your masks and overcome your fears, what ever that fear might be. Why don’t keep your nickname, stay in your comfort zone, and stop this unrealistic challenge to come with real name and in a real world. Don’t promise something your guts can’t do. Don’t put yourself in a trouble. Again this is unsolicited advice.
            Amanuel Hidrat

          • hope

            Aman,
            There is NO problem but as I “promised”,I do not have any problem unveiling myself,which I already did,btw,some how-,which I will do-again-if needed.But I am NOT going to unveil myself so as to appease you or Abi et al..
            Rahwa and her Comrades also “threatened” me if I go to Ethiopia–,and SGJ,to his credit,advised me seriously NOT to be a victim of such and such,God forbid,which will justify the reason behind unveiling myself…further.
            And why would you and I worry about me unveiling or hiding myself in this infested Forum?
            The only thing I would “worry” is that I make sure that I do NOT violate the posting guidelines and affect negatively the “persona”..of any debator here.

          • Amanuel Hidrat

            Okay Hope,
            Then heed my advice to stay in your comfort zone that shields your fears. Pull graciously the challenge you put forward to Haile Berhe. You see Hope, know your limits and accept your fears that hinders you what you want to accomplish. Play your game within your limits, and don’t characterize yourself by excessive self-esteem that doesn’t match to your reality. If you do, it will only makes you pretentious. You know what I mean by that.

            Amanuel Hidrat

          • Hope

            Mr Aman Hidrat:
            No “grandiosity or self-esteem” business here.Oh no no,no need to be so…I will keep going with the flow and throw my gut feeling here and there…until Ustaz (Khadi)SGJ,Vet Mahmouday and/or Prof SAAY tell(s) me/warn(s) me NOT to do so..officially.
            Keep it to yourself that Ego of being ” The Prosecutor and the Judge” at the same time…or The “My way is the only High Way” approach….
            But I welcome any constructive criticism and positive feedback..
            This is an open froum,my man!!!

          • Amanuel Hidrat

            Hope,
            If you don’t want to pull your challenge against Haile for a live-debate in an open reality forum, my friend, then have the stamina to unveil yourself. That was your challenge by the way. I will set a stage for you and Haile Berhe in DC area where the largest Eritrean population resided. WoleQ ZeleQ Yelen. Keep your word and defeat your fears.
            Amanuel H.

          • Nitricc

            Hey Aman-H
            Is “WoleQ ZeleQ” Amharic or Tigrigna?

          • Amanuel Hidrat

            Nitrikay,

            Applicable in both languages. Don’t you know words are shared by different languages? Don’t you know Tigrigna and Amharic are from the same roots?

          • Abinet

            Ato Amanuel
            How about the people?

          • Amanuel Hidrat

            Hi Abinet,
            Yes of course they are both from the same mixed race of Hametic and semetics origins.

          • Hope

            Aman,
            Get a life and do some kumnegher….
            But I wil be there in few months,if NOT,at Washington DC Eri Festival and see you there.

          • Guest

            Hi Emma,

            Come on Emma!! Where were where you when Hayat Adem, Serray…were looking for your advise?

            cheers!

          • Amanuel Hidrat

            Hope,
            If you don’t want to pull your challenge against Haile for a live-debate in an open reality forum, my friend, then have the stamina to unveil yourself. That was your challenge by the way. I will set a stage for you and Haile Berhe in DC area where the largest Eritrean population resided. WoleQ ZeleQ Yelen. Keep your word and defeat your fears.
            Amanuel H.

          • Hope

            Pls read as:”the reason behind/not unveiling myself.

          • Guest

            AL Amanuel

            Why would any muslim meet a member of yosuf AFEND, unless he smoking pot?

          • Amanuel Hidrat

            Guest,
            What do you mean by that? Can you please elaborate. I don’t want to guess but ask SGJ if he is still on “yosuf AFEND” perception.

          • Guest

            Al Amanuel,

            You guessed it and you was right; therefore, I see no reason for elaboration. But you said “It has nothing to do with me.” what do you mean? Please disregard if you are distancing yourself from that spooky midget (intellectually) organization.

            cheers!

          • Amanuel Hidrat

            Guest,
            Humbleness and decency is paramount in our political discourse. Can you stop your insulting words even if the team open the door to you to do what you are doing. Respect is to yourself b/c it reciprocate itself instantly.
            Amanuel H.

          • Hope

            Again,
            Aman,if essential and “mandatory”,I do NOT see any problem unveiling myself.
            But why would I do it in this infested Forum?I reacted to Haile Berhe or Berhe Yohanes,etc– that I can challenge /debate him (and vice-versa), under any circumstance irrespective of my ” Writing” ability..or articulation—
            FYI: The AT know me and my inside and outside..as I let them do that since I Trust the Team.SGJ hinted you already.
            The only reason that I sometimes “step on their feet”(AT) is from that aspect……
            “Curiosity has killed the cat”..

          • Abinet

            Hope
            First thing first. Stay with one nick . So far you have used atleast 4 nicks by my count .
            Truth , Jemal, …
            Using multiple nicks only shows luck of confidence in yourself .

          • Hope

            Hahah,Abi–I did it “Officially” , with permission ,and legitimately and only God knows how many nicks you have been using..

          • Abinet

            Hope, hopeful, truth, Jemal …..
            ” yelbun sinegrut yekorekorutn yahil yasqewal ” yilal yagere sew .

          • Hope

            Abi:
            Define Confidence.
            Plus,you are dealing with Eritreans!
            Hope thiis helps.

          • Abinet

            Hope nefse
            It really helps a lot . Now I know who I deal with . ” Special people” from another planet.
            When you go to ethiopia tell them you are from a different planet called eritrea for a special treatment . You see those people in ethiopia have never met an eritrean so when they DEAL with you they may not be upto your expectation. Be mindful of that.
            Enjoy your time my cousin(1/4) Make sure to take real money with you not the Monopoly money that you count in billions in this forum. And in ethiopia, number starts with 1 not with a million. So when you talk about billion here billion there , you will confuse them.
            Take care .

          • Hope

            Zim bel guregna,gheder yikorkorka..Kumnegher albo “Detective” huneh kerreh aidele?
            Use that Brain for good,man.
            Nothing is new about changing nicks….BTW,were you one of the few,who were abusing my nick.
            Truth,who???
            You also missed—-“Sofia,Araya,etc-“-as these were my nicks too–per Ermi??

          • Abraham Hanibal

            Mr. Hope;
            With all due respect, don’t act as if you are for a democratic change in Eritrea. Who do you think would be misguided by your fake stance? Your words and actions speak for you that you’wd rather like to see Eritreans be ruled by one of the world’s worst dictators than creating a democratic government that would respect the rights of its citizens. The fact that you support the PFDJ by paying the 2% tax, and your fatal efforts of defending the regime at all costs to your own fellow citizens says it all.

          • Hope

            Sir,
            I would adore you if,as we speak,kidnap the PFDJ and PIA and bring change in Eritrea.
            My point:
            Talking alone will NOT bring change.
            I aint talk for the sake of talking–I am saying that we need to be more realistic,more organized,more practical,more united and walk the talk.
            Nothing personal is taken or given ,Mr Abreham.
            N.B.
            I repeatedly clarified myself as to why I try to pay 2% of the Rehab Tax 3—4 yrs behind though.
            I repeatedly confessed that I was the worst victimof the PFDJ-despite beingan ex-PFDJ and even an ex-EPLF–no self-grandiosity here.
            I repeatedly stated my stand –beinga Student of Prof SAAY and Vet Mahmoud Saleh.
            I call a spade,a spade
            I give credit to where it belongs and to those ,who deserve it,including the PFDJ/GoE
            I challenge and criticize those who should be,incluidng the PFDJ and the GoE,the Awatistas
            I believe in Proper National Reconciliation and Raproachement
            I believe in Real and I beilieve in Open Dialog
            I try to express my gut feeling,no matter what–be it right or wrong –but I believe in Constructive Criticism..
            etc—
            I would go on but I do not believe in Perfection but thrive to learn more and to improve.

        • sami

          Why is awate labeling potential newcomers as winter project at the same time encouraging old losers to do what they have done, but terribly failed, again and again. Cant Awate think outside that basket of moslem/christian issue? Ironically, you also have advised ENDC not to spend time expanding the their gathering and allowing others to join. Who will join ENDC, who spend discussing as long as a week on matters that are not important or non issues the current plight of the people. These guys are not reconciled with themselves let alone with each other. They are just there, in Addis, to get that benefit they get from Sen’a forum (denominated to ethiopia). Infact most of them are double welfare collectors (nay adey amete). They are either retired or unfit in their country of citizenship (EU/US/Canada/Australia) earning some welfare support from their respective government. At the same time they are on payrolls of Ethiopian government. That is why they all spend their time attacking each other.

  • Tesfabirhan WR

    Dear Awatawyan,

    I know not only your great mind but your kind heart too and that is why I am posting it here.

    *——————————————————-

    A Christmas Fund raising campaign

    ======================
    “Extending hands to those who really are looking your kindness is more than giving a new life.”

    A penny is meant thousands to refugees stranded in Sudanese and Ethiopian camps.

    ========================*

    We are campaigning to raise funds to support Eritrean refugee kids and youth in refugee camps in Ethiopia and Sudan. We took this initiative believing in your support and generosity. Let’s appropriate this cause and challenge our friends and families to contribute even a small amount and to share the information with all our networks.

    Sharing is Caring!!!

    You can use one of the following alternatives to donate to the cause.

    Bank name: SparebankenVest
    Account holder : St. Paul Menighet/Eritrea
    Account number: 36333137660
    BIC/SWIFT: SPAVNOBB
    IBAN: NO0536333137660

    Paypal line: https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_s-xclick&hosted_button_id=LUJ8EYEVFHXUU

    For more information please see attached files. I would like to thank you in advance for your support and contribution.

    Yours!

    For more information, you can also contact Dr. Nazareth Amlesom from Norway

    Hawkum
    tes

    • Hope

      Tes,
      Out of curiosity,are you affiliated to /with an Eri-Swiss NGO based in Geneva,helping the Shegereb Refugees and the School or a different one?

      • Tesfabirhan WR

        Selam Hope,

        Very good question. first, I am affiliated to any group who is concerned with Eritrean problems except PFDJ.

        And concerning this campaign, for more information, you can access Dr. Nazareth Amlesom’s FB address. It is all rounded campaign by concerned Eritreans and international community. You can take your share in making this campaign successful the same as I am doing.

        Thank you!

        Huka
        tes

        • Hope

          Will do ,Sir….I think it is good that we are starting to walk the “Talk”.
          I requested a similar “Campaign ” about our Youth in Israel…but—
          keep it up.
          God bless you.

  • Hope

    Addendum:
    #1:
    That the NC and its members,should avoid or should NOT allow any external interference in any form and its agenda should focus on “Resolving Eritrean problems by Eritreans and with Eritrean Solutions”.

  • Mahmud Saleh

    Dear AT;
    An editorial worth expectation, a timely opinion worth Awate’s prestige. You have done your part as a leading media organization, let’s hope members of ENCDC do what’s expected of them.

  • T..T.

    Thanks Awate for the good news.

    Here’s what most of the people noted. Over-supervision by top offices led to stifling decision making and causing resentments. And, the two top offices: Executive Office and Presidency of the Council failed to take ownership of failures and as well could not harmonize their actions to enhance the big picture.

    In order to minimize future risks of conflicts, corrective measures should be taken to let the subcommittees take rotating leadership on quarterly basis. In case of emergencies, the leadership of the subcommittees, in lieu of rotational leadership, should be guided by relevance of issue, situation and task. Once decision is made, it is reported to the top offices for no objection decisions and approval of the needed resources.